SPRINGFIELD, Mo. -- Tony Cascio enjoys listening to his scanner, keeping up with the calls for police and firefighters around town.
The Hays Daily News
The Hays Daily News
Springfield, Mo. - Police: Broadcasting personal info necessary
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Hooligan
Member
Do any states still use SSNs as driver's license #s these days, or are subjects undergoing field investigation volunteering their SSNs to police (who have the right to ask for it, but not demand it)?
I fondly remember back in the day before cell phones, where boaters would contact the 'Marine Operator' on a couple semi-duplex VHF Marine Band channels that were allocated for ship/shore phone patches. Some would call collect, but many poor, unsuspecting boaters would give out their AT&T Calling Card # and devious land-lubbers sometimes dozens of miles inland could copy down that AT&T Calling Card # & use it at any pay-phone to call anywhere in the world...
I fondly remember back in the day before cell phones, where boaters would contact the 'Marine Operator' on a couple semi-duplex VHF Marine Band channels that were allocated for ship/shore phone patches. Some would call collect, but many poor, unsuspecting boaters would give out their AT&T Calling Card # and devious land-lubbers sometimes dozens of miles inland could copy down that AT&T Calling Card # & use it at any pay-phone to call anywhere in the world...
hoser147
Member
Times have changed, Identity theft knocked us out of some good listening. Now days its the number and run and hold. But its all for the protection of the public. Traffic was pretty open for many years and anyone with a pad and pencil or a recorder could do some pretty hefty damage to ones financial world as stated above.
SSN's
Using SSN's as DL #'s or even printing it on a DL is now prohibited by Federal Law.
Intelligence Reform and Terrorism Prevention Act of 2004
President Bush Signs Public Law 108-458, the Intelligence Reform and Terrorism Prevention Act of 2004
Using SSN's as DL #'s or even printing it on a DL is now prohibited by Federal Law.
Intelligence Reform and Terrorism Prevention Act of 2004
President Bush Signs Public Law 108-458, the Intelligence Reform and Terrorism Prevention Act of 2004
mikepdx
Member
I'm sure this still happens.
I'm amazed at how many Credit Card numbers with expiration dates
are broadcast on the two way by tow-truck drivers to their base for an authorization number.
They should be using the cell phone...
But then, if the tow driver is out in the sticks, out of cell phone range, what other option does he have?
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sacscan
Member
This has been a pet peeve of mine for years. I wish they would turn on encryption when they put personal info over the air. What really cracks me up is when they put an entire credit card number over the air to see if the card is stolen. If it wasn't before, it might be after that!
Yes, I know most departments don't have encryption, but how about using the cell phone/Nextel for personal information? I've told officers to run me on the MDT before when I was a witness to a crime. They asked for my name and DOB, so I became concerned that they might want to run me on the records channel. I don't want my personal information going out over a clear frequency.
Yes, I know most departments don't have encryption, but how about using the cell phone/Nextel for personal information? I've told officers to run me on the MDT before when I was a witness to a crime. They asked for my name and DOB, so I became concerned that they might want to run me on the records channel. I don't want my personal information going out over a clear frequency.
The only nice thing I can say about this sort of activity is that the payoff is relatively low. In other words, you're not likely to hear many SSN's on the air over any given time. There are much more target rich places to hit.
Nevertheless, I agree, I wish police would find some better way to communicate that data. Even a text message on a phone would be better than sending it on the air.
Nevertheless, I agree, I wish police would find some better way to communicate that data. Even a text message on a phone would be better than sending it on the air.
Hooligan
Member
When it comes to *their* personal info occasionally needing to be passed, they'll seem to go out of their way to protect it -- sending it via mobile data computer, pager, PCS-phone/Nextel, etc.
Out here in California, PDs, at least major ones, seem pretty good. For example if there is a hidden key or a gate code PD/FD needs to access property they're responding to, they'll dispatch everything over their regular non-secure radio system but then the dispatcher will say "I'm sending the gate code to your pager."
I suspect at least a small part of the personal privacy protection is that it seems like in California, most police officers & fire fighters have some sort of 4-year college degree.
I really don't want to monitor tow truck freqs out here, but the few times I've had to use one, they've had some sort of credit card reader system that swipes the card & then uses some RF data link to debit my account. Taxis do the same thing out here. I *assume* that link is encrypted. It's an advantage of living in the fairly high-tech San Francisco Bay area, whereas taxis & tow trucks out in the boonies might still just be giving out the credit card info over non-secure voice radio. Seems like the credit card companies have some leverage in terms of requiring or at least pressuring enterprises to take steps to protect the credit card info.
If Visa tells a cab company "We are terminating your ability to accept Visa credit & debit cards from your customers, due to a record of credit card fraud cases traced back to how you handle the CC information they give you" that'd be a major incentive for the cab company to take corrective action.
It's interested how HIPAA mandates that medical workers protect the privacy of patients -- San Francisco FD seemed to use HIPAA as an excuse to encrypt some or most of their 800MHz TRS talk groups, but often if you listen closely to police, fire & EMS channels you can get an exact address of the patient from the dispatch (then use a web resource to get the name & phone # of who lives there), then by listening to the EMS/MED channel as they're heading to a hospital you can get the basics ("54 year old black male with hematoma from an unwitnessed mechanical fall, unknown loss of consciousness, ETOH aboard, family members advise patient is also anemic...") & if police were on-scene due to a potential crime, patient being combative, etc. you might catch the police running that suspect/victim's name & DOB over the air, and then hearing the dispatcher provide a rundown of any criminal background.
The most disturbing, saddest thing we scanner geeks sometimes hear is the name of a recently deceased person, for example from a solo car crash, given out over the air. It's weird to hear that, and know that we who are listening-in as a recreational hobby know that the individual is dead, while his or her family members & friends don't even know that yet.
I understand the concern and also would like to see it changed, but I don't really understand why they would go publishing this in a newspaper. It puts it out there for anyone who wants to use this information to commit fraud like "Here you go...free info you never knew was there..." Kinda like when they used to broadcast the list of major airports that failed security checks. Should be addressed quietly. Just my opinion tho.
sacscan
Member
I agree, which is why I bit my tongue until that article was posted here. I didn't want to @#$% about it here and give the bad guys any ideas.
I also hate it when our local media broadcasts cutbacks in police patrols. Let's just give the criminals an open invitation to commit more crimes, why don't we?
GTO_04
Member
There is no way they would turn encryption on and off like that. They would go to full time encryption first.
If enough people whine about this, they will go to encryption.
GTO_04
I know that NY is not using SSN's as DL information anymore.
I agree with the posters who talked about alternatives to encryption. Departments could just as easy and perhaps easier use MDT's or cellphones for giving SSN's out, rather than putting them over the air in any form.
I agree with the posters who talked about alternatives to encryption. Departments could just as easy and perhaps easier use MDT's or cellphones for giving SSN's out, rather than putting them over the air in any form.
SSNs over the air
I spent Valentine's weekend in Reno & Sparks Nevada. I was shocked how many times SSNs were broadcast. I don't understand why they are even needed, as they were always broadcast with a DL # as well.
The link did not work for me. Perhaps the newspaper took the article off line.
FLA2760
Member
They only put the last four numbers of a SS# over the air here. Can't say I ever heard a credit card number though.
Hooligan
Member
I was kinda thinking the same thing this morning when on the news they announced the USG's plan's to send _____ number of Marines into ____ section of Afghanistan starting ____, and then it'd be followed up with ____ number of Army troops, mostly from the ____ Division, who are expected to be deployed there from ____ until _____.
Anyway, the catch-22 for a lot of us --some more than others-- is that it's annoying to hear LEA's give out a suspect or victim's personal info on the air & they should try to use other methods, yet 'we' don't want them to run encryption most of the time because it'd ruin 'our' entertainment, and then there's the secondary claimed reasons like waste of taxpayer $$, it enhances police misconduct, etc.
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