• To anyone looking to acquire commercial radio programming software:

    Please do not make requests for copies of radio programming software which is sold (or was sold) by the manufacturer for any monetary value. All requests will be deleted and a forum infraction issued. Making a request such as this is attempting to engage in software piracy and this forum cannot be involved or associated with this activity. The same goes for any private transaction via Private Message. Even if you attempt to engage in this activity in PM's we will still enforce the forum rules. Your PM's are not private and the administration has the right to read them if there's a hint to criminal activity.

    If you are having trouble legally obtaining software please state so. We do not want any hurt feelings when your vague post is mistaken for a free request. It is YOUR responsibility to properly word your request.

    To obtain Motorola software see the Sticky in the Motorola forum.

    The various other vendors often permit their dealers to sell the software online (i.e., Kenwood). Please use Google or some other search engine to find a dealer that sells the software. Typically each series or individual radio requires its own software package. Often the Kenwood software is less than $100 so don't be a cheapskate; just purchase it.

    For M/A Com/Harris/GE, etc: there are two software packages that program all current and past radios. One package is for conventional programming and the other for trunked programming. The trunked package is in upwards of $2,500. The conventional package is more reasonable though is still several hundred dollars. The benefit is you do not need multiple versions for each radio (unlike Motorola).

    This is a large and very visible forum. We cannot jeopardize the ability to provide the RadioReference services by allowing this activity to occur. Please respect this.

RDS transmission on Baofeng UV-5R

Status
Not open for further replies.

philm001

Member
Joined
Mar 17, 2017
Messages
5
Hello all,

I recently purchased 2 Baofeng UV-5R radios and I am looking to connect them up for repeater functionality. For example, I am going to be connecting them wirelessly by setting the Rx of one to 106.2 and the Tx to 440.4. The second unit will have a Rx set to 440.4 and the Tx to be 106.2. This will function as a wireless repeater (I only need a one way repeater for my application).

My question is this, are the radios capable of repeating the RDS?

I am using the FM RDS to control a device. And I would like to extend the range of my transmitter. (It is currently a little tiny ADAfruit transmitter (https://www.adafruit.com/product/1958)
 

jwt873

Member
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Dec 1, 2015
Messages
1,063
Location
Woodlands, MB
As far as I know, the UV-5R can't transmit on 106.2 Mhz.

Even if it could, it's not capable of the +/- 75 Khz bandwidth used by commercial FM stations. The UV-5R can only transmit narrow band FM (+/- 5Khz).
 

KD8DVR

Member
Joined
Apr 11, 2004
Messages
1,188
Location
Columbus, Ohio
106 Mhz is not in the amateur radio band. It is illegal to transmit there. 440 is in the amateur radio band. A license is required to transmit there.

AntiSquid Disclaimer: All posted content is personal opinion only and may not imply fact or accusation.
 

Sconnick

Member
Joined
Mar 5, 2014
Messages
82
Well...

The legality has been touched upon.

The equipment limitation has been touched upon.

I think that's it!
 

philm001

Member
Joined
Mar 17, 2017
Messages
5
Hello all,

thank you for your replies.

please note that I was simply using those frequencies as an example. I am mainly looking at the hardware limitations to see if the radio transmitters could repeat the FM wave with RDS.

I picked those frequencies because these are the first ones that came up in my mind. I apologize for any confusion.

If the UV-5R is unable to repeat the RDS, could anyone recommend some repeaters that can re-transmit the RDS?

(For anyone wondering, I am working for someone that does in fact have a radio liscense)
 

SCPD

QRT
Joined
Feb 24, 2001
Messages
0
Location
Virginia
None of this will work anyhow.
Transmit is 136-174 and 400-512MHZ.
It does not decode RDS.
It does not transmit 106.2 at all nor will it ever.
Any 5 watt walkie talkie is a bad idea for a repeater of any kind.
 

philm001

Member
Joined
Mar 17, 2017
Messages
5
You need an Radio Encoder for RDS.
The adaFruit transmitter that I am using already comes with an RDS encoder built in. I am wondering if there is an FM repeater that is capable of repeating FM and the RDS transmission. Or is it better to utilize an amplifier.
 

chief21

Member
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Mar 2, 2004
Messages
1,419
Location
Summer - Western NC; Winter - Tampa Bay FL
Simply put, a FM broadcast transmission, which contains the RDS information within, requires a very high-bandwidth signal. A two-way FM radio, either commercial land mobile or amateur, is designed to operate with a much lower-bandwidth signal and does not have the capability to transmit a broadcast-compatible signal. The same is true of land mobile or amateur repeaters.
 

mmckenna

I ♥ Ø
Joined
Jul 27, 2005
Messages
14,728
Location
SNCZCA01DS0
The adaFruit transmitter that I am using already comes with an RDS encoder built in. I am wondering if there is an FM repeater that is capable of repeating FM and the RDS transmission. Or is it better to utilize an amplifier.
Maybe if you described exactly what you want to do in some more detail, we could make some recommendations. There are likely ways to do what you want, but with the limited information you've provided, all we'd be doing is guessing.

In other words, the details are important, as is what sort of licenses you have, where you are located, etc.
 

philm001

Member
Joined
Mar 17, 2017
Messages
5
Maybe if you described exactly what you want to do in some more detail, we could make some recommendations. There are likely ways to do what you want, but with the limited information you've provided, all we'd be doing is guessing.

In other words, the details are important, as is what sort of licenses you have, where you are located, etc.
Sure thing, I am not 100% sure what kind of license our client has (I am developing this project for a client) but I do know they can handle 5 W are are located in Toledo, Ohio.

I am primarily using the RDS in order to control a device which is capable of recording an FM broadcast into memory. There are additional functions that the device can perform with RDS but the main purpose is for recording an FM broadcast. Maximum time is 30 sec of recording.

So primarily we are developing this for RDS control.
 

wyShack

Member
Joined
Nov 18, 2008
Messages
436
Location
Campbell County, Wyoming
philM001-

RDS information is actually on a sub-carrier of the FM broadcast station. Any 'repeater' you can get "off the shelf' is unlikely to repeat the sub-carrier. Also few if any 'off the shelve' units will handle the FM stereo sub-carrier. As already mentioned, a better description of the problem (general parameters, data ect) will help in finding a solution.
 

mmckenna

I ♥ Ø
Joined
Jul 27, 2005
Messages
14,728
Location
SNCZCA01DS0
So, I guess I'm not understanding something...

Why are you trying to repeat an FM broadcast signal? Why don't you just receive the broadcast signal, decode the RDS and use it as is? The extra radios in the middle are confusing me as to their purpose.
 

philm001

Member
Joined
Mar 17, 2017
Messages
5
The FM broadcast is coming from our adaFruit transmitter and we would like to extend the range through a repeater.

The adaFruit transmitter only gives us about 20 - 30 feet.
 

mmckenna

I ♥ Ø
Joined
Jul 27, 2005
Messages
14,728
Location
SNCZCA01DS0
Ah, OK, now that makes sense.

So, there are ways to do this, figuring out which one is right is up to you:
1. FCC does Experimental Licenses. That might be an option. It would let you transmit on FM broadcast band, or somewhere close by.
2. Use a long coax run. I know, probably not what you want to hear.
3. You mentioned the company is allowed up to 5 watts? I'd research that and get some clarification.
4. If the company's license allows that, look at what the limit is. Is it 5 watts transmitter output, or 5 watts ERP? If it's 5 watts ERP, then you are stuck with that. If it's 5 watts TPO and there's no limitation on antenna gain, then you can try higher gain antennas to boost coverage.

As others have stated, the amount of bandwidth you need and the ability to handle the subcarriers is going to pretty much limit you to using transmitters designed for the FM broadcast band.
 

jonwienke

More Info Coming Soon!
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Jul 18, 2014
Messages
13,083
Location
VA
Not possible. Or legal.

FM stereo broadcast has a much wider channel width than what the Baofeng will handle. You can't repeat a 200KHz-wide broadcast channel through a radio that only does maximum 25KHz-wide channels. Your RDS subcarrier will be lost, and your audio frequency response will be limited to about 300-3000Hz mono, rather than 20-20,000Hz stereo.

Also, there are strict limits on power levels for unlicensed use of FM stereo broadcast frequencies.

You're limited to a range of 200 feet:
https://www.fcc.gov/media/radio/low-power-radio-general-information

https://transition.fcc.gov/bureaus/oet/info/documents/bulletins/oet63/oet63rev.pdf
Note the table on page 15.
 

Your_account

Completely Banned for the Greater Good
Banned
Joined
Jul 13, 2013
Messages
1,261
Location
.AT
The adaFruit transmitter only gives us about 20 - 30 feet.
oke and how big is your feet?!
Ok its is not cheap but maybe with an SDR?
 

16b

Member
Joined
Feb 28, 2004
Messages
482
Location
Central Ohio
Sounds like an interesting project, and those little Adafruit boards are neat. Might have to buy me one to play with.

One option for increased coverage would be to have several FM transmitters throughout your desired coverage area, and simulcast your messages on all of them. Of course this would require them to be networked together in some way.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top