Status of 10-119. Public fact.

[tj20]

i guess radio waves could affect some people but i would think thats very rare these people like the fcc link lady has no idea how often she is exposed to them only when she is aware of it does she feel "sick" its in there head i would say

Yep, and I hope these people don't shop at Walmart. Our whole store is covered by wifi for our handhelds,our time clocks, and free wifi for customers

 

[Delta33]

Hmmm,

I have to wonder if they think that the Gmrs repeaters in the US are just going to "magically" go away by declaring GMRS a license by rule service?? Sorry, but I dont see it....

 

[N2DLX]

Here's the comment I submitted to the FCC which contains the survey at the end.

https://ecfsapi.fcc.gov/file/7020910922.pdf

 

[12dbsinad]

Here's the comment I submitted to the FCC which contains the survey at the end.

https://ecfsapi.fcc.gov/file/7020910922.pdf

Well drafted.

The only thing that stood out to me is the mention of older PLMR wideband radios being used on GMRS. There was no mention on the fact that "technically", these units need to met part 95 certs. MANY do not. Is it a big deal? Not really. But something to ponder.

 

[mmckenna]

Here's the comment I submitted to the FCC which contains the survey at the end.

https://ecfsapi.fcc.gov/file/7020910922.pdf

Nice job Rich.
Makes me wish I still had my GMRS license....

 

[RFI-EMI-GUY]

Here's the comment I submitted to the FCC which contains the survey at the end.

https://ecfsapi.fcc.gov/file/7020910922.pdf

Was this survey done in 2010? Reason I ask is I logged in a couple weeks ago and the same or similar survey popped up for me to complete. Are you planning another submission to the FCC?

Sent from my SM-T350 using Tapatalk

 

[RFI-EMI-GUY]

Well drafted.

The only thing that stood out to me is the mention of older PLMR wideband radios being used on GMRS. There was no mention on the fact that "technically", these units need to met part 95 certs. MANY do not. Is it a big deal? Not really. But something to ponder.

I think we need an NPRM to grandfather or allow permissive certification of Part 90 radios which meet the power and emission specs of Part 95A.

I would be willing to draft something if I could get help with graphically comparing emission masks for wide band Part 90 vs 95A. The text describing those masks differs in method. It has been a while since I reviewed those, but it looked to me that you could not simply compare the text, you need an overlay graphic.

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[bharvey2]

Of course, those same amateurs have no problem with anyone with a GMRS license being allowed to use amateur bands, right?

You called that one!

 

[bharvey2]

I've got a flyer I picked up once that was put out by a self appointed "safety watchdog" group when the local electric/gas utility was rolling out smart meters. It's similarly worded. I framed it and keep it on the wall of my office as a general reminder about how the uneducated public views radio waves.
A few years before that, we were rolling out a outdoor distributed antenna system at work for the cell carriers. We had to do public meetings. We had a lady show up that was 100% whackjob crazy. She was complaining about all the psychosomatic-self diagnosed-hypocondriac issues she had, how awful it was being her and how everyone in the world needed to get rid of radio waves to fix it. She had this little cheap box with a meter on it. It was supposed to tell her when she was getting attacked by the evil RF radiation. My co-worker and I were sitting directly behind her and our manager was running the meeting. I reached over behind my co-worker and keyed up his 800MHz radio. The lady's box beeped, she jumped up out of her seat and started yelling how it was happening again.
Anyway, every few minutes I'd do it just to keep her on her toes. I'm probably going to hell for it.
After a few times, our manager kind of looked at us and just shook his head. We grinned and went back to being good little boys.

Oh, I love that story! Not RF related but be went through the same public meeting thing at work for a project we were working on. All of the regulatory agencies were on board with what we wanted to do but we had the one crazy lady (Sounds just like yours) that was just going nuts. She knew nothing about what was going on but was sure it was bad. This nonsense seems to be more common these days and it will no doubt sully the GMRS band in the long run for those who use it to its fullest potential.

 

[n1das]

Nice job Rich.
Makes me wish I still had my GMRS license....

What mmckenna said. Nice job Rich!

I am essentially "meh" toward GMRS now that I have successfully migrated all of my local GMRS simplex activity to 100% digital (VSELP) on 900MHz w/FHSS using Motorola DTR series handhelds. They have been working EXCELLENT and exceeding all expectations. My wife loves them too and she's not a ham but loves chit-chatting on radios with me as we have integrated our use of 2-way radio into our daily lives. They are perfect and simple radios and she loves using them.

I'm finding the DTR performance equals or beats what you can do on simplex with 4W UHF Part 90/95 commercial handhelds on GMRS. The DTRs won't replace high powered mobiles and repeaters on GMRS and I didn't get the DTRs for that purpose. While I still have GMRS capability, the DTRs have replaced my use of GMRS for local on-site simplex type use where I tend to use GMRS the most. I am expecting GMRS to get castrated by the FCC when the FCC makes GMRS license by rule and renders it a bubble pack only service. I was open to alternatives and new technologies that might work better and also wanted an all digital solution which will probably never happen on GMRS.

DTR audio test: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aaNdMWPmVZI
IMHO the digital audio sounds better than P25 Phase 1, DMR, and 6.25k and 12.5k NXDN. From experience with all of these formats, I say the DTR audio beats them all.

Have fun!

 

[UPMan]

Uniden is trying to screw the licensed GMRS community.

Actually, by our comments we are trying to preserve the licensed GMRS community by:
a) Making the bubble-pack radios FRS only (but this does expand the current definition of FRS to include 22-channels/2W ERP max, which what has been sold into the market now for about 15 years).
b) No longer allowing license-by-rule radios to also have licensed service type acceptance (i.e. no "bubble pack" radios allowed to have repeater operation, operate at higher than FRS power, no combining of GMRS with any non-licensed service in one radio).
c) Enforce narrowband on all 22 FRS channels.

8 channels would continue to be dual-service, but GMRS radios would be allowed higher power, removable antennas, require explicit licensing, be allowed to operate with repeater pairs, etc. These same channels implemented in a radio type accepted as FRS would be limited to 2WERP max, not be allowed to have a removable antenna, etc.

Encroachment into the GMRS has de facto happened for 15 years (well, 20 years if you count the original FRS), and we don't believe, with millions of radios sold, it is practical to put that genie back in the bottle. But, our proposal effectively freezes out any additional encroachment and preserves GMRS.

 

[RFI-EMI-GUY]

Actually, by our comments we are trying to preserve the licensed GMRS community by:
a) Making the bubble-pack radios FRS only (but this does expand the current definition of FRS to include 22-channels/2W ERP max, which what has been sold into the market now for about 15 years).
b) No longer allowing license-by-rule radios to also have licensed service type acceptance (i.e. no "bubble pack" radios allowed to have repeater operation, operate at higher than FRS power, no combining of GMRS with any non-licensed service in one radio).
c) Enforce narrowband on all 22 FRS channels.

8 channels would continue to be dual-service, but GMRS radios would be allowed higher power, removable antennas, require explicit licensing, be allowed to operate with repeater pairs, etc. These same channels implemented in a radio type accepted as FRS would be limited to 2WERP max, not be allowed to have a removable antenna, etc.

Encroachment into the GMRS has de facto happened for 15 years (well, 20 years if you count the original FRS), and we don't believe, with millions of radios sold, it is practical to put that genie back in the bottle. But, our proposal effectively freezes out any additional encroachment and preserves GMRS.

The industry could simply stop marketing these 22 channel radios and quit pretending that buyers will comply with FCC licensing.

Market 14 channel radios for FRS and focus on designing higher performance radios specifically for GMRS.

Use price and performance as a means to differentiate GMRS products from FRS.

There is no reason FRS requires more than 14 channels and a slew of privacy codes.

Uniden could market a plug and play GMRS repeater to round out their offerings.

By the way GMRS radios can operate wide band mode, so it is senseless to cripple the performance of the GMRS radios now offered.

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[jonwienke]

The industry could simply stop marketing these 22 channel radios and quit pretending that buyers will comply with FCC licensing.

Which does nothing to stop people from using the millions of radios already sold.

That horse left the stable years ago, and it is idiotic to think anyone can put that genie back in the bottle.

 

[12dbsinad]

Which does nothing to stop people from using the millions of radios already sold.

That horse left the stable years ago, and it is idiotic to think anyone can put that genie back in the bottle.

One thing to remember is a lot of these millions of radios are extremely cheap with no replaceable parts. Lucky if they survive a few years before getting thrown in the trash and new ones purchased (if ever).

I think the genie can eventually be put back, rather quickly.

 

[RFI-EMI-GUY]

Which does nothing to stop people from using the millions of radios already sold.

That horse left the stable years ago, and it is idiotic to think anyone can put that genie back in the bottle.

Most of them are junk and will quite literally crumble away in a few years time. I have some FRS radios whose poorly vulcanized rubber antennas and buttons have oozed and crumbled away.

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[jonwienke]

I have 2 pairs of FRS/GMRS radios I bought in the late 1990s, and they still work fine. Expecting all the bubble back radios to magically disappear if outlawed is naive and unrealistic.

 

[RFI-EMI-GUY]

I have 2 pairs of FRS/GMRS radios I bought in the late 1990s, and they still work fine. Expecting all the bubble back radios to magically disappear if outlawed is naive and unrealistic.

Sure I have some ICOM IC-4008A's that are as good as they were new. I have only had to re adjust the TCXO's.

On the other hand years later I bought a slew of Panasonic FRS radios that were very nice with scanning feature and they have rubberized antennas and cases that are oozing silicone and others crumbling away. I can't for the life of me figure out why I haven't thrown them away, as even though they work, they are functionally useless.

I will agree there are millions of 22 channel bubble pack FRS/GMRS combos out there, but if the marketing of 22 channel radios is halted, then new radios cannot talk to old on the GMRS interstitial's and the compliance will improve.

There is no need for greater than 14 FRS channels. It is simply a marketing ploy, "Buy this radio, it has 22 channels 38 privacy codes 836 "private channels". Don't wait act today and you get * 36 mile range * included free".

The manufacturers are pushing this stuff because it costs them absolutely nothing to pack in the extra 7 channels.

If your neighbor decided it would be cool to be able to park 6 cars instead of 4, would you be OK with him paving over YOUR lawn???

 

[N9NRA]

The industry could simply stop marketing these 22 channel radios and quit pretending that buyers will comply with FCC licensing.

Market 14 channel radios for FRS and focus on designing higher performance radios specifically for GMRS.

Use price and performance as a means to differentiate GMRS products from FRS.

There is no reason FRS requires more than 14 channels and a slew of privacy codes.

Uniden could market a plug and play GMRS repeater to round out their offerings.

By the way GMRS radios can operate wide band mode, so it is senseless to cripple the performance of the GMRS radios now offered.

Sent from my SM-T350 using Tapatalk

Amen to this post! I`ve been thinking this ever since the FRS radios first came out, why didn`t they just make FRS units do only the 14 channels they had for FRS with the lower power limit and such? Has anyone ever listened to (meaning scanned) the FRS channels? I have just to see how far i can hear them low-power units, and i can say that even with the non-removable antenna them units can still get out, i did me some scanning of the FRS channels when i was on the way to the Milwaukee train station to head to Dayton, heard some activity on the FRS channels that i was able to recieve for a goodly few miles just with the stuck duck on my scanner, was able to copy signals from where i first started hearing it (just outside of the last bus station before MKE) out to another two miles (at least) after we left that station and were almost to Milwaukee, so one really dosen`t need lots of juce (power) if you`re gonna be using just FRS. N9NRA

 

[nd5y]

Amen to this post! I`ve been thinking this ever since the FRS radios first came out, why didn`t they just make FRS units do only the 14 channels they had for FRS with the lower power limit and such? Has anyone ever listened to (meaning scanned) the FRS channels?

When FRS was first created there were only 14 channel units and no 22 channel FRS/GMRS radios. It was a few years later that the FCC approved dual service radios.

I scan all the FRS GMRS channels and hear stuff on the 467 MHz FRS only channels all the time.

 

[WPXS472]

All this talk of cheap bubble pack radios in the millions and the FCC being unable to police them got me to thinking. You can get a Baofeng for about $30. it operates over two pretty wide frequency ranges with about 5 watts of power. You don't have to provide any kind of proof of licensing to get one, as far as I know, So, what is to prevent millions of folks from getting them and just talking where ever they wanted? I suspect the two main things are that they don't really know about them, or don't understand what they are. Or, that the user interface is too difficult for the average non radio user to understand how to get frequencies into them. Since they aren't required to be type accepted, there is little the FCC can do to stop them being sold. Speaking of which, why aren't they restricted to ham frequencies only? I dont recall them even being advertised as ham radios. I think I got mine off Amazon. Just how do they manage to keep being sold?