Toronto Police Service will use Encrypted radio system by june 2010

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Jammin_Jay

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Well it looks like the Toronto Police service will have an encrypted radio system in service by june , ready for the G20 summit.

But they willnot give specifics on the type of radio system, in concern for security of the G20 summit.

"A communications insider said police are still maintaining the old Motorola radio system, but also testing encrypted radios for use in sensitive areas such as the emergency task force, undercover operations and summit preparations, in conjunction with the RCMP."

Tim Pacan, manager of Radioworld in GTA...
Radioworld, at Steeles Ave. W. and Highway 400, caters to scanner enthusiasts who listen in to learn what's going on in their neighbourhood.

"Obviously, they'll be shut out," said sales manager Tim Pacan.

Mark Pugash, director of public information for Toronto police says....
"There is no enshrined right" of the public or news media to listen in on emergency calls, despite the freedom they've had to do so until now.

"Our job, in communicating with each other, is to resolve situations safely and be able to deploy our people safely and effectively," he said..

Meanwhile, the prospect of a blackout is causing anxiety to those who routinely monitor police, fire and ambulance calls, including media outlets, independent tow-truck drivers and scanner buffs. For suddenly stranded motorists, it may mean a longer wait for a tow – and for drivers stuck behind a stalled vehicle or an accident, a longer backup.




Here is the article in Todays...Toronto Star.

http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/crime/police/article/777589--police-radios-will-shut-public-out
 
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Jammin_Jay

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If they plan to keep the old motorola system. I wonder what will be encrypted. All TPS talkgroups. and will it be a new 700 mhz system deployed for certain comms encrypted of course.
 
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mciupa

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I guess there will be a huge scanner sale at Radioworld come the later part of the year, after the stock begins to gather dust. :twisted:
 

bigcam406

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cant see it happening by june,and as far as the article stating that the opp has shut out the public with their new digital system,well........
 

FoeHammer

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Well almost every time you come to this site you see another towns public safety agency going encrypted
Its rolling like a tidal wave now , even if its a rural 2 deputy town , sad,... I personally dont understand it but whatever ,... Ill be looking for a sale on something to monitor marine bands I guess since thats about all thats left ,...for now
 

MetalCarnage

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cant see it happening by june,and as far as the article stating that the opp has shut out the public with their new digital system,well........
I did get a chuckle reading that part of the article this morning.

We all knew this day would come though, so no surprise, its just a matter of how long till it happens. I was definitly not impressed that they ruined my breakfast by making me think about encryption lol.

I do find it funny how they use the word eavesdropping to start the article, they make us sound like we are sticking our ear up to the proverbial wall and trying to listen to the whispers next door. We always get put in such a negative light, like we are up to no good by listening in on TPS, if anything i think we help, i for one keep a lookout for say suspect cars if a robbery just occured, or if an amber alert is released i keep a lookout for the child or the car involved.

I think if anything we can be more help then hinderance by listening, but thats IMO

Countdown to the end of the world ladies and gentlemen...i mean the end of scanning TPS, LOL
 

mobile1

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Toronto to go P25

I did a Google search of City of Toronto's website today and found nothing about this, but I did find that they will spend almost $100 million over the next 3 years to upgrade their radio system to the P25 standard.
 

MetalCarnage

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I did a Google search of City of Toronto's website today and found nothing about this, but I did find that they will spend almost $100 million over the next 3 years to upgrade their radio system to the P25 standard.
I have already assumed long ago that everything would go encrypted, i am just glad that when OPP rebuilt there system they didnt go encrypted right away.
 

rdale

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"A communications insider said police are still maintaining the old Motorola radio system, but also testing encrypted radios for use in sensitive areas such as the emergency task force, undercover operations and summit preparations, in conjunction with the RCMP."

Meanwhile, the prospect of a blackout is causing anxiety to those who routinely monitor police, fire and ambulance calls, including media outlets, independent tow-truck drivers and scanner buffs. For suddenly stranded motorists, it may mean a longer wait for a tow – and for drivers stuck behind a stalled vehicle or an accident, a longer backup.
I'm south of the border so explain to me -- how would encrypted special ops channels impact the length of time you wait for a tow? Do tow truck drivers monitor stings in order to know where the broken down car is located?
 

MetalCarnage

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I'm south of the border so explain to me -- how would encrypted special ops channels impact the length of time you wait for a tow? Do tow truck drivers monitor stings in order to know where the broken down car is located?
Two seperate paragraphs, two seperate thoughts, you are confusing yourself in thinking they are inter related. First paragraph is about how they are CURRENTLY testing the new system on those talkgroups while the second paragraph is talking about how when the ENTIRE system is finally up it will be fully encrypted, meaning tow truck drivers will not be able to listen for accidents and respond as quickly to get cars off the highway
 

HzzrdsFnst15

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I am in Ajax and listen in on Toronto (police) almost everyday. I use the br330T trunk tracker scanner. I have it in the scanner, but rarely listen in Durham Fire. I have programmed EMS in but find the often noises that are not radio transmissions to be annoying. It sounds like tones you hear when using a modem to dial online with. (if someone knows how to get rid of them, that would be useful information I could use).

My point is I am not picking up much other then Toronto, and when their system is no longer listenable what (other then the Durham systems) is my scanner good for?

I see another Ajax listener in the post here, and I assume they use the digital to monitor OPP, but it is obviously not equal to listening to TPS? Meaning, you heard Highway stuff at best with OPP correct?

I also asked in the ScanOnt group a few times about what I can generally receive from AJAX, I got little response other then AJAX is tough to monitor anything further then real local coms as AJAX is in low elevation.

So what is there to gain if maybe choosing a Digital Scanner to monitor from AJAX when TPS is all gone?
 

colby4601

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You keep saying that the entire system will be encrypted, yet you have absolutely no proof of this.

When they do go encrypted on the CIS talkgroups, it only makes sense that they would encrypt sensitive communications anyways.
 
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HzzrdsFnst15

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You keep saying that the entire system will be encrypted, yet you have absolutely no proof of this.

When they do go encrypted on the CIS talkgroups, it only makes sense that they would encrypt sensitive communications anyways.
I would think the same, Cheaper also to leave the typical call outs alone.

Myself what I hear is:

Calls of various kinds, gunshots heard, someone assaulted someone, noise disturbances, and car crashes. It's not often I hear anything following the calls other then sometimes a back up call or a call out to a ambulance being rushed including emergency runs. I often don't hear anything more then what the news prints/broadcasts as well. News often tells me more then what I hear. This is going to cost them a ton to block what we see on the local news anyway? So It does make more sense if the "ETF" are active that they Encrypt them, and the other investigative units.
 

MetalCarnage

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You keep saying that the entire system will be encrypted, yet you have absolutely no proof of this.

When they do go encrypted on the CIS talkgroups, it only makes sense that they would encrypt sensitive communications anyways.
Nope, no proof, just the realization that it will probably happen since other big cities are doing the same.

Will i be happy if they dont go fully encrypted? Well duh, obviously i will, i am just saying i wouldnt hold my breath, because i believe the odds are more towards them going fully encrypted then not. Just makes sense in these times, everyone is uber paranoid and the local "Motorola radio system salesman" is loving it, LOL

And in response to HzzrdsFnst15, i actually listen to OPP a lot more then TPS, i am on the road alot, so i would rather listen to whats going on on the highway then whats going on in TPS. I would say 90% of my scanning time is done in my car. I dont think ajax is a dead zone, i get TPS and OPP crystal clear from Southern Ajax, what more am i missing out on? Those in my opinion are two of the busiest systems in the GTA if you include the fact that the TPS system has fire on it and the OPP Fleetnet system has EMS as well.

As far as your question goes about TPS, regardless if they go encrypted or not, it will 100% for sure be digital like OPP, so any analog scanner will leave you pretty much missing out on the more popular systems.
 

Jammin_Jay

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Well, i will tell you, that this encryption wouldn't of happened this quick june 2010, if it wasnt for the G20 , and also Ottawa putting money into this for Toronto. $5000 each for an encrypted radio as the article indicated, is a lot times the number of radios. Encryption would of eventually happened, but i am saying about the timing of it. The money allocated from Ottawa, was a big boost or this would of took much longer to implement.
 
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scnnr

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"A communications insider said police are still maintaining the old Motorola radio system, but also testing encrypted radios for use in sensitive areas such as the emergency task force, undercover operations and summit preparations, in conjunction with the RCMP."

I am with those that say where does it say that the whole system is going encrypted. No doubt and understandably the G20 and tg's such as Vice/ Detectives & street crime will be encrypted just as they no doubt already are. Why don't y'all wait and see what happens in June before jumping into panic mode.
 

scnnr

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Two seperate paragraphs, two seperate thoughts, you are confusing yourself in thinking they are inter related. First paragraph is about how they are CURRENTLY testing the new system on those talkgroups while the second paragraph is talking about how when the ENTIRE system is finally up it will be fully encrypted, meaning tow truck drivers will not be able to listen for accidents and respond as quickly to get cars off the highway
Where are you getting that paragraph where is says the entire system will be fully encrypted

Again until it actually happens no sense in getting ones shorts all tied up in a knot. Besides if and when it happens ,nothing you can do about it anyhow.
 
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MetalCarnage

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I am with those that say where does it say that the whole system is going encrypted. No doubt and understandably the G20 and tg's such as Vice/ Detectives & street crime will be encrypted just as they no doubt already are. Why don't y'all wait and see what happens in June before jumping into panic mode.
Other media sources stated fully encrypted such as AM 640 and the Toronto Sun
 

MetalCarnage

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Where are you getting that paragraph where is says the entire system will be fully encrypted

Again until it actually happens no sense in getting ones shorts all tied up in a knot. Besides if and when it happens ,nothing you can do about it anyhow.
If you took a minute to read the article that was originally posted instead of blindly commenting on someones post you would know that the Toronto Star was writing the article under the assumption that the new system would be unscannable.....what would dictate a situation where a system was unscannable? Either encryption or a new radio system that is not yet scannable, take your pick and be done with it
 
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