• To anyone looking to acquire commercial radio programming software:

    Please do not make requests for copies of radio programming software which is sold (or was sold) by the manufacturer for any monetary value. All requests will be deleted and a forum infraction issued. Making a request such as this is attempting to engage in software piracy and this forum cannot be involved or associated with this activity. The same goes for any private transaction via Private Message. Even if you attempt to engage in this activity in PM's we will still enforce the forum rules. Your PM's are not private and the administration has the right to read them if there's a hint to criminal activity.

    If you are having trouble legally obtaining software please state so. We do not want any hurt feelings when your vague post is mistaken for a free request. It is YOUR responsibility to properly word your request.

    To obtain Motorola software see the Sticky in the Motorola forum.

    The various other vendors often permit their dealers to sell the software online (i.e., Kenwood). Please use Google or some other search engine to find a dealer that sells the software. Typically each series or individual radio requires its own software package. Often the Kenwood software is less than $100 so don't be a cheapskate; just purchase it.

    For M/A Com/Harris/GE, etc: there are two software packages that program all current and past radios. One package is for conventional programming and the other for trunked programming. The trunked package is in upwards of $2,500. The conventional package is more reasonable though is still several hundred dollars. The benefit is you do not need multiple versions for each radio (unlike Motorola).

    This is a large and very visible forum. We cannot jeopardize the ability to provide the RadioReference services by allowing this activity to occur. Please respect this.

Provoice TG on P7100 with no audio?

Status
Not open for further replies.

TDR-94

Member
Joined
Mar 30, 2014
Messages
448
Came across something strange with my P7100.

What does it mean when a TG that usually comes up as a Provoice TG doesn't have any audio output? The P7100 indicates that it is receiving ( little antenna icon ) activity on the TG and that it is digital( D icon),but no audio is being output from the radio and no indication of LID's. There is no garbled encrypted audio being output either.

Could this be VGE or AEGIS being used on the TG?
 

Radioman96p71

Member
Feed Provider
Joined
Jan 11, 2008
Messages
1,049
Location
Polk County, IA
Most likely the wrong format (AEGIS instead of PV) I've found when its the other way around (PV instead of AEGIS) it makes very noticeable pops and clicks as it tries to sync. Encrypted has a VERY obvious sound i'm sure you know. The other option is an incorrect RX address. I don't think I've ever seen one changed from the default in the wild but when I was testing between my radios, changing the TX value has the same effect as selecting an incorrect vocoder.
 

TDR-94

Member
Joined
Mar 30, 2014
Messages
448
Yeah, the radio would not unmute on that TG.I thought it was not really possible to use AEGIS on the fly if the TG is set up for Provoice?

The TG has come up before as Provoice and was clearly monitorable before.
 

Radioman96p71

Member
Feed Provider
Joined
Jan 11, 2008
Messages
1,049
Location
Polk County, IA
The trunking system doesn't care if it is ProVoice or AEGIS, in fact they use the same modulation to send the bits, its just the vocoder that is different. On my local system they use AEGIS/PV a lot, even on the same talkgroup tho not at the same time.
 

TDR-94

Member
Joined
Mar 30, 2014
Messages
448
Hmm...

That might be what's going on with this talkgroup,PV and AEGIS being used.I'll have to see what happens when it comes up again.All the other PV TG's haven't shown that behavior though.
 

HarrisRF

Member
Joined
Jun 12, 2007
Messages
57
Location
Lancaster, Pa
was there only one PTT, or multiple PTTs with no audio? Did another PV group unmute the speaker at the time in question like the bad TG did? Was it a console or another radio you were listening to?
 

TDR-94

Member
Joined
Mar 30, 2014
Messages
448
OK, so The TG in question came up again today and it was the same behavior.The radio does not unmute,there are no LID's being displayed and you can see that there is activity on the TG because the receive 'antenna' icon comes up, just as it does with normal conversation activity.

To answer your questions HarrisRF, there is indication of multiple PTT's back and forth on the P7170 I'm using indicated by the receive icon activity.I've received Provoice activity on the other TG's I have in the radio with no problem.
 

HarrisRF

Member
Joined
Jun 12, 2007
Messages
57
Location
Lancaster, Pa
Is this a Site pro or a getc trunked system?
Are you a registered user on the system, or are you monitoring the trunk channels through conventional mode? It sounds like you missed the high-speed data acquisition and late call entry either is not working or you are not monitoring the control channel.

Next time it happens hold in your clear/monitor button and see what your receiver is hearing. (Button above PTT usually)

Ive seen certain radio code that has the same problem. Have you upgraded code recently?
 
Last edited:

ElroyJetson

Member
Joined
Sep 8, 2002
Messages
2,524
Location
Florida, where you wish you were!
I've actually seen the exact same thing on one of my own P7100s, with latest firmware (J2R18-something and F9-something DSP) programmed in trunking mode but with no affiliation and all talkgroups TX inhibited.

It happens so rarely that I have not been able to gather additional data on the problem.

If I caught this problem 'in the act' then I will try to use the site statistics features of the FCC menu to determine if, maybe, the problem is related to ProVoice activity occuring on a specific repeater. And then watch that repeater for additional traffic and read the frequency error out for that repeater.

I'm going to guess that one or more repeaters is far enough off frequency relative to the receiving radio's own reference frequency that it may cause decoding problems.

But that would not indicate a system problem, necessarily. It may be something as simple as the repeater being within spec but a bit off frequency, and the radio also being in spec (or close) but it may be off frequency in the other direction.

I would also take a VERY close look at the logical channel list(s) and be on the lookout for a channel that is incorrectly entered in the list. The last time I had an issue with missed calls, I found that one of the channels in the logical channel list was entered as 8xx.1250 when the correct value was 8xx.1125.

I will note that I BELIEVE that the radio will be more sensitive to a frequency error in ProVoice mode than in clear mode. Thus, the problem, if it IS a small frequency error, might not appear on an analog transmission while still causing problems in ProVoice.

So it'd miss every single time that logical channel number was called up. Simple, logical, easy to fix once you know what to do.

I didn't quite trust the published frequency assignments for the local sites so I went to the FCC ULS database, did a geosearch at the tower site, and got the whole list of site frequencies. That positively identifed the frequency error.

I could also set up a spectrum analyzer near the tower site and capture every operating frequency as they come up, but that's tedious work when you're trying to identify the actual transmit frequencies of 20 repeaters.
 

HarrisRF

Member
Joined
Jun 12, 2007
Messages
57
Location
Lancaster, Pa
@elroy
Latest code has an issue in conventional. We were unable to monitor p25 trunked channels in york county pa in conventional mode with the latest code. TAC has been made aware and engineers are working on it.
 

TDR-94

Member
Joined
Mar 30, 2014
Messages
448
I'm monitoring a trunked EDACS analog system which uses some PV TG's programmed as a trunk system in the radio. That TG came up again today and this time umuted PV audio came through just like normal with LID's.Nothing has been changed on the radio.No other TG's have exhibited this behaviour. I was leaning towards the possible AEGIS being used mentioned earlier.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top