SDS100,200,LSM, and BCD325P2...

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Cruiseomatic

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Currently have a BCD325P2 monitoring TxWarn and it does fine for the most part minus one site.
Given that it is only one site that I'm aware of, and the problem site usually shows signs of weak signal with P25 decode rate always changing and hard to get a lock where it needs to be, High error rate when a TG does manage to get through resulting in garbled audio, etc... I think it is an LSM issue even though no other sites use the same frequencies on this system.
Its not an antenna issue as I have a Laird 800mhz stubby that performs just as good as the tall RS model and looks more professional.

I hear the SDS series is the only radio that can perform equal to a subscriber radios for problems like this. But are terrible at analog reception.
I do occasionally listen to amateur bands and analog frequencies. But would love to no longer play musical spots trying to get that one site.
Would love to get a SDS100 for the durability, LSM solution, P25 performance, Etc... But not sure if it is worth the $650+ tag to go with it.
There are a ton of issues I have with this P2 but most I can live with for now if the price is coming down on the 100.
I'm used to my old APX7000 when I worked for the local PD and how its was a damn brick that worked like nothing phased it and could handle anything. I understand its a $2,500 radio also and I got the P2 for $250 used online.
My biggest issue is performance though. Battery life is terrible and that site always having problems is killing me.
What should I do and other than size and physical appearance, What are all the differences in the SDS100 and 200? Quite a large cost difference in the two putting the 200 around $700.
Thanks.
 

kruser

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Okay, 3-003 is definitely a simulcast site.
Click on the sites Name and then click one or the other FCC Callsign.
That will show you a map showing that site probably has six transmit locations that are all on the air at the same time. That's your source of a Simulcast system.
Any given site can have several towers for a site. Usually you can see multiple tower locations when looking at the FCC page under the Location tab but in this case, it's in the DB here so it's easy to see that it is simulcast.

Both the SDS models are similar. The 200 makes it easy to record audio directly to a computer using its LAN port but if that's not important, the 100 would probably be the way to go if you would use it in more than one location.

The Unication pagers like the G5 also work very well on this system but are not as easy to program or use like a scanner.

You may want to ask about this in the Texas forum and see what others are using for the Txwarn system.

edit: I meant to say to click on the Sites name and not the county to open the page that shows the sites callsign(s)!
 
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Cruiseomatic

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Audio recording through a network isn't a requirement at all and it will mostly be used everywhere I go. Pagers aren't really my thing right now. I'll post a link to this tread down there and see what they say. Thanks.
 

kruser

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Another thing you can try with the 325P2 is get a yagi directional antenna and see if you can maximize the signal from only one of that sites towers which can help to eliminate LSM issues.
 

trentbob

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Cruiseomatic... my P2 system works the same way with multiple Towers close together and simulcast distortion secondary to LSM.

It's weird to hear my apx7000 is old but I guess it is since I got it in 2015 just to handle LSM issues in my County.

As kruser was saying, the yagi antenna was a good method to try to handle the problem but if you're not in a fixed location the LSM issues are tough.

I use both the 100 and 200. If you want to save money the 100 is adequate and you can be on the move. It works just as good as the apx 7000 on my P2 system, pretty much flawless but it doesn't have the volume punch the apx has. It is certainly not as durable as the apx 7000. That apx takes a licking and keeps on ticking, I can't count how many times that puppy has bounced on the concrete.

You are right, The SDS series is not the greatest on analog performance and is primarily optimal only on simulcast and other digital systems like type II smartzone. The filter adjustments do helped to compensate with analog.

The display on the SDS series is fantastic even though I clear most of the extraneous information off the screen and basically have it looking like my apx.

It sounds like with the system that you monitor you would really benefit from an SDS 100. You will love it.
 

Cruiseomatic

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The APX7000 has a serious punch. I miss mine.
Yagi is out of the question as I'm either mobile or don't want to wear out the BNC constantly switching out. Bad enough I need to clean the female end on mine and can't. I can, But it never seems to stay clean and I can't tell when it is. Thinking of modding it to a male SMA instead. BNC is a joke anyway for this application.

Thinking about going with a 100. I do monitor analog but not as often as I do digital as I incorporate it into my home security while I'm home. Sad but true.
 

trentbob

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I just posted over on your state forum before I saw this.

I think getting a 100 is it good idea in your application. Chances are the analog that you want to hear will work okay using the filters.

Good luck to you, let us know what you end up doing... Bob.
 

jonwienke

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Get one of the SDSx00 models. Its the only solution for simulcast on the go. Directional antennas are only useful if you are at a fixed location and can point it at one transmitter with no other transmitter in front or behind.
 

iMONITOR

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Currently have a BCD325P2... Battery life is terrible and that site always having problems is killing me.

You can greatly extend battery life by eliminating or at least minimizing use of the backlight. You might look into using longer life (higher mAH) batteries.
 

a29zuk

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Also, if you have a audio jack in your vehicle, using it extends the life of the batteries on the 325P2. I get 7 to 8 hours of battery life when going mobile.

Jim
 

kruser

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The APX7000 has a serious punch. I miss mine.
Yagi is out of the question as I'm either mobile or don't want to wear out the BNC constantly switching out. Bad enough I need to clean the female end on mine and can't. I can, But it never seems to stay clean and I can't tell when it is. Thinking of modding it to a male SMA instead. BNC is a joke anyway for this application.

Thinking about going with a 100. I do monitor analog but not as often as I do digital as I incorporate it into my home security while I'm home. Sad but true.

The yagi idea was just a suggestion if you had the ability to try one while stationary being as you say you only have this problem on the one site. I'd think the other sites would suffer from LSM also if you travel far. LSM can be a tricky beast to cure with older receiver technology.
There are other options instead of a yagi. Even the old paperclip in the BNC jack trick can be a valid test but I guess that idea is also out for you if you are worried about wearing out the BNC jack.

I agree with the SDS100 decision. They do usually work very well for LSM problems.

I was able to get most analog signals working well on my 100 and 200 with a couple exceptions. Usually just trying different filters did the trick and IFX exchange on a few analog's.
I still have some analog signals in the UHF band that are wiped out by nearby strong signals. No filter setting helps with this as the local signal overloads the TV tuner front end chip in the SDS models. Attenuation is out of the question here as the desired analog signal strength is already weak and any attenuation would just make it fall below the noise floor.

For things like VHF analog, I tested with the local NOAA WX channels. On a good day, I can get a signal from all seven NOAA frequencies on an Icom R9000 or R8600. I can also pull in those same signals on other Uniden models. When I first tried my then new, SDS100, it would barely hear my local NOAA signal! Filter setting cured this and both SDS models now hear the NOAA signals almost as well as the much better Icom's.
 

Cruiseomatic

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paperclip in the BNC jack trick can be a valid test but I guess that idea is also out for you if you are worried about wearing out the BNC jack.

I agree with the SDS100 decision. They do usually work very well for LSM problems.

I was able to get most analog signals working well on my 100 and 200 with a couple exceptions. Usually just trying different filters did the trick and IFX exchange on a few analog's.
I still have some analog signals in the UHF band that are wiped out by nearby strong signals. No filter setting helps with this as the local signal overloads the TV tuner front end chip in the SDS models. Attenuation is out of the question here as the desired analog signal strength is already weak and any attenuation would just make it fall below the noise floor.

For things like VHF analog, I tested with the local NOAA WX channels. On a good day, I can get a signal from all seven NOAA frequencies on an Icom R9000 or R8600. I can also pull in those same signals on other Uniden models. When I first tried my then new, SDS100, it would barely hear my local NOAA signal! Filter setting cured this and both SDS models now hear the NOAA signals almost as well as the much better Icom's.

Actually, Given the female port is black inside, Don't know how but it is and obviously needs cleaned, I might try the paperclip.
Excuse my ignorance, But, TV Tuner inside the SDS? I'm lost.
 

kruser

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Actually, Given the female port is black inside, Don't know how but it is and obviously needs cleaned, I might try the paperclip.
Excuse my ignorance, But, TV Tuner inside the SDS? I'm lost.

Yes, the SDS series use some form of SDR based TV Tuner with a wide (8 MHz or so) front end. I guess it's similar to the cheap RTLSDR USB tuner sticks many people play with but I think the chipset Uniden chose is worlds better quality than the cheap rtlsdr sticks found on eBay.
The specs on the tuner chip used were posted here in one of the Uniden forums not long after the SDS100 was released as far as I can recall.
I can't find a link to that old thread.
I believe this fact is possibly what brought about the user adjustable filters as everyone's RF environment can vary so much and the factory set filter settings just weren't cutting it for many owners.

It's hard to tame down such a wide front end when you are in an active RF environment with a ton of high power signals just a few kHz away from your target frequency.
Even UPMan suggested that the SDS series may not be the proper choice for the users into analog and other signal types but that was before they came out with the filter settings which did help most users a ton!

I was about to return my 100 when they came out with the filter settings in a new firmware. That did the trick for me and most of my problems were worked around using different filters.

One thing I don't see mentioned here is how well these SDS radios work for those that travel a lot. If the filter settings are so locale dependent for each user, how do these SDS radios handle things when put into a mobile environment and taken across the country.

How did your BNC adapter get so black?! Mine is still as shiny as the day it was new but mine does always have something attached so that probably keep dirt out.

The paperclip trick can work but only if you are still within range of at least one site's towers when trying it. If it works, that basically tells you that playing with antennas may help. I don't think I'd want to be out mobile with a paperclip sticking out of my radio!
 

jonwienke

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The "paperclip trick" is a kludge that occasionally happened to work by attenuating the signals from all but one simulcast transmitter below the receiver's noise floor. It's a terrible and useless idea for mobile reception, and a variable attenuator is far more likely to work in a fixed location. But even a variable attenuator only works sometimes. If the strongest two transmitters have roughly equal signal strength, you can't attenuate one away without losing both.

But a SDSx00 renders the problem moot--it can handle simulcast without kludges.
 

Cruiseomatic

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Its only inside where the stinger slides in thats black. Don't know how either. And speaking of SDR, I ordered one from amazon the other day and got it last night. Was a complete hell getting it installed then trying to figure out why it was over driving audio so hard...... I'd rather pay double in taxes every check than do that again. But it does work now and works well. Drops all the way down to 500kc up to like 1.21 gigawatts. Haven't found any software I like yet but did discover that every 100kc starting in the ELF range up past 10 meters, there is a oscillating beep that has a very tight shot group. You're off by one hert and its gone but is very strong when you hit it.
Other than that, All I've got is aviation and 2 "pirate" radio stations so far. Decided to get the sds100. Won't/can't be this month but soon.
Now I'm trying to figure a way to clean the inside of this bnc. Don't know how when the antenna covers everything unless the two metals aren't playing nice. Or its a off form of corosion from the humidity?
 
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