short Runway?

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MFR401

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New to airband can someone tell me when the towers tell the pilot short runway clear for takeoff what does that mean??


Thanks in advance!!
 

737mech

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New to airband can someone tell me when the towers tell the pilot short runway clear for takeoff what does that mean??


Thanks in advance!!
One of two possible reasons, 1. Pilot has requested to enter the runway early instead of going all the way to the end. Usually because the plane doesn't need the whole runway it can take off with half etc.
2. Possible construction has closed an end portion of the runway so it is the tower's job to remind the pilot of that.
 

wtp

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short is just that

i have always understood it as not needing the entire runway for landing or take-off.
if there is construction on a runway it is just closed. if for any reason you could not take off what do you think might happen?
 

Ronaldski

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Hold short means to stop at the taxiway short of entering the active runway. Usually its to wait for another plane that is inbound final, taking off or sometimes its waiting in line to taxi onto the runaway to takeoff.

Watch this explains a lot - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fTW0_ecWlWc

and the tower - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uccaSHOfxJ0

the 4 minute mark or so essentially is hold short

Another http://www.hulu.com/watch/215058#i0,p8,d0

Most of the aviators episodes are on amazon prime and on your PBS station
 
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navaidstech

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You don't tell a pilot to hold short of a runway and clear for take off in the same breath. Either MFR401 got two separate instructions put together or the tower is advising the pilot that the runway he is departing from is shorter than normal.
 
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N0IU

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Reminds me of the time the new pilot took his friend up for a ride.

They were up there quite a while and the pilot noticed that they were running low on fuel and decided to land as soon as possible.

He notices a small airport off in the distance. He tells his friend that the runway looks pretty short, but he is going to try and land there anyway.

He tells his friend, "When I touch down, I need you to help me with the brakes to make sure we don't go off the end of the runway."

So he touches down and they both step on the brakes as hard as they can. The tires are smoking as the nose gear stops right on the end of the runway.

Wiping his brow, the pilot says, "That is the shortest runway I have ever land on!"

And his friend says....

"Yeah, but look how wide it is!"
 

rwier

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New to airband can someone tell me when the towers tell the pilot short runway clear for takeoff what does that mean??
Thanks in advance!!
Hi MFR,

As others have noted, several instructions from the tower are similar, but with very different meanings. I am not a pilot, but I have spent a few hours in small planes as a guest, and have spent hundreds of hours listening to tower-pilot activity. And, I would opine, that "short runway clear for takeoff" is not a sequence of words that I remember hearing. Next time listen very closely and report back with an exact quote.
 

rwier

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..... Either MFR401 got two separate instructions put together ........
Especially if the scanner was "scanning" several channels at once (approach, departure, ground control, etc.). "short runway" might be the last part of one instruction, and "clear for takeoff" the last part of another instruction.
 

Jay911

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In my neck of the woods, when given an instruction (or, more likely, permission) to depart from anywhere but the threshhold (end) of a runway, it's given as either the taxiway intersection or another easily identifiable descriptor, i.e. "G-ICU2, cleared for takeoff from C2 on runway 15" or "cleared for takeoff midpoint runway 15".

"Short", as others have said, is almost universally used to refer to either holding before entering a runway or taxiway ("hold short") or to be prepared to not use the entire runway when landing ("land short, simultaneous intersecting runway operations in use").
 

rwier

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i hope you listen to an airport with smaller planes and not the "heavies".
Well, "smaller planes" lately due to health/travel restrictions, but much "heavies" back a bunch of years. I suspect that your comment is not totally friendly, but I don't get it?
 

kennyloatman

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According to the FAA handbook section 5-8, it states that a short runway refers to "takeoff area is short or available takeoff area is restricted, pilot is to limit the planes takeoff performance capabilities ". Could be any number of reasons for short runway.
 
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kennyloatman

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ATC 45 mins! Pilot Communications Windy London Heathrow Airport 5th Dec 13 - YouTube

At least at the 4:00 and 11:40 mark heard saying short as in 'hold short' certainly heathrow doesn't necessarily have the short length runways.
I think we are mixing two different commands, Hold short runway and short runway are two different things. The way the OP writes what he heard is in reference to a short runway restriction. I agree with you, "hold short runway" means stop before entering.
 

wtp

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always freindly

there is a weight thing about airplanes above a certain weight the are "heavy" 300,000 pounds
if i got it its small , large, heavy. so at a large airport most would be large or heavy.
i am around a little airport that is half and half, little experimental and md80 and 737's.
and we finally got a tower like 3 years ago.
it is with the little guys that i would hear land short or take off short, they don't need the mile of runway that the big guys do
 

tjwgrr

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I think we are mixing two different commands, Hold short runway and short runway are two different things. The way the OP writes what he heard is in reference to a short runway restriction. I agree with you, "hold short runway" means stop before entering.
Or it could be LAHSO.... Land and Hold Short (operations) "Cleared to land RWY 22R, hold short RWY 27L."
 

MFR401

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JFK Tower

I heard yesterday JFK tower tell a plane you have a short runway pilot sound like British airways he replied don't understand tower pep lied you are clear for takeoff you have then thousand eighty feet of runway
 

bigjed

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This is just a possibility.I used to do a lot of airband listening at Glasgow UK International Airport.This airport has 2 runways.1 main runway,and what was known as the 'short runway' which intersected the main runway but was only about 1/2 the length.It was used mainly by flying clubs,but I do recall hearing controllers tell pilots to 'use the short runway'.The term 'clear takeoff' is a legal term and gives pilots information that it is safe to go,and 'clear immediate takeoff' means that there are aircraft approaching to land imminently and the departing pilot shouldn't hang around too long.So the term 'short runway clear for takeoff' could mean exactly that.'You have permission to take off from the short runway'Or then again,I could be completely wrong......that has happened before,right enough.
 
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