RadioID assignments in trunking

[JoeyC]

My question has to do with RadioIDs as reported by scanners. I have recently begun tracking the RadioIDs of the dispatch consoles of the various agencies I listen to and have discovered that there are many, many, many more IDs than I expected.

One police department with a population of about 250,000 has, from what I have logged so far, a range of almost 100 RadioIDs and in my short time logging them, (about 10 days over the last month) have 12 confirmed IDs for the dispatcher of this medium sized city.

The county (population 3millionish) has a range of dispatch IDs almost 1000 wide, and I've logged 46 IDs for the dispatch channels which usually consists of 6 or 7 main channel dispatchers and an Inquiry and Court Services dispatcher.

Why is it that one day someone sitting at a dispatch position will be on a specific ID and over the next few days (or even hours in the same day) change so many times? Does each headset or microphone have its own ID or is it based on the users log in? From what I understand, the portable radios and mobiles installed in vehicles don't fluctuate, so whats the secret at the dispatch consoles?

 

[GTR8000]

Each console has a unique ID. Are you seeing a pattern of certain dispatch ID's linked to certain TG's? What type of system is it, P25? 12 consoles for a medium sized dispatch center wouldn't be unheard of, and if you are seeing certain ID's almost always on particular TG's, they probably have certain consoles primarily dedicated to certain functions/TG's.

 

[scannerfreak]

In short, and nowhere near technical terms. This is what I've seen while in my local dispatch center hanging out and from monitoring.

The dispatch consoles have multiple talkgroup positions on the screen (number of positions varies by setup I'm not sure the limit on each console model). Each of the talkgroup positions has it's own radio ID. The dispatcher can assign any of the available talkgroups to any position as they see fit. I believe the reason each position has it's own radio ID is so they can hear traffic on those other talkgroups even when keyed up on one of the talkgroups? It's like having multiple radios in one.

For instance, my County dispatch centers SAFE-T console has 5 available talkgroup positions per console. They can place any one of the programmed talkgroups into any of the 5 positions. So just for an example, say the 5 positions 1-5 are assigned radio ID's 1-5. If they have the fire talkgroup assigned to position 1, you'll see radio ID 1 when they key up. If they assign the fire talkgroup to position 3, you'll see radio ID 3 and so on..

Around here some of the dispatchers like to have the talkgroup positions set up in their own way, so some days I'll see different radio ID's on the various different talkgroups. I can watch Unitrunker at dispatcher shift change and see the talkgroup affiliations change on all the various console radio ID's.

In a major metro dispatch center with a bunch of consoles they could serve multiple purposes on any given day. So one day or shift one set of radio ID's on one console may be dispatching fire and the very next day or shift it could be used to dispatch police, etc.

Maybe someone will explain it in a more technical manner or correct me if I am wrong Have fun logging the ID's. It's very addictive. I currently have 7,474 SAFE-T ID's.

 

[JoeyC]

Scannerfreak I think you are right on. With each physical workstation, there is a separate ID for each talkgroup that the workstation can pull up. So if there are 3 work stations and 5 talkgroups that are used by the agency, there is a potential for 15 unique IDs. Would be nice for one of the technical types to confirm or explain.

 

[SCPD]

I monitor Richmond, CA PD and FD. They recently moved over to EBRCS, a new P25 system. They have a central dispatch center who dispatch not only for Richmond, but also El Cerrito, San Pablo, and Kensington.

According to EBRCSA, six new MCC7500 consoles were installed in the dispatch center. I have logged exactly six IDs associated with the dispatchers, 4282000 - 4282005.

You can hear and see the dispatchers come up on different TGs with the same ID.

My point is that I'd imagine options relating to radio IDs can be configured in various ways and could be very different from system to system.

 

[WayneH]

SD City started out in the '90s with their system. The same console RID scheme has been in place since then. Given about twenty years has past what's taught, or encouraged, by Moto has changed. This is not the only system I've seen who does this (they've since transitioned to P25 trunking).

I've always liked it as it hinted to what was programmed in the consoles.

We're also talking about a department that used to allow MultiSelects to broadcast each TG to a unique channel. Thankfully they finally changed how that was done, and it wasn't too long ago!

 

[JoeyC]

I was referring to the RCS Wayne, but the same applies to the city system. Are you sure that the city system multi-select still isn't functioning with each TG on a unique channel? Seems like that is something that I've noticed when dispatchers are giving a BOLO (or the infamous end of watch roast when someone retires) and simulcasting on multiple channels, each TG is on a different frequency. I thought that the intelligent method would be that one frequency is utilized and the audio could be spread across multiple TGs. That seems like efficient use of channels instead of tying up 6 or 7 freqs in a 20 channel trunked system. But what do I know.

 

[trumpetman]

A little unrelated tidbit of knowledge. Type II systems require a RID for each position and each talkgroup.

5 positions, 4 talkgroups = 20 RIDs for a single agency.

Newer systems using the MCC7500 consoles, wired directly into the P25 systems, each console only has 1 RID.

 

[WayneH]

I was referring to the RCS Wayne, but the same applies to the city system. Are you sure that the city system multi-select still isn't functioning with each TG on a unique channel? Seems like that is something that I've noticed when dispatchers are giving a BOLO (or the infamous end of watch roast when someone retires) and simulcasting on multiple channels, each TG is on a different frequency.

I could have sworn they updated that method; I even think there was a thread on here (in CA) about it. It's been a few years now since I've watched the system so I may have twisted a few memories. But you are right, it can go either way and I'm not sure why they still retain their old inefficient method even with the recent dispatch upgrades.

Anyhow, Trumpetman covers it succinctly.