Has anyone else noticed the new talk groups for air life? I have received 2808 and 2810 so far off the Greeley South tower. They are using the talk groups in flight (previously not allowed?) for status and location updates.
Shawn
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Talk Group 2808 & 2810 Lifeguard
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WaveRunner
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Heard these two, believe it was Flight For Life. Also heard AdComm talking to AirLife yesterday for chopper go on TG 3996 and stated it was "airnet". I'm thinking 2808 and 2810 might be patches.
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Aircraft are only allowed to affiliate on a few select sites so as not to cause interference. That includes other aircraft such as CSP and CAP. Does anyone here have a list of the allowed sites?
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That's possible as TG's 2801, 2804, 2805 and 2809 have also been showing up.
Moosemedic
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Interference?
Why would an aircraft cause any more interference than a ground unit on top of a hill?
This isn't the old days of "everyone is on FERN" and a 110 watt syntor without PL tones would light up the entire front range
Isn't the whole idea of site controllers and voting systems to make sure the aircraft is only capturing one single site?
Why would an aircraft cause any more interference than a ground unit on top of a hill?
This isn't the old days of "everyone is on FERN" and a 110 watt syntor without PL tones would light up the entire front range
Isn't the whole idea of site controllers and voting systems to make sure the aircraft is only capturing one single site?
What if the bird is at 2000' AGL and grabs a site 100 miles away. Then the site far away now has to carry additional traffic it normally wouldn't. This is no different when agencies outside of the metro area travel to Denver and have their radio on. I love listening to Durango PD in Denver ;-)
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Here is the CCNC policy on aircraft using DTRS:
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It won't, but I have heard through the grapevine that they have been the source of substantial problems in the past, particularly when the aircraft is being a spotter for a surveillance operation or during speed checks.
No - since frequencies are re-used across the system, the fact that a signal can travel and cause interference can't be overcome. Not with an interference susceptible modulation like analog or those used in P25, anyway.
Moosemedic
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I think the reason they've been a "substantial problem in the past" is the past situation, (and was mentioned by another poster) for example speed traps were run often on CSP 3. And at altitude, sure, they'd hit a variety of sites. And if there was no PL, then those would repeat and the area blanketed is larger.
If a Helicopter, flying 1,000' AGL has a radio with a limited number of sites programed, and each site is looking for that authorized radio on a specific control channel, and they select a talkgroup close to them, there's not much likelihood that you're going to be hitting sites a long way away. Even as you fly along, there's still only going to be a specific control channel, looking for an authorized user, and carrying the conversation forward. If a helicopter from northern Colorado gets up in the air and wants to talk to an agency out on the eastern plains, it's not going to have the same control channel, and the site (for example) hit near Estes Park, won't have Milken Fire's talkgroup on it. They'd have to have, perhaps, Glenwood Springs Fire's talkgroup in their radio, and selected, to cause a problem with affiliation while traveling
The DTRS is not intended for a HEMS crew to call DHMC from Grand Junction (although I think you could), if used for a med report, it's when calling the New St. A's as they pop out over Green Mountain. The effect wouldn't be that much different than a West Metro unit on top of Green Mountain with an injured bike rider. And with the power output limited to 3 watts on a fixed unit in the aircraft, and a directional antenna with a downward pattern, as it's designed to work.
Besides that, how often is this going to be in use for statewide conversations? You're talking about an aircraft, communicating with a ground unit just prior to landing, and perhaps those departing Thank You's from each agency. Without direct communication, you're still seeing HEMS using FERN, NLEC, HEAR etc, while in the air, and if the juridictional communications center has FERN patched to their 800 system, and that's left open 24/7, I can see the potential from an airborne transmission on FERN going to MANY MANY agencies that have left the patch active. Isn't it LESS likely that having an authorized user, on a recognized radio on a predetermined control channel, on the agency underneath the aircraft's talkgroup, talking to an Engine on the ground during landing, have a more discreet conversation than blasting everyone on a FERN-to-800 talkgroup?
I'm just wondering how much of this is a byproduct of not understanding how DTRS works, history from a system that's not designed for aircraft, and the "turn off your cellphone or we'll crash" FAA hype.
All food for thought
If a Helicopter, flying 1,000' AGL has a radio with a limited number of sites programed, and each site is looking for that authorized radio on a specific control channel, and they select a talkgroup close to them, there's not much likelihood that you're going to be hitting sites a long way away. Even as you fly along, there's still only going to be a specific control channel, looking for an authorized user, and carrying the conversation forward. If a helicopter from northern Colorado gets up in the air and wants to talk to an agency out on the eastern plains, it's not going to have the same control channel, and the site (for example) hit near Estes Park, won't have Milken Fire's talkgroup on it. They'd have to have, perhaps, Glenwood Springs Fire's talkgroup in their radio, and selected, to cause a problem with affiliation while traveling
The DTRS is not intended for a HEMS crew to call DHMC from Grand Junction (although I think you could), if used for a med report, it's when calling the New St. A's as they pop out over Green Mountain. The effect wouldn't be that much different than a West Metro unit on top of Green Mountain with an injured bike rider. And with the power output limited to 3 watts on a fixed unit in the aircraft, and a directional antenna with a downward pattern, as it's designed to work.
Besides that, how often is this going to be in use for statewide conversations? You're talking about an aircraft, communicating with a ground unit just prior to landing, and perhaps those departing Thank You's from each agency. Without direct communication, you're still seeing HEMS using FERN, NLEC, HEAR etc, while in the air, and if the juridictional communications center has FERN patched to their 800 system, and that's left open 24/7, I can see the potential from an airborne transmission on FERN going to MANY MANY agencies that have left the patch active. Isn't it LESS likely that having an authorized user, on a recognized radio on a predetermined control channel, on the agency underneath the aircraft's talkgroup, talking to an Engine on the ground during landing, have a more discreet conversation than blasting everyone on a FERN-to-800 talkgroup?
I'm just wondering how much of this is a byproduct of not understanding how DTRS works, history from a system that's not designed for aircraft, and the "turn off your cellphone or we'll crash" FAA hype.
All food for thought
rdrunnermedic
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Hearing 2808 referred to as "AIRMED 800" this afternoon. Yesterday I noted a fair amount of traffic between "Comm Center" to "Lifeguard 5" at locations in Southern Colorado. This afternoon I heard "Comm Center" attempting to contact "Lifeguard 1" on 2808 calling the TG "AIRMED 800". All of this traffic is coming off the Smoky Hill tower.
I'm fairly confident that "Comm Center" is the St. A's Flight for Life Comm Center, since Lifeguard 1 and is one of their birds. Not sure about Lifeguard 5 though. I'm still hearing traffic on the 130.150 AM frequency, but it doesn't appear as though the 2808 talkgroup is patched to it.
Also of note, I have not heard any comms on the old D&C 10 (462.975) since SAC moved to Lakewood. I have, however, been hearing the FFL CCT's on the SAC ER talkgroup (81 on the DTRS).
I'm fairly confident that "Comm Center" is the St. A's Flight for Life Comm Center, since Lifeguard 1 and is one of their birds. Not sure about Lifeguard 5 though. I'm still hearing traffic on the 130.150 AM frequency, but it doesn't appear as though the 2808 talkgroup is patched to it.
Also of note, I have not heard any comms on the old D&C 10 (462.975) since SAC moved to Lakewood. I have, however, been hearing the FFL CCT's on the SAC ER talkgroup (81 on the DTRS).
04Z1V6
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This is a newer entry in the database it is however listed as lifeguard air ambulance. I have also heard this referred as airmed 800 on the same tower as well.
Comm Center is indeed FFL dispatch and there having to use DTRS now for flight following since they've expanded there operations.
L/G 1 = Denver
L/G 2 = Frisco
L/G 3 = Colo Springs
L/G 4 = Pueblo
and
L/G 5 = Durango
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rdrunnermedic
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Thanks for the info. I had no idea that FFL had a LG 5 down in Durango. It'll be interesting to see what the other 28xx series talkgroups turn up as. I have a feeling that not all of them belong to SAC/FFL. So far I've not heard anything on 2810 or the others.
On another semi-related note, I have not noticed any changes for AirLife. CCT's continue to operate on D&C 9 (462.950) and helos are still on 129.275 AM.
rckydenver
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Alittle off topic on TG's here but saw this on KCNC website. Med Copper in Vail.
Addition Of Medical Helicopter In Vail A Huge Help « CBS Denver
Addition Of Medical Helicopter In Vail A Huge Help « CBS Denver
That's Tristate Careflight and they've been based in Eagle Airport over a year but are now moving to Vail during the day.
Thanks Tom
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rdrunnermedic
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It appears as though I spoke too soon about FFL's use of D&C 10. Yesterday I caught an L/G unit communicating with the SAC Comm Center on D&C 10 (462.975) with the normal PL of 136.5. However, the "Terra" CCT units are still showing up mainly on the SAC ER talkgroup (81 on DTRS).
Edited to say: I'm not sure what criteria they are using to dictate which radio system to use (Air AM, UHF, or DTRS), but I think its a good idea to leave all these frequencies in play if you're monitoring FFL.
Edited one last time to add: Does anyone have any frequency info for Tristate Careflight? These are not the same guys that do Careflight in Grand Junction right?
Edited to say: I'm not sure what criteria they are using to dictate which radio system to use (Air AM, UHF, or DTRS), but I think its a good idea to leave all these frequencies in play if you're monitoring FFL.
Edited one last time to add: Does anyone have any frequency info for Tristate Careflight? These are not the same guys that do Careflight in Grand Junction right?
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Mick
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I've been wondering who the use was on 462.975 136.5 for the last couple of months I've been hearing them from my location in Colorado Springs. They seem to be in Jefferson County a lot of the time. I could not locate this frq/tone in the database. Thanks rdrunner_medic.
That's always been DC 10 (Med Channel 10) in the metro area used primarily my St A's comm center since ambulances are now using cell phones or hospital TG's for there med reports.
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