Sentinel Database Update & Favorites?

iMONITOR

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When you do a complete database in Sentinel, does it also update your Favorites with any changes that occurred, IE: assigned TGID and Channel Name? Or do you have to recreate your Favorites? I was assuming it was but now I wonder.
 

Saint

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When you do a complete database in Sentinel, does it also update your Favorites with any changes that occurred, IE: assigned TGID and Channel Name? Or do you have to recreate your Favorites? I was assuming it was but now I wonder.
No it does not make any changes to you favorites
 

iMONITOR

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No it does not make any changes to you favorites
Wonderful! :mad:

I can understand why you might not want them to if you have special edited channel names, etc, but it should be an option to update or not to update them. Lower Michigan just had a bunch of changes. It would probably be easier at some point to recreate them then to try to keep up with editing them.
 

Saint

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Wonderful! :mad:

I can understand why you might not want them to if you have special edited channel names, etc, but it should be an option to update or not to update them. Lower Michigan just had a bunch of changes. It would probably be easier at some point to recreate them then to try to keep up with editing them.
Try and get Uniden to make any changes to this software
 

belvdr

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Yeah the current implementation isn’t good. I’d like the ability to lock an object so Sentinel wouldn’t overwrite. Otherwise it would be the default.

Does @ProScan support this method?
 

ofd8001

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I do not believe that Proscan or ARC536 will automatically update Favorites Lists as part of a database update. Neither of these will facilitate updating the full database and thus as a secondary operation any Favorites Lists updating.

While this question has come up numerous times in the past and been debated, I'm glad Sentinel doesn't "mess with" Favorites Lists as part of a database update. I organize my FLs differently than the database has them. Plus I've deliberately omitted channels from Favorites Lists because I'm not interested in them. Favorites Lists are exactly that - a limited selection of my Favorite things. If I wanted to listen to everything, I'd just turn the full database on.

For Sentinel to do a decent job of updating Favorites Lists, it would have to read the mind of a user. Supposing a fire department added a bunch of channels, but a user may not be interested in anything fire? Or what about me changing the alpha tags to something that works better for me - would Sentinel undo my work and replace it?

Doing an update if there is even major changes, such as a new county coming on line with a regional system, doesn't take too much effort.
 

tvengr

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It is good that the database does not update favorites lists. It would insert all of the frequencies and talkgroups that you didn't want to monitor when you created the favorites list. Also, I edit the names of most alpha tags. I find that the ones in the database often are very confusing what they actually are.
 

iMONITOR

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It is good that the database does not update favorites lists. It would insert all of the frequencies and talkgroups that you didn't want to monitor when you created the favorites list. Also, I edit the names of most alpha tags. I find that the ones in the database often are very confusing what they actually are.
I'm not sure why it would add anything to your favorites. My thinking was to have it update any "changes" within your Favorites, and as I said make it optional with a simple check box.
 

tvengr

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The question is, do you want changes such as new frequencies and talkgroups added to your favorites lists or do you want to do it manually? I prefer doing my own changes to keep the favorites list the way I like it. There would have to be a list of options to select which changes would be made.
 

powerhouse

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I've long wanted the favorites lists updated with the database. I do understand that a lot of users don't for various reasons but a simple "Do you want to update your favorites lists with the latest entries for those systems" check box would work for both camps. If you've already got fire, police, ems etc. set for monitoring, then why can't it update the systems you've got in your favorites list with latest database entries for those departments. This should be user selectable for those that want it with a simple check box. Default would be not to update the favorites lists.
Also, I would like to see "profiles" changed. When I see "profiles" my thinking is, well, a totally different "profile" sort of like the "V folders" in the older GRE models.
These 2 issues have caused much confusion with many users in my area and I see that they also come up from time to time here as well.
This seems like such a simple fix if Uniden were to try to implement them. Simply add the option of updating the favorites list if you so choose and make one profile totally different from another, like having separate radios that can be programmed at will. Each one completely independent from each other and not sharing favorites lists between them unless you want them as part of your new "profile".
 

jonwienke

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I've long wanted the favorites lists updated with the database. I do understand that a lot of users don't for various reasons but a simple "Do you want to update your favorites lists with the latest entries for those systems" check box would work for both camps.
It's not that simple. Mixing and matching which edits to keep and which edits to discard gets messy fast. The only viable solution would be to have a MS Word-style revision tracking and approval system, where the user is asked separately about each difference between the database and favorite list. For large favorite lists, that gets tedious really fast.
 

belvdr

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It's not that simple. Mixing and matching which edits to keep and which edits to discard gets messy fast. The only viable solution would be to have a MS Word-style revision tracking and approval system, where the user is asked separately about each difference between the database and favorite list. For large favorite lists, that gets tedious really fast.
It is simple, if Uniden or RR were to assign a primary key to each object. You can then update specific objects efficiently.
 

RBMTS

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I seem to remember a discussion UPMAN was having about this topic several years ago. I don't remember if it was on this forum, the Uniden run HP forum, or something on Groups.IO. It was impossible (as I remember) for Sentinel to update the favorites list as people may make name changes, mode changes, service changes, etc. The effort to compare/analyze/update was too much great of a programming task. Plus the fact that the MDB is segmented by state/county/city. The favorite lists are not. Other than the GPS coordinates, there would be no way of Sentinel knowing where the favorite list entry belonged to. Also because people can manually add in their own frequencies to the favorites list or even make a total manual list. The thought/decision was that owners would manage and update their own private favorite lists as needed and that Uniden would only update the master database.

I for one am glad that favorite lists are not touched or modified. I prefer to use my own naming conventions and alter the service tags as needed.
 

jonwienke

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It is simple, if Uniden or RR were to assign a primary key to each object. You can then update specific objects efficiently.
They do; Uniden/Sentinel uses the unique object ID assigned by RR internally to connect systems, departments, sites, site frequencies, and channels. But that doesn't address the issue of conflict resolution when the database entry doesn't match the FL entry. There is no way to algorithmically choose whether to ignore a change/conflict between the database and a FL. You'd have to ask the user to choose how to handle every single individual conflict, whoich would spam the UI every time you updated the database. And even more people would complain about that.
 

belvdr

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They do; Uniden/Sentinel uses the unique object ID assigned by RR internally to connect systems, departments, sites, site frequencies, and channels. But that doesn't address the issue of conflict resolution when the database entry doesn't match the FL entry. There is no way to algorithmically choose whether to ignore a change/conflict between the database and a FL. You'd have to ask the user to choose how to handle every single individual conflict, whoich would spam the UI every time you updated the database. And even more people would complain about that.
A global option would make this quick work. Want the FLs updated automatically, then check the box. Another option available on each object would prevent an overwrite there. There’s no need to prompt the user at all.

Essentially, use the same design as the global filters.
 

jonwienke

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A global option would make this quick work. Want the FLs updated automatically, then check the box.
Updated how? If there is a difference between a FL and the database, there are 4 possible options:
  1. Propagate the change from the database to the FL.
  2. Ignore the difference.
  3. Delete an item in a FL that doesn't exist in the database.
  4. Add an item from the database that doesn't exist in the FL.
Explain how the computer will select the correct option without querying the user for each difference.
 

ofd8001

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We have talked about this several times previously. Some folks want updated Favorites Lists, others do not. I'd say unless we were united in our wishes, Uniden won't be making any chances, notwithstanding Upman's passing.

If nothing else, perhaps those desiring changes could ask Proscan/Butel to modify their programs to accomplish that.

I don't see anything productive in additional discussion.
 

iMONITOR

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We have talked about this several times previously. Some folks want updated Favorites Lists, others do not. I'd say unless we were united in our wishes, Uniden won't be making any chances, notwithstanding Upman's passing.
We don't have to be united in our wishes at all. As I suggested give users a choice with a simple check box to update Fav's or not.
 
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