Reporting interference?

Status
Not open for further replies.
D

DaveNF2G

Guest
Does anyone know how one reports interference to or from federal radio systems?

The FCC can receive complaints online, but the IRAC website shows no online contact paths. Nor does the site say anything about reporting interference.

The situation I wish to report is actually interference between DOD-related frequencies. The Watervliet Arsenal in NY state has a 4-channel conventional P25 repeater system in the 385 MHz range. Whenever they transmit, digital buzzing can be heard on several UHF milair frequencies.

I am several miles away from the Arsenal, so it's not overload. It happens on numerous different scanners, with and without attenuation. With a digital scanner, I can recover the voice and NAC from whatever frequency I hear the signal on.

So, how do I tell the feds that two of their services are interfering with each other? I'm pretty sure any pilots who hear the interference would have no way of identifying its source.
 
N

N_Jay

Guest
Does anyone know how one reports interference to or from federal radio systems?

The FCC can receive complaints online, but the IRAC website shows no online contact paths. Nor does the site say anything about reporting interference.

The situation I wish to report is actually interference between DOD-related frequencies. The Watervliet Arsenal in NY state has a 4-channel conventional P25 repeater system in the 385 MHz range. Whenever they transmit, digital buzzing can be heard on several UHF milair frequencies.

I am several miles away from the Arsenal, so it's not overload. It happens on numerous different scanners, with and without attenuation. With a digital scanner, I can recover the voice and NAC from whatever frequency I hear the signal on.

So, how do I tell the feds that two of their services are interfering with each other? I'm pretty sure any pilots who hear the interference would have no way of identifying its source.
Are you the licensee or authorized user of the frequency you think is being interfered with?

If not, how do you know that there is actually any interference to the intended use of the system?
 

SCPD

QRT
Joined
Feb 24, 2001
Messages
65,126
Location
Virginia
Does anyone know how one reports interference to or from federal radio systems?

The FCC can receive complaints online, but the IRAC website shows no online contact paths. Nor does the site say anything about reporting interference.
As a part 15 device user you have no standing to make a complaint.
 

KC9NCF

Completely Banned for the Greater Good
Banned
Joined
Apr 11, 2008
Messages
224
VXA has a point here and so does N_Jay. I know you want to be neighborly and do what you think might be right, but these FED people will likely ask all sorts of questions. Why you're monitoring, how, and so forth. They likely will have questions for which you may not have a answer. That itself, my friend, could lead to anything when it comes to these people.
 
D

DaveNF2G

Guest
Sorry but I don't own a tinfoil hat.

P25 buzzing is not compatible with AM voice so, yes N_Jay, there is interference. I have heard pilots mention the "static" to Boston Center.

I'm not sure where "standing to make a complaint" comes into the picture. I am providing information that those who might be making complaints do not have. That is a public service and my civic duty.

As for answering difficult questions, Title 18 of the United States Code (Chapter 119) specifically authorizes private citizens to monitor all sorts of government radio systems, including military, so there should be no issue.
 
N

N_Jay

Guest
Sorry but I don't own a tinfoil hat.
Good. They are so out of style.

P25 buzzing is not compatible with AM voice so, yes N_Jay, there is interference.
Except your receiver is not the intended recipient of the transmission, so your Buzzing is not "interference" from a system standpoint.

I have heard pilots mention the "static" to Boston Center.
Then it is THEIR responsibility to report, not yours.

I'm not sure where "standing to make a complaint" comes into the picture.
You want to make a complaint, and you do not have any valid reason to make such a complaint. That is where it comes into the picture.

I am providing information that those who might be making complaints do not have.
Maybe so, but I doubt it. If it was a significant issue the appropriate people would investigate.
(Heck, they might even be smart enough to figure it out themselves.);)

That is a public service and my civic duty.
About as much as the guy telling the investigator they are doing it wrong because they saw it in CSI. (The original, not that Miami spin-off):twisted:

As for answering difficult questions, Title 18 of the United States Code (Chapter 119) specifically authorizes private citizens to monitor all sorts of government radio systems, including military, so there should be no issue.
No, that does not make you an intended recipient, nor makes your receiver part of the system.

I actually have a client who wants to add encryption because some person with a scanner calls in to tell them things he thinks are "important".:roll:
 
Last edited:

kb2vxa

Completely Banned for the Greater Good
Banned
Joined
Mar 22, 2005
Messages
6,126
Location
Point Pleasant Beach, N.J.
"That is a public service and my civic duty."
You just don't get it now DO you? Alright, if you're naive enough to believe that go right ahead but don't come crying to the older, wiser and more experienced when you find yourself on the spot... we told you so. Better get some street smarts kid, you're gonna need them in times ahead.
 

FLRAILMAN

Completely Banned for the Greater Good
Banned
Joined
Mar 24, 2006
Messages
653
Location
Orange City, Fl.
Reporting interference

Dave, obviously this is of passionate importance to you, so I feel you need to know what I discovered. The NTIA customer service rep. stated that they do handle complaints of interference to or from the communication systems whose frequencies they allocate to the various agencies eligible for same, after briefly explaining your dilemma anonymously, she advised me that as far as she knows, they will only start an official investigation from an authorized agencys communications coordinators complaint & all of the NTIA registered agencies have the proper contact information & procedures on file, however she said she would give me the contact number for the office of spectrum management. I called that number & not surprisingly, it was an answering machine requesting that you leave a complete message & contact phone number.

U.S. Department of Commerce/NTIA
1401 Constitution Ave, N.W.
Washington, D.C.
202-482-2000 (Main number)
202-482-1850 (Spectrum Management)
National Telecommunications and Information Administration

I strongly implore you not to do this, however I feel you have the right to know.

FLRAILMAN
 
Last edited:

bezking

Member
Database Admin
Joined
Aug 5, 2006
Messages
2,634
Location
On the Road
Folks, this isn't the tavern and we won't let you bash each other.

Consider yourself warned...
 

ecps92

Member
Joined
Jul 8, 2002
Messages
10,617
Location
Taxachusetts
Dave, since you mention "Boston Center", I would contact them and let them know what you have advised here. Let them follow-up and you have done your part, letting them know.

Let the FAA work with the USA and hopefully it will resolve.

For the flamers out here :twisted:
It's the same as calling your PD and letting them know you just saw the Car they are looking for.

Sorry but I don't own a tinfoil hat.

P25 buzzing is not compatible with AM voice so, yes N_Jay, there is interference. I have heard pilots mention the "static" to Boston Center.

I'm not sure where "standing to make a complaint" comes into the picture. I am providing information that those who might be making complaints do not have. That is a public service and my civic duty.

As for answering difficult questions, Title 18 of the United States Code (Chapter 119) specifically authorizes private citizens to monitor all sorts of government radio systems, including military, so there should be no issue.
 
D

DaveNF2G

Guest
Thanks, Bill, for the sensible answer. Wish I'd thought of that in the first place. Obviously, the FAA is going to be a "legitimate" reporter to IRAC.

As for the rest, I am sorry that you are so terrified of your government that you won't even consider dealing with some of its agencies.

To Warren, this "kid" is over 50 years old, respects the government, understands civic duty and citizenship, has a graduate degree in Criminal Justice, and teaches college courses, besides having years of field experience in public safety and communications. I've already earned my "street smarts" and feel sorry for the current generation of self-absorbed and undereducated "leaders."
 

SKYNET156

Duplicate account of Tom Sherman
Banned
Joined
Mar 14, 2009
Messages
0
Location
Orange County, CA
Dave,
I heard of this problem in the NYC Area where there was a 400mhz gov system that was causing interference on a local security companies repeaters, and that company happened to be one of the biggest security companies in new york city, they had someone call the NTIA and the FCC and that company was told "to bad" by the NTIA as well as the FCC.
I feel your frustration, but unless it was causing a huge huge interference, i doubt that anything is going to be done, because when it comes to federal radio systems, they think that nothing will ever go wrong because they are the us goverment, and their radio system is top priority to any other radio system,

I have read about FCC horror stories when it comes to commerical radio systems and reporting interference, so i can only imagine dealing with NTIA,

Good luck my friend, report back and let us know how it goes and if you get far with them
 

KC9NCF

Completely Banned for the Greater Good
Banned
Joined
Apr 11, 2008
Messages
224
Thanks, Bill, for the sensible answer. Wish I'd thought of that in the first place. Obviously, the FAA is going to be a "legitimate" reporter to IRAC.

As for the rest, I am sorry that you are so terrified of your government that you won't even consider dealing with some of its agencies.

To Warren, this "kid" is over 50 years old, respects the government, understands civic duty and citizenship, has a graduate degree in Criminal Justice, and teaches college courses, besides having years of field experience in public safety and communications. I've already earned my "street smarts" and feel sorry for the current generation of self-absorbed and undereducated "leaders."
It isn't that we are afraid of dealing with our gov agencies, it is that they already know we are out here listening. They know that they are being monitored. Why do you think N-Jay made the comment about his client wanting to encrypt? Stupid phone calls or calls for which there is little to zero significance will make a gov agency encrypt a P25 system faster than you can say go.

Scanning and radio in general are already looked upon by the government as a quasi-criminal activity rooted in high suspicion. Forget title 18, and think "Patriot Act", think "Homeland Security Concern". Think like these guys do. Kudos to N_Jay for pointing out that a radio receiver is NOT the "Intended Recipient" of radio traffic. Though the receiver is built for intercepting lawful communications as described in the communications act, the reception we are still able to get is common and incidental. Think "Laws of Physics". The keyword here being on "Incidental".
 

kb2vxa

Completely Banned for the Greater Good
Banned
Joined
Mar 22, 2005
Messages
6,126
Location
Point Pleasant Beach, N.J.
Dave, you're very well known so you may dispense with the pontification. Like the mod said bashing is frowned upon but you took no more heed than you do our advice so bye bye, I'm outa here before the hammer falls.
 

eorange

Secret Agent Man
Joined
Aug 20, 2003
Messages
2,178
Location
Cleveland, OH
As for the rest, I am sorry that you are so terrified of your government that you won't even consider dealing with some of its agencies.
Remember the guy from Europe who accidentally intercepted U.S (I think) military tactical video feeds using his satellite TV? He tried to notify the military and they kept dismissing him, until the very end. What if he never reported it?

Report it and let the agency decide if you're providing worthwhile information.
 

SkipSanders

Silent Key
Joined
Dec 19, 2002
Messages
1,058
I've tried reporting pirate users on military frequencies. Even tracked down the local military person responsible for frequency coordination in the area.

Situation: Pirate repeater set up, running, many local users, on 146-150 band, heavily used in this area by US Navy.

Reported repeatedly to FCC, and to US Navy.

Result? No effect, they didn't care. The Feds will not do anything unless one of their people is inconvenienced/reports a problem.

That pirate group used that channel for 5 years or more, after being reported, including the exact address where the repeater was, inside someone's communications store.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top