Gus00
Member
http://www.gtconnect.com/articles/2004/10/17/news/top_story/gtsun01.txt
There’s a bit of an explanation at the end of the story.
There’s a bit of an explanation at the end of the story.
Television transmits ELT signal...
- Thread starter Gus00
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I think this story is a hoax. None of the CAP or Benton County names check out. There's no mention of this incident, which occured on October 3, until the AP picked it up on the 18th.
all the stories on the web are basically repeats of this first AP story. There's no mention of it on the Oregon CAP homepage, AFRCC homepage, or the Benton County or Corvallis police blotters. I've never heard anyone who's an experienced ELT chaser say "All electronics...create a tempest." We'll see but I think this story was planted by this 20 year old college student.
all the stories on the web are basically repeats of this first AP story. There's no mention of it on the Oregon CAP homepage, AFRCC homepage, or the Benton County or Corvallis police blotters. I've never heard anyone who's an experienced ELT chaser say "All electronics...create a tempest." We'll see but I think this story was planted by this 20 year old college student.
HabboX
Member
Yes, the names check out. Do a search on Google on these names and you will find that all the names can be referenced on the web independent of the story.
So. Why would there be mention on these organizations pages? Stories that make regular news don't usually get mentioned in the blotters. The story was in the Corvallis newspaper. The story was written by Jennifer Nitson of the Corvallis Gazzette-Times.
Planted the story?
JamesO
Member
TV L.O. leakage and noise battery charger!!
Not sure if the mentioned TV had the alternating tones, however, I suffered for years when a TV in the next door neighbors house wiped out my 123.05 MHz Helo channel with a spur every night. I finally tracked it down and found out the neighbor had a timer on the TV to watch the 10 PM news in his bedroom!! It seemed it was a local oscillator in the tuner section that was the problem. If he changed the channel, the spur would move. Problem was, there was only 1 channel with the 10 PM news!!
I knew him quite well, so he let me in to check out his TV, problem was, the TV was way out of warranty and nobody had ever worked on it (no shielding left out or disturbed). I tried a bit if shielding, still not luck.
I also had a rechargeable shaver that would trash the VHF spectrum when its charging cycle was completed. The charger would go into a pulse mode at the end of the charging cycle until it was unplugged. The pulse mode would really though out some wide band trash that would cover a few 100 MHZ!
I finally moved, so I was finally rid of the TV problem and the shavers NiCad's finally went bad so I no longer have these 2 problems!!
I guess TV's and electric shavers need to be added to the long list of electric blankets, aquarium heaters and doorbell transformers that have given some folks headaches over time!!
You just never know what will send out stray RF signals!
JamesO
Not sure if the mentioned TV had the alternating tones, however, I suffered for years when a TV in the next door neighbors house wiped out my 123.05 MHz Helo channel with a spur every night. I finally tracked it down and found out the neighbor had a timer on the TV to watch the 10 PM news in his bedroom!! It seemed it was a local oscillator in the tuner section that was the problem. If he changed the channel, the spur would move. Problem was, there was only 1 channel with the 10 PM news!!
I knew him quite well, so he let me in to check out his TV, problem was, the TV was way out of warranty and nobody had ever worked on it (no shielding left out or disturbed). I tried a bit if shielding, still not luck.
I also had a rechargeable shaver that would trash the VHF spectrum when its charging cycle was completed. The charger would go into a pulse mode at the end of the charging cycle until it was unplugged. The pulse mode would really though out some wide band trash that would cover a few 100 MHZ!
I finally moved, so I was finally rid of the TV problem and the shavers NiCad's finally went bad so I no longer have these 2 problems!!
I guess TV's and electric shavers need to be added to the long list of electric blankets, aquarium heaters and doorbell transformers that have given some folks headaches over time!!
You just never know what will send out stray RF signals!
JamesO
colheli
Member
This occurs more often than you would realize. The TV is probably microprocessor controlled. Meaning it probably has a small microprocessor, just like your computer does. This microprocessor will control the tuner section, probably the power supply voltages, and other functions. All microprocessors use a clock signal for timing. This is the "speed" rating you see you on computers: 450 Mhz, 1.6 Ghz, etc. The oscillators that provide this clock signal can produce harmonics, as well as the clock signal itself. If the harmonics are somehow amplified enough, then this kind of thing can happen. This is why you have to turn cell phones off, once an airplane is ready to take off. The RF harmonics from the cell phone can easily interfere with the navigation equipment on the aircraft.
Without dragging this out, I did a Google search and could find no reference to the CAP squadron leader or the Benton County SAR deputy. If you have some links, I'd appreciate it since your search skills are apparently better than mine. The only name that did check out was the Toshiba PR rep but there's also no press release about this on the Toshiba site.
I realize the story was in the Corvallis paper and that seem to be source of the the AP and Reuters stories. I'm curious why an incident that happened on October 3 was only being reported on October 18.
I also realize that many electronic items emit spurious emissions. However, in 25 years of search and rescue, we've never chased an ELT signal that came from anything other than an ELT. An ELT emits a distinctive, two tone signal that I can't imagine being duplicated by a spurious emission. The SARSAT has also picked up some open carriers on 121.5 that we have tracked down to aircraft radios but every 121.5 alert I've been involved in was caused by something aircraft related. I suppose there's a first time for everything but I would think that every model of this TV would be emitting the same spur on 121.5 and this is the first I've heard of it.
I realize the story was in the Corvallis paper and that seem to be source of the the AP and Reuters stories. I'm curious why an incident that happened on October 3 was only being reported on October 18.
I also realize that many electronic items emit spurious emissions. However, in 25 years of search and rescue, we've never chased an ELT signal that came from anything other than an ELT. An ELT emits a distinctive, two tone signal that I can't imagine being duplicated by a spurious emission. The SARSAT has also picked up some open carriers on 121.5 that we have tracked down to aircraft radios but every 121.5 alert I've been involved in was caused by something aircraft related. I suppose there's a first time for everything but I would think that every model of this TV would be emitting the same spur on 121.5 and this is the first I've heard of it.
Re: TV L.O. leakage and noise battery charger!!
If it was mistaken for an ELT signal, it must have. I'm not involved in aircraft SAR, but I have heard ELT signals. They are very distinctive.
Even the searchers made mention that they at first figured it was somplace known for this - they didn't give any indication this was anything other than an ELT signal.
Joe M.
JamesO said:
If it was mistaken for an ELT signal, it must have. I'm not involved in aircraft SAR, but I have heard ELT signals. They are very distinctive.
Even the searchers made mention that they at first figured it was somplace known for this - they didn't give any indication this was anything other than an ELT signal.
Joe M.
HabboX
Member
From the April '03 Corvallis Mountain Rescue Unit Newsletter
http://cmru.peak.org/Newsletters/03apr.pdf
At our April Unit Meeting, Benton County Emergency Manager and SAR Coordinator, Mike Bamberger, gave a presentation on Incident Command System (ICS).
From an April '04 article on the CAP website
http://level2.cap.gov/visitors/news...5757&newsID=125&year=2004&month=9
Peeling away the boxes, Sr. Mbr. David Mandrell, antenna-less off frequency LElper in hand, called out that he found a box from the Emergency Beacon Company (EBC). EBC is a major manufacturer of ELTs. Further, the beeping sound and radio signal was coming from the box.
Do you need anymore links?
Don't you track down strong open carriers transmitting on 121.5 that might be eminating from a defective ELT?
John,
Thanks for the links. At least that ties the names up with the story, which makes it a little more believable.
Yes, we do track down open carriers on 121.5 and have had a few although not from ELT's. They have always been from defective aircraft radios. As I said in my previous post, I would assume that every model of this particular Toshiba must have the same spurious emissions problem and we certainly haven't been flooded with Toshiba TV ELT signals in the Bay Area. I was also intrigued by the fact the guy said he doesn't have cable and the picture showed a set of rabbit ears on top of the TV. The must be one heck of a spur to be picked up by the SARSAT from a set of rabbit ears.
Thanks for the links. At least that ties the names up with the story, which makes it a little more believable.
Yes, we do track down open carriers on 121.5 and have had a few although not from ELT's. They have always been from defective aircraft radios. As I said in my previous post, I would assume that every model of this particular Toshiba must have the same spurious emissions problem and we certainly haven't been flooded with Toshiba TV ELT signals in the Bay Area. I was also intrigued by the fact the guy said he doesn't have cable and the picture showed a set of rabbit ears on top of the TV. The must be one heck of a spur to be picked up by the SARSAT from a set of rabbit ears.
HabboX
Member
It is possible that some shielding got knocked loose. Sometimes TV manufactures just tape a piece of shielding in place instead of designing the proper attachment.
You would be surprised at how effective rabbit ears antennas can radiate. It wouldn't surprise me if the Christmas tree lights, that you can see strung up on the back wall, helped to get the signal outside of the apt.
Who strings up Christmas lights in early October?
You would be surprised at how effective rabbit ears antennas can radiate. It wouldn't surprise me if the Christmas tree lights, that you can see strung up on the back wall, helped to get the signal outside of the apt.
Who strings up Christmas lights in early October?
mikegilbert
MHz so good
http://www.cnn.com/2004/SHOWBIZ/TV/10/18/odd.television.reut/index.html
Uh...yeah it's true...the TV station I work at did an interview with the guy. Corvallis PD as well as SAR and CAP all showed up at his door. Have fun trying to disprove this "story" but the facts are there....Just to be sure I watched an aircheck of the news last week....yup it's true.
-Mike
Uh...yeah it's true...the TV station I work at did an interview with the guy. Corvallis PD as well as SAR and CAP all showed up at his door. Have fun trying to disprove this "story" but the facts are there....Just to be sure I watched an aircheck of the news last week....yup it's true.
-Mike
Mike,
I've seen the CNN story and seen the interview with this guy. I have no doubt he told you what he said happened. I have yet to see an interview with any of the CAP, PD, or SAR personnel that showed up. Any idea why this story took over two weeks after the event to show up in the news?
I wonder if Toshiba is going to test the "free" TV they're sending him for 121.5 spurs?
I've seen the CNN story and seen the interview with this guy. I have no doubt he told you what he said happened. I have yet to see an interview with any of the CAP, PD, or SAR personnel that showed up. Any idea why this story took over two weeks after the event to show up in the news?
I wonder if Toshiba is going to test the "free" TV they're sending him for 121.5 spurs?
mikegilbert
MHz so good
To be honest...the story showed up in a college paper before any "big" media outlets picked it up. We treated it like many other stations did- as a "kicker" story. All the stations treated the story with a sense of humor and unfortunatley didn't interview any LE/SAR personel on camera. I can assure you we called the Benton Co. PD to confirm the story.
I hope this clears things up (a bit)
A couple of months ago we were taken for a ride by some meth-head with a kite. We recieved 20 calls in 30 minutes regarding a UFO over West Eugene. We went out there when a reporter saw the lights with her husband as they were driving. The next night we recieved many calls and went out to investigate. The "UFO" had crashed in a tree....the meth-head was standing in the front yard of someone's house with a Kite with LED's on it.
We ended up making a 3-minute package out of it- needless to say we all had a good time.
-Mike
I hope this clears things up (a bit)
A couple of months ago we were taken for a ride by some meth-head with a kite. We recieved 20 calls in 30 minutes regarding a UFO over West Eugene. We went out there when a reporter saw the lights with her husband as they were driving. The next night we recieved many calls and went out to investigate. The "UFO" had crashed in a tree....the meth-head was standing in the front yard of someone's house with a Kite with LED's on it.
We ended up making a 3-minute package out of it- needless to say we all had a good time.
-Mike
unitcharlie
a Kentucky DB Admin...
with apologies....
my question... an ELT puts out enough power make a SARSAT hear it.... i am also waiting for my first ufo sighting....
my question... an ELT puts out enough power make a SARSAT hear it.... i am also waiting for my first ufo sighting....
mikegilbert
MHz so good
http://www.kezi.com/content/contentID/8666
and
http://www.kezi.com/content/contentID/8815
oh...and
http://www.ufosnw.com/eugenetri.htm
I knew I could find the story somewhere....if only you could see a picture of the guy who pulled the prank.
-Mike
and
http://www.kezi.com/content/contentID/8815
oh...and
http://www.ufosnw.com/eugenetri.htm
I knew I could find the story somewhere....if only you could see a picture of the guy who pulled the prank.
-Mike
unitcharlie
a Kentucky DB Admin...
with apologies....
wonder why he didn't borrow the elt tv?
wonder why he didn't borrow the elt tv?
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