Troy City Council votes on getting new police radios, cutting off public access

Whiskey3JMC

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Such a familiar picture these days. I'm all for having encrypted tac channels which can be switched to if need be but dispatch & routine traffic should remain in the clear. Especially these days when there's an outright assault on our LEOs. There should be a degree of transparency between LE and the public who want to be in the know about the happenings in their local.
 

jonsmth

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I can see both sides of the coin on this topic. I believe in transparency of our local law enforcement but sadly, many criminal enterprises have used the lack of secure communications by law enforcement to illude LEOs. I agree with Whiskey3JMC. There should be transparency but the ability to switch to encryption should be available. It is almost essential to use encryption during drug enforcement and other similar operations.

I'm really surprised it has taken this long for encryption to take effect at the Local Police departments level. As a retired Navy Communicator, I know that the Navy has been using encryption over voice circuits for years. About the only time the Navy uses "clear" communications at sea is in ship to ship hailing (Bridge-to-Bridge) and certain ship to air communications. Even then, call signs, codes and authentication is used on many of the "clear" channels.
 

chrismol1

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How's that P25 system doing they have while they use the analog EDACS? Last I knew the edacs was patched to the P25. Does this mean they're moving to their P25 system with the purchase of new radios? They've had that P25 for what a decade now?
 

SRLFD-613

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How's that P25 system doing they have while they use the analog EDACS? Last I knew the edacs was patched to the P25. Does this mean they're moving to their P25 system with the purchase of new radios? They've had that P25 for what a decade now?
The Troy city schools are on that p25 system and migration is and has been in progress for sometime. they have had the ability to use the system since its been live but only a few cars were equipped with the new digital radios at the time. as far time frame for full migrations weeks to a few months not entirely sure. who knows what they will ultimately end up doing things change on a regular basis. and as FDNY10-75 said theyre already several tgids that are encrypted on both systems........
 

KC2zZe

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I find it amusing that "criminal enterprises" is the only reason cited above as a possible justification as to why an agency would opt to migrate toward encryption of their voice radio systems.
 
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ten13

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I find it amusing that "criminal enterprises" is the only reason cited above as a possible justification as to why an agency would opt to migrate toward encryption of their voice radio systems.
Why?

Is there another one?

Yes, it's unfortunate that radio "enthuisists" may be relagated to listening to Target store security, local tow truck companies, and school buses, but anyone who was a cop during the NYC riots last summer in 2020, or even those "hobbyists" who sat in their air conditioned homes listening to it, realized then that encryption is something whose time has come. Some here had better wake up to that realization.

The amount of intentional radio interference, not to mention false emergency calls coming over CCRs forcing police commanders to re-direct manpower from the looting and mayhem to respond to them, caused unnecessary issues, both in safety of the officers and further destruction caused by the looting and fires.

This has been compounded by the increased number of false emergency calls transmitted over division radios during "routine" patrol.

If anyone has an "issue" with changes in radio equipment as it relates to their misguided belief that they have some Constitutional right to listen to them, translated into "lack of transparency," should realize that there are political processes to address this "transparency" issue regarding information.

But, if you want to blame someone, blame your fellow hobbyists who RAN to eBay to buy the CCRs, making them well-known and easily obtainable to the "criminal element," giving the American-hating Chinese government an opportunity to infiltrate the country with them.

And this is from someone who, as I write this, has four radios going, monitoring all types of emergency services in the NYC area, but who realizes that those days are, unfortunately, coming to a close (and, with at least one agency, that time is here now).
 

chrismol1

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I listend to NYPD, Chicago and other cities during the riots, deliberate interference meant to cause damage. It blows me away that input frequencies for NYPD and other "high risk" agencies are listed in the database. Where exactly does anyone believe they got those freqs for their CCR baofengs anywhere else but there? RR is the top result for googling NYPD freqs. They're not listed anywhere else but here. Of course anyone actually involved in radio could figure these out on their own but that aint the 20 dollar CCR's blasting F the police in response to their cries for help on their lifeline, what an insult

Come on man...
 
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k2hz

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I listend to NYPD, Chicago and other cities during the riots. It blows me away that input frequencies for NYPD and other "high risk" agencies are listed in the database. Where exactly does anyone believe they got those freqs for their CCR baofengs anywhere else but there? RR is the top result for googling NYPD freqs. They're not listed anywhere else but here

Come on man...
All UHF input frequencies are a standard offset so it does not take a genius to determine the input once the output is known. Scanners and the CCRs all will automatically read out the PL/DPL so keeping them "secret" is futile.

The CCRs certainly were a game-changer from concerns about just listening to active interference.

Encryption is certainly necessary for sensitive operations. I am appalled when I hear some agencies in my area on conventional TAC channels with a surveillance operation and they are mentioning addresses and subjects and informants names. I hope they are only code names.
 

ten13

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Encryption is certainly necessary for sensitive operations.
To the average cop, the incident THAT COP IS AT, is a "sensitive operation."

We can't sit "on high," in our easy chairs and radio shacks, and mandate the determination of what is, and what isn't, a "sensitive operation," just to keep going what has been described here as "a hobby."

It blows me away that input frequencies for NYPD and other "high risk" agencies are listed in the database.
If you're going to "blame" RR for the frequency information, then equal blame has to go the eBay, etc, who "allowed" the CCRs to be sold on their platforms. Besides, as stated above, the xmit frequencies (in most cases, but not all) can be determined by way of a mathematic "formula" (for lack of a better term). It's like blaming gun manufacturers for all the crime. If the database was eliminated today, one way or the other, "criminal enterprises" could still come up with the xmit frequencies, if they needed or wanted them.

Just like they do with guns.
 
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ansky

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To the average cop, the incident THAT COP IS AT, is a "sensitive operation."

We can't sit "on high," in our easy chairs and radio shacks, and mandate the determination of what is, and what isn't, a "sensitive operation," just to keep going what has been described here as "a hobby."
Right, and "sensitive" can also refer to private information. I have heard cops give out people's names and social security numbers over the air. I have heard dispatchers giving out alarm codes to private residences over the air. None of this information should be communicated over a clear channel.
 
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