• Effective immediately we will be deleting, without notice, any negative threads or posts that deal with the use of encryption and streaming of scanner audio.

    We've noticed a huge increase in rants and negative posts that revolve around agencies going to encryption due to the broadcasting of scanner audio on the internet. It's now worn out and continues to be the same recycled rants. These rants hijack the threads and derail the conversation. They no longer have a place anywhere on this forum other than in the designated threads in the Rants forum in the Tavern.

    If you violate these guidelines your post will be deleted without notice and an infraction will be issued. We are not against discussion of this issue. You just need to do it in the right place. For example:
    https://forums.radioreference.com/rants/224104-official-thread-live-audio-feeds-scanners-wait-encryption.html

Run in with law enformcent with my radios

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timkilbride

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Had a minor run in with law enforcement. The law enforcement officer didn't like how I was parked next to UPRR and Franklin County property. The parking issue was settled quickly after I told the officer I didn't want to be questioned standing on UP's Mason City Sub.I then walked 10-20 feet off the public crossing and the officer followed suit. When the second and third officer arrived they looked inside my car and seen various two way radio's and police scanners. The officer asked what was programmed into the bottom radio(Kenwood TK-760). I firmly said he didn't need to know. After further dicking around I finally turned the radio on for him. He then asked to see what frequencies were programmed. I advised all my channels are alpha tagged. So he then illegal transmits(didn't identify) on all his channels in his handheld. Nothing came across my radio when he transmitted. He said it would be a FAA violation to have his channels programmed into my radio. I asked him what the Federal Aviation Administration had to do with this radio. He then corrected himself by saying the FCC. I further advised him I am licensed by the FCC(Ham Radio Operator and he was aware of this) and its not illegal to have his channels programmed into my radio. I told him it would be illegal if I transmitted on his channels. He further disagreed so I handed him a piece of paper and asked him to write his name down. He quickly backed off and handed me a business and said he was in charge of all the patrolmen. I said I would then talk with the sheriff directly about this issue he didn't fully understand.

This happend to me in Iowa.

What are your thoughts?

Tim K.
 

KCChiefs9690

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Well my thoughts are that *SOME* cops take this kind of issue way too far. They don't have permission to transmit or use your radios, plus they have no probable cause to touch or inspect your radios. If they have a problem, let them tell the FCC. The FCC will take action, and of course since having police freqs in a radio is NOT illigal, nothing will happen to you and the cop will feel like a moron. My 2 cents.
 
N

N_Jay

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Sounds like you were working on failing the attitude test.

Not the whole test, just the "I know more then you" section.

That said, it is NOT illegal for him to transmit without identification on HIS radio as long as his department identifies properly.
 

timkilbride

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<That said, it is NOT illegal for him to transmit without identification on HIS radio as long as his department identifies properly.>

They do not have a identifier on there repeater and they don't say there callsign via voice either.

If he doesn't know the difference between the FAA and FCC how is he going to know any other radio law?

Tim K.
 

KCChiefs9690

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They do not have a identifier on there repeater and they don't say there callsign via voice either.
It doesn't matter. He is a licenced user of that department radio, he doesn't need to say your call sign like hams do.
 

N2MWE

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"I firmly said he didn't need to know."

To tell you the truth, that right there would have earned you handcuffs and a trip to the stationhouse for investigation. And yes, a police officer can do that. Would it have really hurt to just say "Officer, I was just checking the trains out, and I use this radio to listen to the trains?"

Less attitude goes a long way.
 

Al42

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AEMTKieran said:
"I firmly said he didn't need to know."

To tell you the truth, that right there would have earned you handcuffs and a trip to the stationhouse for investigation.
Since only a "duly authorized federal employee" has a need to know in states in which scanners in cars aren't illegal, that would have earned the OFFICER an immediate federal impersonation charge. Local badges DO NOT confer federal authority, regardless of what the department know-it-all thinks - and there's always at least one who's willing to get his department involved in a contest with the feds just to win a point with a civilian. (Local LE *always* loses those contests.)
 

car2back

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I agree the officer was being a little pushy, but you were definantly asking for it with the smart-@$$ attitude.
 

blueline_308

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It would have been cool if he had tazed you, towed and confiscated your vehicle for inspection of the radios by the proper federal agency and had you pay for the tow bill and storage costs. It's dicks like you that make it bad for the rest of us.
 

wesct

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Al42 said:
Since only a "duly authorized federal employee" has a need to know in states in which scanners in cars aren't illegal, that would have earned the OFFICER an immediate federal impersonation charge. Local badges DO NOT confer federal authority, regardless of what the department know-it-all thinks - and there's always at least one who's willing to get his department involved in a contest with the feds just to win a point with a civilian. (Local LE *always* loses those contests.)
and in the end, the lawyers win.

if the local police departments always lose those contests, what does it end up costing you?
you go to court.
the judge says the federally licensed equipment is contraband.
you dont get your equipment back because of what the judge says.
you pay a lawyer $2,000 to argue. and you still lose your equipment, because you gave the officer a hard time.

i would say that cooperating is the best policy.


wesct
 

SCPD

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wesct said:
you dont get your equipment back because of what the judge says.
you pay a lawyer $2,000 to argue. and you still lose your equipment, because you gave the officer a hard time.
Or you have to sell your toys to pay the attorney even though you "won".

-rick
 

n4voxgill

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gee i just found out that a city police officer can't arrest you for bank robbery, kidnapping and other laws. Glad I don't get legal advice from people on this board.
 

mastr

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Every time I see a post like this, I understand a bit more of the reason why "ham" radio operators are rapidly losing what little integrity we (may) still have in the eyes of public safety agencies. If you cannot represent the hobby in a better fashion than this incident indicates, you should strongly consider relinquishing your license.

W
 

I_10_92

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What ever happened to being nice to people? If you havent done anything wrong, then why give the cop attitude? No one likes being told what to do, and you tell a police officer "You don't need to know that" What would you expect? The officer's job is to PROTECT people and things. How is he supposed to know what the heck you're doing? You could be plotting a robbery, stalking someone, planning a terrorist attack! Cops cant read people's minds.
 

scover5555

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I am a former city police officer and just to let you know that a federal officer can only enforce federal laws, a state police officer can enforce federal and state laws and a city police officer can enforce federal, state and city laws. It gets even more complicated in the federal departments. A DEA or FBI officer can't arrest someone for crossing the border, an Immigration officer has to do that. A DEA or Immigration officer can't arrest someone for bank robbery, an FBI agent only has that authority at the federal level. There is nothing that says a DEA agent can't stop and detain a bank robbery suspect, it's just that an FBI agent must make the formal arrest (signing the final paperwork going to the court).
Another bit of trivia... there is only one person who can arrest the sheriff, that is the county coroner. This goes back to the days when the sheriff collected the taxes for the king. The king appointed the coroner to oversee the sheriff and make sure he wasn't pocketing any of the kings money. So if a sheriff shoots someone in cold blood in the street, any law enforcement officer can stop and detain him, but the coroner must come in and sign the ticket to have him arresed.
Another thing, just because the officer said FAA instead of FCC, or happens to misspell your name on the ticket won't get you off the hook in court as a technicality like you see in the movies. When it comes down in the end he will point and identify you in court and identify the radios in evidence to the judge. As far as him stopping you and checking things out, it all falls under the "Terry stop" in case law.
Just remember before you argue with a cop about the law, he has had more training than most people can imagine. Plus he knows if he does something that he has no authority to do, he can be sued personally and he doesn't feel like giving you his paycheck and working for nothing for the next 40 years.
 

N4DES

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timkilbride said:
The officer asked what was programmed into the bottom radio(Kenwood TK-760). I firmly said he didn't need to know.
So what is programmed into the TK-760? Was it worth giving him lip for?
 

b7spectra

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Just like when I was a manager - I could do what ever I wanted to with my occupational employees - afterwards, they could grieve it. You act like a smart-ass (like mentioned above), you can get treated like one. The old saying goes you catch more flies with sugar than you do with vinegar!
 

mmartinfan

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You should have had a TASER used on you, just be being a total ass. Like a previous poster said, "What ever happened to being nice?", and, "No wonder HAM's look like idiots nowadays."
 
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