Santa Barbara County goes with EF Johnson

[SBSteve]

I'll bet AMR is kicking themselves for buying those DMR portables against the recommendations of those in the know...

Equipment is a long time out. Don't expect it operational for a long time.

Why would AMR kick themselves for buying DMR portables, I don't know that they did, but are they using them now? Equipment might be a long time out for the back-haul and trunked systems, but it seems like the VHF element could be upgraded, at least existing sites, at will. The fire ECC is projected for completion in 2024 and while that might be overly optimist, even three years doesn't seem like a long time out for a project of this magnitude. While the UHF trunked portion of the new system might not be done by then, there's no reason they can't keep using the conventional UHF for paramedic to hospital comms until the full system is done.

 

[SBSteve]

There is another aspect to the EMS discussion that involves the County Board of Supervisors consideration of not renewing the AMR contact in favor of having the County Fire Department providing ambulance service. Currently AMR is at the end of what was a 15 year no bid contract. This contract has been extended temporarily while the discussion continues. The county currently operates three rescue ambulances. One is at UCSB, another in Lompoc and the third in New Cuyama. These are regularly called to cover AMR's calls when AMR has no units free. These RA's are dispatched on the fire channels not the EMS system although they use the UHF hospital frequencies.

AMR ambulances are currently dispatched on the county EMS radio system, but can operate on fire channels for coordination.

Many questions remain unanswered. With a combined dispatch center and a non- renewal. of AMR's contract would county fire ambulances also be dispatched in the individual city and independent fire districts?

The combined fire dispatch center is a ways off. Its reason for existing is partly political and partly practical. There is bad blood between the sheriff and the fire department. It is alleged that a combined dispatch center would speed responses across jurisdictions.

None of this directly relates to radio use, but it will have an impact.

Again 2-3 years is not a long ways off. Yes, there are always questions to be answered, but I think you may have missed some points others have made in other posts in the past. The County Fire Department, if they were to be the successful bidder (to use my own terminology) could then sub-contract, maybe back to AMR for given areas, or other fire departments in the county could become subcontractors to provide transport services.

And the Fire/EMS ECC concept has never been about politics or bad blood between the sheriff and fire department and it accomplishes more than just speeding up responses across jurisdictions.

 

[KK6ZTE]

MED34 responds into Lompoc all the time whenever 7 or 17/27 are tied up. Why would it be any different or an issue if County is the primary ALS transport provider?

I don't think you understand, the new backhaul is required to implement new equipment, including VHF expansion. All new radio infrastructure equipment is IP transport. Santa Barbara County doesn't have IP transport to all of their sites. So no, VHF couldn't be upgraded until the backhaul is replaced.

Yes, AMR is using DMR portables (XPR3500e). They needed new radios and wanted Motorola.

 

[SBSteve]

MED34 responds into Lompoc all the time whenever 7 or 17/27 are tied up. Why would it be any different or an issue if County is the primary ALS transport provider?

I don't think you understand, the new backhaul is required to implement new equipment, including VHF expansion. All new radio infrastructure equipment is IP transport. Santa Barbara County doesn't have IP transport to all of their sites. So no, VHF couldn't be upgraded until the backhaul is replaced.

Yes, AMR is using DMR portables (XPR3500e). They needed new radios and wanted Motorola.

MED34, MED17, and MED27 are not part of System Status Management (I think that was the term) (SSM), and in essence, respond into the AMR exclusive contract area on kind of a mutual aid basis. That would change so that there is one countywide (SSM). The unit identifiers would also change, there wouldn’t be two Medic 34’s, 17’s, and 27’s. Scene management and non-transport paramedic unit SSM integration would also likely improve.

Yeah, I suppose it would be a bit convoluted to do a temporary upgrade to the VHF system before the new backhaul is complete. I was focusing on the capacity of the old backhaul system as the issue rather than the transport protocol. The old microwave system isn’t using IP? I still don’t think a 2-3 year timeframe is unrealistic and isn’t that far away.

Did you bring up the XPR3500e radios because the brand isn’t consistent with the EF Johnson brand or are you saying the XPR3500e won’t work with the new system? Are the XPR3500e’s UHF/VHF or just UHF?

 

[KK6ZTE]

Existing microwave is T-1 transport and most base stations are Motorola Quantars.

It's possible that implementation could move up, but they have a lot of legwork to do to get to that point.

XPR3500e is a low tier DMR only radio, which won't work on a P25 trunked system. Additionally, they are UHF only.

 

[uman18]

Existing microwave is T-1 transport and most base stations are Motorola Quantars.

It's possible that implementation could move up, but they have a lot of legwork to do to get to that point.

XPR3500e is a low tier DMR only radio, which won't work on a P25 trunked system. Additionally, they are UHF only.

XPR3500e radios are throw away radios, and will last the 2-3 years. They probably needed an upgraded and couldn't wait. Eventually they will need to upgrade again.

 

[mmckenna]

XPR3500e radios are throw away radios, and will last the 2-3 years. They probably needed an upgraded and couldn't wait. Eventually they will need to upgrade again.

I did the same thing for our PD. The MTS2000's were failing and we needed replacements. We also needed a new radio system. Knowing that the budget process is a slow one, I spec'd out Kenwood NX-210's since it would match the 800MHz radios they already had, accessories, batteries, chargers, etc. Was supposed to be for "2-3 years". That was almost 10 years ago. Still running the original NX-210's, still waiting for budget approval for the new radio system.

"Nothing is more permanent than a temporary solution".​

Sometimes agencies just need something to hold them over. Buying top of the line when you only need something basic to get you through a "few" years isn't that uncommon, it makes good financial sense, and it doesn't risk buying into a top tier radio only to find out later that everyone else is going in another direction.
Just be glad they are not Baofengs.

 

[ChrisE_STB]

The link is dead

County of Santa Barbara Chooses ATLAS® P25 from EFJohnson for Its Next Generation Public Safety Radio System

www.efjohnson.com

 

[MtnBiker2005]

_______________________________________
WRTP958 - SANTA BARBARA, COUNTY OF
07/12/2022 License Issued
Radio Service: YW - Public Safety Pool, Trunked
PLOWSHARE PEAK COMMUNICATIONS SITE MIRANDA PINE RD, LOMPOC, CA SANTA BARBARA County
460.0625 - FB8 -
460.3625 - FB8 -
BLOCHMAN UNION ELEMENTARY, SISQUOC, CA SANTA BARBARA County
460.0625 - FB8 -
460.3625 - FB8 -
https://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/UlsSearch/license.jsp?licKey=4634187
https://www.radioreference.com/db/fcc/callsign/WRTP958
_______________________________________

 

[KK6ZTE]

That license is interesting.... Plowshare certainly isn't in Lompoc.

That channel is only 12.5k off of SLOCO Red which is at Tepusquet.

 

[SBSteve]

That license is interesting.... Plowshare certainly isn't in Lompoc.

The lack of attention to detail in the FCC database isn't that striking to me, but if the coordinates were significantly off I'd be more concerned. The two sites are clearly Tepusquet and Plowshare. The same data was entered in the pending YG-radio service license.

That channel is only 12.5k off of SLOCO Red which is at Tepusquet.
[/QUOTE

The more striking thing to me is the frequency separation as you note. Are receivers and filters etc. getting so good that you don't need at least 200 kHz to avoid interference? It seems to be occurring more frequently across all bands now.

 

[Giddyuptd]

AMR is a Corp wide deal with dmr tier 3. They are trying to make a nationwide network. Some are using mix mode kenwoods such as dmr and p25 for local channels. Some places I've seen amr make their rigs dispatch out of their tier 3 system and a agency by here was given the consoles and equipment to do it. However nobody but amr can hear them minus dispatch as amr is firm on the we are a business and must protect ourselves from lawsuits so they are using encryption on their dmr end. Amr still uses the local channels but near here the dispatch is all done on their dmr network and dispatch center has their deal in them.

I'd imagine down road when needed amr will purchase there where you are multi band and mixed mode equipment when time comes.

Why would AMR kick themselves for buying DMR portables, I don't know that they did, but are they using them now? Equipment might be a long time out for the back-haul and trunked systems, but it seems like the VHF element could be upgraded, at least existing sites, at will. The fire ECC is projected for completion in 2024 and while that might be overly optimist, even three years doesn't seem like a long time out for a project of this magnitude. While the UHF trunked portion of the new system might not be done by then, there's no reason they can't keep using the conventional UHF for paramedic to hospital comms until the full system is done.

 

[KK6ZTE]

The more striking thing to me is the frequency separation as you note. Are receivers and filters etc. getting so good that you don't need at least 200 kHz to avoid interference? It seems to be occurring more frequently across all bands now.

That info is entered by the coordinator or whoever submitted the application. It's not the FCC's info. That's what's striking me as odd, what's obviously Tepusquet is listed as Blochman Elementary.

The frequency separation will likely be an issue in the future

 

[MtnBiker2005]

___________________________________________________________________________
WRTT924 - SANTA BARBARA, COUNTY OF
07/25/2022 License Issued
Radio Service: YG - Industrial/Business Pool, Trunked
PLOWSHARE PEAK COMMUNICATIONS SITE MIRANDA PINE RD, LOMPOC, CA SANTA BARBARA County
452.5625 - FB8 -
452.6125 - FB8 -
460.9250 - FB8 -
BLOCHMAN UNION ELEMENTARY, SISQUOC, CA SANTA BARBARA County
452.5625 - FB8 -
452.6125 - FB8 -
460.9250 - FB8 -
https://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/UlsSearch/license.jsp?licKey=4639430
https://www.radioreference.com/db/fcc/callsign/WRTT924
___________________________________________________________________________

 

[KK6ZTE]

Very interesting.... this one is not in the public safety pool. It's a business/industrial trunking pool. Also the 90.35 rule they're using is to describe school operations when it's clearly not just for the school. Same errors listed "Blochman Elementary" is actually Tepusquet Peak, Plowshare is in wrong city, etc. This license also got returned for paperwork issues initially and had to be corrected.

 

[scannerboy02]

I posted this in a new thread before I saw this one, admin can delete the other one.

Looks like Santa Barbara County has been granted four licenses;
WRUI726
453.2875
453.5375
453.8125
460.1125
460.4375
Location 1 - VISTA DEL MAR UNION ELEMENTARY, Coordinates 34-30-49.2 N, 120-13-52.1 W
Location 3 - HERITAGE OIL PLATFORM, Coordinates 34-21-05.9 N, 120-16-04.0 W
Location 5 - OAK MOUNTAIN, Coordinates 34-33-07.3 N, 120-30-08.4 W
Location 7 - LOMPOC UNIFIED SCHOOL DISTRICT, Coordinates 34-33-58.4 N, 120-30-00.1 W
--------------------
WRUI727
453.2625
453.5125
453.7750
460.1375
460.5250
Location 1 - 105 E ANAPAMU ST, Coordinates 34-25-30.2 N, 119-42-12.5 W
Location 3 - LA CUMBRE PEAK - E CAMINO CIELO, Coordinates 34-30-01.0 N, 119-43-16.0 W
Location 5 - SANTA CRUZ ISLAND, Coordinates 33-59-56.0 N, 119-41-00.9 W
--------------------
WRUI728
453.1875
453.4375
460.0375
460.2875
460.5750
Location 1 - FIGUEROA MTN LOOKOUT DAY USE AREA, Coordinates 34-44-36.2 N, 119-59-05.7 W
Location 3 - 5607-5601 W CAMINO CIELO, Coordinates 34-31-35.8 N, 119-58-42.4 W
--------------------
WRUK225
453.1625
453.4500
453.7875
460.0750
460.3375
Location 1 - 99 CENTENNIAL ST, Coordinates 34-44-42.8 N, 120-16-47.1 W
Location 2 - VANDENBERG AIRBASE FORCE, Coordinates 34-44-18.8 N, 120-26-44.8 W
Location 3 - 107 CIVIC PLAZA, Coordinates 34-38-17.3 N, 120-27-11.3 W
Location 4 - SOLOMON HILLS - MOUNT SOLOMAN, Coordinates 34-50-04.9 N, 120-22-59.4 W
Location 5 - 5425 BLACK RD, Coordinates 34-50-30.9 N, 120-29-56.9 W
--------------------

 

[MtnBiker2005]

Quick links for the above info...
_______________________________________
WRUI726 - SANTA BARBARA, COUNTY OF
08/30/2022 License Issued
https://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/UlsSearch/license.jsp?licKey=4657549
https://www.radioreference.com/db/fcc/callsign/WRUI726
_______________________________________
WRUI727 - SANTA BARBARA, COUNTY OF
08/30/2022 License Issued
https://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/UlsSearch/license.jsp?licKey=4657550
https://www.radioreference.com/db/fcc/callsign/WRUI727
_______________________________________
WRUI728 - SANTA BARBARA, COUNTY OF
08/30/2022 License Issued
https://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/UlsSearch/license.jsp?licKey=4657551
https://www.radioreference.com/db/fcc/callsign/WRUI728
_______________________________________
WRUK225 - SANTA BARBARA, COUNTY OF
09/06/2022 License Issued
https://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/UlsSearch/licenseLocSum.jsp?licKey=4659497
https://www.radioreference.com/db/fcc/callsign/WRUK225
_______________________________________

 

[barryman]

Does anyone have any insight as to if or when Santa Barbara County / cities will be upgrading to a new radio dispatch system? I would imagine it would go to a trunked digital system, possibly P25 Phase II, or one of the newer ones. Just looking ahead as to what scanner I will need to upgrade to for listening. Still using a Uniden 396t digital, but it is only good for Phase I.

 

[KK6ZTE]

It'll be awhile. No rush to buy new equipment. It will be P25 Phase II, not sure what you mean "one of the newer ones"

 

[monitor142]

The more striking thing to me is the frequency separation as you note. Are receivers and filters etc. getting so good that you don't need at least 200 kHz to avoid interference? It seems to be occurring more frequently across all bands now.

No physics haven't changed much in many years. You still need minimum separation so in a close spaced system like this you will need to have two combiners for TX. I had to have two 700MHz combiners on my 10 channel 7/800 trunker because of that exact issue.