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Project 25 Standard

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I am quite new to the scanning world. I live in michigan and was going to program a trunked system into my scanner. The trunked system I am going to program is the MPSCS system, which is a project 25 standard type system. My scanner is the uniden BCT8 and the type of trunked systems it offers in the owners manual are these; motorola type 2 (800Mhz), motorola type 2 (136-174Mhz), motorola type 2 (406-512Mhz), motorola type 1 and hybrid, LTR and edacs wide band and edacs scat.

What is project 25? where can I find information to educate myself on this system, and can I use any of the above mentioned types my scanner offers to monitor project 25 standard? Given that all the freqeuncies on MPSCS are within the 800Mhz range, I tried the motorola type II 800Mhz, yet nothing.
 

hiegtx

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silentwhistler said:
I am quite new to the scanning world. I live in michigan and was going to program a trunked system into my scanner. The trunked system I am going to program is the MPSCS system, which is a project 25 standard type system. My scanner is the uniden BCT8 and the type of trunked systems it offers in the owners manual are these; motorola type 2 (800Mhz), motorola type 2 (136-174Mhz), motorola type 2 (406-512Mhz), motorola type 1 and hybrid, LTR and edacs wide band and edacs scat.

What is project 25? where can I find information to educate myself on this system, and can I use any of the above mentioned types my scanner offers to monitor project 25 standard? Given that all the freqeuncies on MPSCS are within the 800Mhz range, I tried the motorola type II 800Mhz, yet nothing.
Project 25 (also called APCO-25) is a fully digital system. None of the available system types on your BCT-8 would work. You need a digital scanner.

To monitor MPSCS, you'd need (base/mobile models) one of these: Uniden BC796D or BCD996T, or Radio Shack's Pro-2096. Handhelds: Uniden BCD396T or BC296D, or Radio Shack Pro-96. The Uniden BC296D & BC796D are both discontinued, but still available from a few dealers, on Ebay, and occasionally in the for sale forum here.
 

n1das

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hiegtx said:
Project 25 (also called APCO-25) is a fully digital system. None of the available system types on your BCT-8 would work. You need a digital scanner.

To monitor MPSCS, you'd need (base/mobile models) one of these: Uniden BC796D or BCD996T, or Radio Shack's Pro-2096. Handhelds: Uniden BCD396T or BC296D, or Radio Shack Pro-96. The Uniden BC296D & BC796D are both discontinued, but still available from a few dealers, on Ebay, and occasionally in the for sale forum here.
The BCT-8 should still be able to trunk track the transmissions on the system. The system's trunking format and APCO-25 are two different things. People often get the two confused.

What will be heard on a non-digital scanner that does trunk tracking is blasts of raw APCO-25 data instead of analog voice audio. The APCO-25 data is the digitized audio. You need a digital scanner to decode the APCO-25 data back into analog audio.
 

seamusg

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silentwhistler said:
I am quite new to the scanning world. I live in michigan and was going to program a trunked system into my scanner. The trunked system I am going to program is the MPSCS system, which is a project 25 standard type system. My scanner is the uniden BCT8 and the type of trunked systems it offers in the owners manual are these; motorola type 2 (800Mhz), motorola type 2 (136-174Mhz), motorola type 2 (406-512Mhz), motorola type 1 and hybrid, LTR and edacs wide band and edacs scat.

What is project 25? where can I find information to educate myself on this system, and can I use any of the above mentioned types my scanner offers to monitor project 25 standard? Given that all the freqeuncies on MPSCS are within the 800Mhz range, I tried the motorola type II 800Mhz, yet nothing.
The system you want project 25 standard type system is all digital and your scanner can't receive digital. The scanners listed in the above posts can. Also note digital scanners are all around $500.
 

rattlerbb01

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n1das said:
The BCT-8 should still be able to trunk track the transmissions on the system. The system's trunking format and APCO-25 are two different things. People often get the two confused.

What will be heard on a non-digital scanner that does trunk tracking is blasts of raw APCO-25 data instead of analog voice audio. The APCO-25 data is the digitized audio. You need a digital scanner to decode the APCO-25 data back into analog audio.
Still wrong. Unless you have a digital scanner capable of decoding the 9600 bps DIGITAL control channel, you will not trunk track a Project 25 system. Only the scanners listed by "hiegtx" will track this system. The system type you would be referring to that a BCT-8 would track are 3600 bps analog control channels with digital/analog talkgroups. If a system is listed as Project 25, it has a digital 9600 bps control channel and all traffic is in P25 digital mode.
 

seamusg

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n1das said:
The BCT-8 should still be able to trunk track the transmissions on the system. The system's trunking format and APCO-25 are two different things. People often get the two confused.

What will be heard on a non-digital scanner that does trunk tracking is blasts of raw APCO-25 data instead of analog voice audio. The APCO-25 data is the digitized audio. You need a digital scanner to decode the APCO-25 data back into analog audio.
It looks like you've never delt with a Project 25 system. Unless the scanner is digital it cannot track it or receive the audio. This post is not about a mixed mode system.
On a P25 system ALL transmission are digital
 

loumaag

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seamusg said:
On a P25 system ALL transmission are digital
While this is true, try to be a bit more explanatory.

On a Motorola system, the CCh is digital but operates at 3600 bps, whereas on a Project 25 system (as was mentioned earlier) the CCh is a 9600 bps data stream. So a trunking scanner that is capable of following a Motorola system does not mean it can trunk track a Project 25 system.

Mixed mode deals with the voice modulation mode used on the system. A mixed mode indicates analog and digital is used, and of course this precludes it being a Project 25 system since (as seamusg points out) all transmissions on a P25 system are digital by definition. Please note that if a Motorola Type II (3600 bps CCh) is using P25 modulation it may use it in mixed mode or 100% of the system may be using digital modulation. The State of South Dakota TRS is an example of just such a system.
 

seamusg

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loumaag said:
While this is true, try to be a bit more explanatory.

On a Motorola system, the CCh is digital but operates at 3600 bps, whereas on a Project 25 system (as was mentioned earlier) the CCh is a 9600 bps data stream. So a trunking scanner that is capable of following a Motorola system does not mean it can trunk track a Project 25 system.

Mixed mode deals with the voice modulation mode used on the system. A mixed mode indicates analog and digital is used, and of course this precludes it being a Project 25 system since (as seamusg points out) all transmissions on a P25 system are digital by definition. Please note that if a Motorola Type II (3600 bps CCh) is using P25 modulation it may use it in mixed mode or 100% of the system may be using digital modulation. The State of South Dakota TRS is an example of just such a system.
The origional post said he wanted to monitor the Michigan MPSCS system, which is project 25 standard, the BCT8 will not work on it and N1DAS we are not confused, the system is a true P25 system. It has a 9600 bps CC and the talk groups are in a different format than a MOT II system. On a project 25 standard systems TG's go from 1 to 65000 in increments of 1 not 16 and there are no status bits. MPSCS is a very large state wide system, with many of the counties and towns converted to it, with more being add all the time. The origional poster said he lives in Michigan , although his profile says Denver, Co. Also HIEGTX did give the link to the WIKI for project 25 standard systems.
 
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Thanks for all the help, that pretty much points me in the right direction. I lived in denver when I first got an account on radio reference, and recently moved to michigan a couple months back.
 
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