This is how they sell radios.

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SCPD

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Yes I watched it and as I said before they are pushing their mototrbo digital system without telling anything what narrow band actually is, just a marketing ploy to make the money and most radios made in the last 10 yrs are narrow band compliant but they will not bother to tell you that,Motorola saw the chance to sneak in their new system at the same time narrow band requirements were mandated.
 

JRayfield

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Did you also notice that he said that people should contact their local dealer, to learn more about narrowbanding? This was obviously not meant to be an 'in depth' look at narrowbanding.

Motorola has published 'in depth' materials that clearly explain the details of narrowbanding, including the fact that many radios currently in use today, can be reprogrammed for narrowband 'mode'.

John Rayfield, Jr. CETma

Yes I watched it and as I said before they are pushing their mototrbo digital system without telling anything what narrow band actually is, just a marketing ploy to make the money and most radios made in the last 10 yrs are narrow band compliant but they will not bother to tell you that,Motorola saw the chance to sneak in their new system at the same time narrow band requirements were mandated.
 

SCPD

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Did you also notice that he said that people should contact their local dealer, to learn more about narrowbanding? This was obviously not meant to be an 'in depth' look at narrowbanding.

Motorola has published 'in depth' materials that clearly explain the details of narrowbanding, including the fact that many radios currently in use today, can be reprogrammed for narrowband 'mode'.

John Rayfield, Jr. CETma[/QUOTE

Most organizations who know nothing about radios to begin with and are susceptible to marketing hypes and think what they are told is the only option they have, JRayfield you are quick to defend Motorla at every angle they use to sell their equipment. I am saying is the radio dealer should explain in normal layman terms what the customer needs to get compliant and if the equipment they have now is narrow band capable and not jump in with the mototrbo sales pitch.

BTW Mr.Rayfield I have read a good deal of your posts in other forums on RR it seems you know it all so please do not bother me again with some defensive answer about my mototrbo comments because talking to you is about like having a conversation with a brick wall,you think you are correct in all aspects of all conversations...Have a Good Day!!!
 
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JoeyC

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Their business is to sell products.
Their video is in no way misleading.
It is the responsibility of the consumer to know what they are buying.
No understanding of the product? Ask someone who does.
 

SCPD

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Their business is to sell products.
Their video is in no way misleading.
It is the responsibility of the consumer to know what they are buying.
No understanding of the product? Ask someone who does.
I am not going to argue with you about this, it may work in your land of fruits and nuts but in Alabama we do things different.if it is not broke don't fix it,IMO its a more of a Mototrbo promo than anything they seem to emphasize on mototrbo and do not mention other narrow band equipment alternatives,Motorola wants to control all the radio systems everywhere and make it where no other brand is compatible with their system.

As far as responsibility of the consumer to know what they are buying most have no clue about radio systems and are at the mercy of some slick talking sales person,I guess that is why one city dumped their system and went back to analog they were pushed into buying mototrbo and it did not work for them causing to many interoperability problems with other departments.....thats all I have to say about that.
 
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JoeyC

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Has nothing to do specifically with Alabama. People are griping about the same thing across all the states. If there were a Mototrbo scanner out there, nobody would be griping about anything.
 

SCPD

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I am not going to argue about it.....some people are natural jerks
 
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JRayfield

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I agree that the dealers should clearly explain what narrowbanding is and make sure that that their customer understands it. It irritates me when I hear of an agency that was told that they must move to digital (of any kind, including P25) in order to meet the Jan. 1, 2013 deadline.

Radio users should be given all of the options (and that might include a "MOTOTRBO sales pitch"), not just one option, especially if that one option is to purchase new equipment when it may not be necessary. I do not agree 100% with everything that Motorola does, or what some Motorola dealers do. You assume that and you're VERY wrong.

As to thinking that I'm 'right' in all aspects of all conversations, I am when I'm stating 'facts' about MOTOTRBO, because I know about MOTOTRBO. If you're referring to conversations regarding the use of MOTOTRBO by public safety agencies, I'm also very familiar with the topic of communication systems and rural public safety agencies, as I work with them almost every day. As to thinking that I'm 'always right', in general, no way. I'm always learning. That's one of the reasons why I do like MOTOTRBO from a technical perspective - it's something new to work with and to learn about. I even use it on the 440 mhz amateur band.

As long as people make erroneous statements about MOTOTRBO, I will respond, to correct that misinformation. People often look to those on forums such as this as the 'experts' in communications. It isn't fair to anyone if misinformation is spread about any aspect of communications, and that includes MOTOTRBO.

It's too bad that so many people want to spread their incorrect opinions, stating them, not as opinions but as facts, and then get mad and defensive when the true facts are pointed out.

John Rayfield, Jr. CETma


Did you also notice that he said that people should contact their local dealer, to learn more about narrowbanding? This was obviously not meant to be an 'in depth' look at narrowbanding.

Motorola has published 'in depth' materials that clearly explain the details of narrowbanding, including the fact that many radios currently in use today, can be reprogrammed for narrowband 'mode'.

John Rayfield, Jr. CETma[/QUOTE

Most organizations who know nothing about radios to begin with and are susceptible to marketing hypes and think what they are told is the only option they have, JRayfield you are quick to defend Motorla at every angle they use to sell their equipment. I am saying is the radio dealer should explain in normal layman terms what the customer needs to get compliant and if the equipment they have now is narrow band capable and not jump in with the mototrbo sales pitch.

BTW Mr.Rayfield I have read a good deal of your posts in other forums on RR it seems you know it all so please do not bother me again with some defensive answer about my mototrbo comments because talking to you is about like having a conversation with a brick wall,you think you are correct in all aspects of all conversations...Have a Good Day!!!
 

JRayfield

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I won't argue with anyone on the subject of 'slick talking salepeople'. I know they exist in the radio communications industry, just like they exist in all areas of business. And I've seen systems that were obviously sold by someone like that. It's very unfortunate.

Will you tell us who that city was that dumped their MOTOTRBO system? I'd really like to know, as that's the first case of something like that happening that I've heard of anywhere in the country.

All kinds of ways exist for providing interoperability between MOTOTRBO and other systems.

Did you know that P25 conventional and P25 trunking are NOT 'interoperable', without additional radio equipment and 'bridging' systems? And did you know that similar types of 'bridging systems' will work between MOTOTRBO and other systems? Interoperability does not have to be a problem with MOTOTRBO, no more than between P25 conventional and trunking.

John Rayfield, Jr. CETma

I am not going to argue with you about this, it may work in your land of fruits and nuts but in Alabama we do things different.if it is not broke don't fix it,IMO its a more of a Mototrbo promo than anything they seem to emphasize on mototrbo and do not mention other narrow band equipment alternatives,Motorola wants to control all the radio systems everywhere and make it where no other brand is compatible with their system.

As far as responsibility of the consumer to know what they are buying most have no clue about radio systems and are at the mercy of some slick talking sales person,I guess that is why one city dumped their system and went back to analog they were pushed into buying mototrbo and it did not work for them causing to many interoperability problems with other departments.....thats all I have to say about that.
 
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SCPD

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My apologizes but the comments I made had you further explain what I wanted to know sorry if it took some picking but I got it out of you opinions and all...Thanks!!!

Jasper Police Dept in Alabama abandoned their system I think it was mototrbo from the articles I have read
 
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JRayfield

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Sometimes, I hate email and forums, because it's too hard to 'express' ones thoughts accurately (at least it is for some of us - I'm talking about myself here <G>). People get irritated at each other, and actually, they agree on more than they disagree on. I fully agree with you on some of what you've expressed. I feel the same way that you do, when salespeople don't give 'full disclosure' to a customer, because they want to sell something specific. In my opinion, that's not being ethical.

Thinking back to the Motorola 'Narrowband' video, I do really see a little bit of what you were talking about. While it obviously isn't an 'in depth' discussion of narrowband, and it does suggest speaking with a local dealer, they could have added the fact that this is -one- option that some may want to consider, when looking at what to do about narrowbanding. As it is, the title itself tends to give the impression that you're going to learn more about 'narrowbanding', and not just 'MOTOTRBO'. Do I understand what you were getting at, now?

I'm sorry that my response didn't how I 'think' about all of this, at first. I'll honestly try to do better on this. And please 'pick' all you want - sometimes that's the only way to get the 'right' information. :)

I've noticed that it seems that some (maybe many?) dealers, who are selling MOTOTRBO to public safety agencies, aren't thinking enough about interoperability. It can easily be achieved, but it takes knowledge, work, and some money.

John Rayfield, Jr. CETma


My apologizes but the comments I made had you further explain what I wanted to know sorry if it took some picking but I got it out of you opinions and all...Thanks!!!

Jasper Police Dept in Alabama abandoned their system I think it was mototrbo from the articles I have read
 
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I'm not anti-Turbo, whatever gets the job done is what they should use. I wouldn't buy a MotoTRBO scanner if there was one out there, it would just wind up being an expensive weather radio when the next digital technology comes along.
 

JRayfield

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With all of the manufacturers that are building DMR-based (MOTOTRBO compatible) equipment, and the fact that it is 6.25 khz equivalent, I think it will be around for a long time. But, then again.... :)

John Rayfield, Jr. CETma

I'm not anti-Turbo, whatever gets the job done is what they should use. I wouldn't buy a MotoTRBO scanner if there was one out there, it would just wind up being an expensive weather radio when the next digital technology comes along.
 

cdknapp

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Just like I have been saying about narrow banding vs: digital- you don't need digital to be narrow-band compliant........ 'nugh said.
 

JRayfield

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That's true. Narrowband analog will meet the new rules.

However, some users who have moved from analog wideband to analog narrowband have experienced a drop in coverage. The 'math' indicates that a system will show a 3db drop in coverage, when moving from wide to narrow analog. Digital systems, such as MOTOTRBO, not only gain that 3db back, but also give an additional gain of around 3db more (so, an approximate 6db gain over analog narrowband). That's one of the reasons why some people are moving from wideband to digital (such as MOTOTRBO) rather than moving to narrowband analog.

John Rayfield, Jr. CETma

Just like I have been saying about narrow banding vs: digital- you don't need digital to be narrow-band compliant........ 'nugh said.
 
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