• To anyone looking to acquire commercial radio programming software:

    Please do not make requests for copies of radio programming software which is sold (or was sold) by the manufacturer for any monetary value. All requests will be deleted and a forum infraction issued. Making a request such as this is attempting to engage in software piracy and this forum cannot be involved or associated with this activity. The same goes for any private transaction via Private Message. Even if you attempt to engage in this activity in PM's we will still enforce the forum rules. Your PM's are not private and the administration has the right to read them if there's a hint to criminal activity.

    If you are having trouble legally obtaining software please state so. We do not want any hurt feelings when your vague post is mistaken for a free request. It is YOUR responsibility to properly word your request.

    To obtain Motorola software see the Sticky in the Motorola forum.

    The various other vendors often permit their dealers to sell the software online (i.e., Kenwood). Please use Google or some other search engine to find a dealer that sells the software. Typically each series or individual radio requires its own software package. Often the Kenwood software is less than $100 so don't be a cheapskate; just purchase it.

    For M/A Com/Harris/GE, etc: there are two software packages that program all current and past radios. One package is for conventional programming and the other for trunked programming. The trunked package is in upwards of $2,500. The conventional package is more reasonable though is still several hundred dollars. The benefit is you do not need multiple versions for each radio (unlike Motorola).

    This is a large and very visible forum. We cannot jeopardize the ability to provide the RadioReference services by allowing this activity to occur. Please respect this.

Repeater install for HT750 VHF

Status
Not open for further replies.

joncap

Member
Joined
May 17, 2014
Messages
2
Location
Austin, Texas
Hey everyone,
I'm a seasoned user of two-way radios but I have never installed or administered them and now I find myself as the SME for getting our comms up. I am the IT guy (as well as other things) and need help setting up oour system.

The person who ordered equipment has long left the site and I am trying to get things sorted out. I have 18 HT750s and a site I am trying to cover (about 2.3 mile radius). The radios I have are VHF and I have two Tx frequencies and two Rx frequencies.

The point-to-point is not adequate so I need equipment to boost the comms. I'm assuming this is a repeater and an antenna, along with a good amount of cable and a power source.

First question I have:
1. Do I need a Motorola-branded repeater? These are a little hard to find and very expensive where I am. (I'm working overseas). Will other brands work as long as they are VHF?

2. What other equipment do I need? I've read maybe a duplexer?

3. Will CPS allow me to program the Motorola repeater to the frequencies I have or do I need something else? If another brand will work with the HT750s, is programming similar to using CPS to program a radio? From a macro perspective, manufacturer provides software, I install, connect repeater and enter specs, done.

These questions will get me a loong way to implementing a solution. Thanks!

Jon
 

ronenp

Member
Joined
May 8, 2002
Messages
515
If the radios are conventional Every repeater (not only Motorola) will do the job for U

As for CPS if the repeater is Of Motorola the associated CPS that come with it will be needed to program it

A Duplexer needed in case you need to use only one antenna for the repeater
Hope that helped
Ronen - 4Z4ZQ
Ronen Pinchooks (4Z4ZQ) WebSite
 

Citywide173

Member
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Feb 18, 2005
Messages
1,921
Location
Attleboro, MA
Keep in mind that a repeater has to be coordinated and licensed as well as the 750's needing to be reprogrammed to accommodate the input frequency. Talk to a radio shop-this isn't something you want to DIY.
 

Mtnrider

Member
Joined
Oct 3, 2004
Messages
814
Location
Greene County New Yawk
He's working over sea's ...Whom's going to do the coordination ? Any flavor repeater will work with your HT750's . Yes you will have to change the programming . IE channel 1 tx on one freq rx on repeater output channel 2 can be the "Direct","Talkaround',etc channel tx and rx on the repeater output. You will need a "Repeater",Internal or external duplexer ,good feed line, decent antenna. Grounding protection,And height,elevation. And as stated this might not be a DIY project if your not sure.
 
Joined
Dec 26, 2004
Messages
1,217
Location
Tulsa
Having worked on several international projects such as the OP described, step one is to contact a local radio shop or communications provider. A local shop can provide guidance and assist in contacting the local licensing agency, selection of frequencies and installation of your equipment. To try to do it yourself is foolish and trying to navigate the minefield can only have a bad outcome. Doing it the right way may cost some money but the outcome will be what your company desires and you will be a hero. Take it from someone that has been there done it.
 

joncap

Member
Joined
May 17, 2014
Messages
2
Location
Austin, Texas
Thanks for the input.

Local providers are non-existent. Considering our location, we are going to try and self-perform some of the work, however, need some SME advice on implementation.,

I have already programmed the radios to one of the frequencies we have been assigned by the licensing authority and will reprogram again once we get the repeater up and running.

I know I need antennas and have been told I need a 6 db antenna and possibly a yagi antenna. But I am trying to find a schematic for install. I have two towers that I can use with offices to secure a rack (I have a UPS in one location already).

So here's what I've gotten so far
- VHF repeater
- Duplexer (need more research on this)
- Antennas
- Cable (need more info on this)
- Power supply - doesn't this come with the repeater?

Anything I'm missing?

Again thanks for the help..

Jon
 

WA0CBW

Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2011
Messages
1,377
Location
Shawnee Kansas (Kansas City)
You will need a different transmit and receive frequency (the repeater transmit and receive frequencies are just the opposite of the mobile/portable transmit receive frequencies). The duplexer allows you to use a single antenna for the repeaters transmit and receive frequencies. The duplexer must be able to handle the power of the repeater and split between the transmit and receive frequencies. Be sure the duplexer is designed for the difference between the transmit and receive frequency of the duplexer. The wider the split the easier it is for the duplexer to do its job. Duplexers usually need to be tuned your frequencies. If you don't have the equipment to tune a duplexer then you will have to find a radio shop that can do the job. Use double shielded cables between the repeater transmitter/receiver and the duplexer Use the best cable you can get for the duplexer to antenna. Don't use coax with a foil shield. Use something like 1/2" or 7/8" "hardline." Remember the longer the coax the less signal gets to the antenna. The repeater may or may not come with a power supply. A 6db antenna at VHF can be fairly large. Take the mounting structure into consideration when selecting the antenna. A yagi is a directional type of antenna. If you want all-around coverage from the repeater antenna location then get an omni-directional antenna (not a yagi). Setting up and installing a repeater isn't usually a DIY project but you may be smarter than the average bear so good luck.
BB
 

SCPD

QRT
Joined
Feb 24, 2001
Messages
0
Location
Virginia
Set up

Hey everyone,
... First question I have:
1. Do I need a Motorola-branded repeater? These are a little hard to find and very expensive where I am. (I'm working overseas). Will other brands work as long as they are VHF?

2. What other equipment do I need? I've read maybe a duplexer?

3. Will CPS allow me to program the Motorola repeater to the frequencies I have or do I need something else? If another brand will work with the HT750s, is programming similar to using CPS to program a radio? From a macro perspective, manufacturer provides software, I install, connect repeater and enter specs, done.

These questions will get me a loong way to implementing a solution. Thanks!

Jon
If I was you, I would get a shop involved.
If the radios are Moto, go with a Moto shop. That way they can program the portables to the repeater.
For about $2K, they can set you up with a repeater/duplex package tuned up to your pairs. For 15-20 radios, I wouldn't worry about using both pairs. One repeater pair should suffice. A shop should program the HT's for you for no charge, since you're buying a machine from them, and it's simple analog, nothing fancy.

For what you want to do, I wouldn't worry about getting the CPS for yourself. The program and cabling will cost you close to $400. You're going to do a 1 time set up here, it's not like your going to be changing freqs a lot, so don't bother with getting your own CPS.

Didn't catch if you had antennas yet, but if they are more than 10 years old, swap out the feedline and antenna with new. For 2-3 mile coverage, getting above the roof with a 3dB vertical and low loss feedline should suffice. You don't need to be 100' in the air in my opinion anyway.
 
Last edited:

RadioGuy7268

Member
Joined
Mar 11, 2006
Messages
156
Location
PA
If I was you, I would get a shop involved.
+1 to that - but the OP says there are no shops around.

IF the OP is determined to go it alone, the mine field analogy is pretty appropriate. Once someone else has blown up a few things, it will be a little easier to chart a course. Otherwise, expect that you will be the one who 'steps in it' once or twice along the way. If your job depends on doing it right, get some expert advice for your particular situation. We can only give very broad guesses online with the information posted so far. I can definitely say that using a Yagi antenna for a VHF repeater would not be any kind of typical application, and would probably create more problems than it would solve.

For the OP, If you do know the frequencies you will be using, you should post the exact frequencies. Knowing the exact frequencies will allow a little more advice to flow your way.

VHF repeaters can be tricky. The wavelengths in VHF range don't allow for broadband antennas. If your spacing is more than 10 MHz apart, you will probably need to run two antennas (one for transmit, another spaced some vertical distance above for receive). As mentioned above, a duplexer for VHF can also be tricky. You will need one that will support the isolation between Transmit and Receive for the frequencies you will be using. More isolation = more money. Cheap is not friendly towards VHF repeaters.

One final thought - with just 2 or 3 miles of operating area, you don't need to get crazy with antenna height or power. Too much RF power will create trouble you just don't need. The portables have @ 5 watts max power, more than 10 watts out of the repeater would probably be overkill.

Good luck with it.
 

kayn1n32008

ØÆS, I put that shØt on everything.
Joined
Sep 20, 2008
Messages
6,173
Location
Sector 001
+1 to that - but the OP says there are no shops around.


Agreed. Putting up a repeater is not something one should undertake alone if they have never done it or do not know what is involved.




VHF repeaters can be tricky. The wavelengths in VHF range don't allow for broadband antennas. If your spacing is more than 10 MHz apart, you will probably need to run two antennas (one for transmit, another spaced some vertical distance above for receive).[/QOUTE]

Actually that is completely wrong. Antennas like a SRL 210-C4 or even the Comprod equivalent are resonant across the entire VHF-hi band and are even even resonant on UHF as well. Locally the amateur club I belong to has 3 linked repeaters that have their UHF link radios diplexed to VHF exposed dipole arrays and they work just fine.


As mentioned above, a duplexer for VHF can also be tricky. You will need one that will support the isolation between Transmit and Receive for the frequencies you will be using. More isolation = more money.
Not really. As long as the duplexer will give you 80+ DB of isolation at the given frequency separation all is good. Nothing tricky. The tuning of the duplexers can be finicky only because adjustments on both the pass rods and notch caps of one cavity will effect all the rest.


Cheap is not friendly towards VHF repeaters

Agreed cheap is not friendly for any repeater.



One final thought - with just 2 or 3 miles of operating area, you don't need to get crazy with antenna height or power. Too much RF power will create trouble you just don't need. The portables have @ 5 watts max power, more than 10 watts out of the repeater would probably be overkill.



Good luck with it.

Very true, no point in putting 50w out for a few miles of coverage.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 

sfd119

Member
Joined
Jul 18, 2009
Messages
1,723
Agreed. Putting up a repeater is not something one should undertake alone if they have never done it or do not know what is involved.
I did it when I was in High School with no knowledge. Just wanted to extend my range of my two way radios that I got from a Pawn Shop.

So no, it's not impossible.
 
Joined
Dec 26, 2004
Messages
1,217
Location
Tulsa
When you contact the local licensing authority for your second (mobile transmit, repeater input frequency) be sure that you get a frequency at least a couple of Mhz away from your intened repeater transmit frequency. The greater the seperation the fewer problems you will have to contend with, 4 Mhz or more would be better.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top