U.S. Forest Service Channel Plans

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SCPD

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CalTopo - Backcountry Mapping Evolved

If that does not come up right then you need to use one of the visitor maps options on the right pull down menu.
Great site! I could spent hours playing with all the features.

If a person is able to write down the lat and long they convert the degree, minute decimal that the Forest Service uses to the degree, decimal system on these maps then its just a matter of scrolling through the map to get the correct position. The availability of the Forest Service topos is fantastic. The Forest Service topos with private land boundaries, forest boundary, road numbers, trail numbers, ranger district boundaries and other features used to be produced by the Forest Service themselves. These maps were not available to the public and sometimes we would run out of quadrangle and have to wait until the next printing. The decision for the USGS and Forest Service to jointly produce the quadrangles that have National Forest land on them was made to reduce costs. They are available for the public as well.

There is a disadvantage when the legal description is given (Township, Range, Section, 1/4 Section). The visitor maps are often cut off at the margins or a National Park map is overlaid and the township/range labels are not available. When I hear a dispatch I'm able to memorize the township, range, section and quarter section by just remembering the numbers, e.g. 3 - 27 - 14 - SE (Southeast). I can't remember the lat, long with the decimals very well. If I'm sitting at a desk and hear the dispatch in time I can have a notepaper and pen ready. I then need a calculator to do the degree format conversion. That conversion has to be made while a lot of command and tactical traffic might be heavy.

On the other hand, looking up the legal description on a map involves having a map that is feet across and dealing with all that paper is a pain. However, if I'm away from my desk or don't have notepaper handy I can't use the lat, long system and have to deal with all the paper.

I'm going to try this site as the advantage of not having to deal with all the paper is enough for me to try it.

Thanks for passing this site along. I'm a map freak and didn't know about it.
 
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SCPD

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Smokey, I was driving thru Anza (hwy 371 riverside co.) yesterday day. I can confirm that BDF Admin Net was 91.5 p.l. At 5 bars signal. Any ideas ?
No idea at all.

I would think that most or all of the Berdo's system can't be received from Anza. This narrows down the repeater you were hearing. Tahquitz and Pine Cove are likely and Tahquitz would be my bet. The last time I drove through Anza was in the 90's so I don't remember the terrain well enough to back up what I'm saying here. That, and it was late evening as I was traveling from a fire on the Cleveland up to the San Bernardino.
 

SCPD

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Request for Feedback

I'm finished with the Wiki page. I've asked the Wiki gods to break the page up and put a link on each forest to its corresponding channel plan and forest description.

I need feedback. Some of my information is old, some of my notes of what I heard on these systems is old and I haven't been traveling as much as I did when I was chasing fires all around the state so I've not had a chance to update my info.

If I've listed the information about a comm center dispatches for, please let me know.

If the information I have regarding the remote bases on a forest is wrong, please let me know.

If my information about the employee radio identifier system is wrong, please let me know. This one involves if you hear someone say "Rec 41, Resources 32" when they are calling someone or they say "462, 352" instead.

If the district numbers don't seem to match, please let me know.

If any thing else doesn't match up with what I've written please let me know.

Rather than post it on this thread, PM me and I will edit the page. It is more efficient that way.

I hope that my effort will help people. If you have questions or think I should include or delete some other information, guess what? Please let me know.

I'm going to take some time off before I move on to writing pages for the National Park Service, BLM and U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service. I want to see if the information from this page is going to work out before doing another. I want to see how the database and Wiki are linked.

Thanks in advance for helping this effort!
 

ecps92

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I would suggest, adding the tones to their own line for each repeater.
This way, each Repeater can be individually confirmed. Having the Tone # list is a nice reference if you hear them refer to tone #, but for actual confirmations having the PL listed to each Repeater as well as a field on the end for "Confirmation/ReConfirmation"

Great Work, I know it took a long time, but (Round of Applause)

I'm finished with the Wiki page. I've asked the Wiki gods to break the page up and put a link on each forest to its corresponding channel plan and forest description.

I need feedback. Some of my information is old, some of my notes of what I heard on these systems is old and I haven't been traveling as much as I did when I was chasing fires all around the state so I've not had a chance to update my info.

If I've listed the information about a comm center dispatches for, please let me know.

If the information I have regarding the remote bases on a forest is wrong, please let me know.

If my information about the employee radio identifier system is wrong, please let me know. This one involves if you hear someone say "Rec 41, Resources 32" when they are calling someone or they say "462, 352" instead.

If the district numbers don't seem to match, please let me know.

If any thing else doesn't match up with what I've written please let me know.

Rather than post it on this thread, PM me and I will edit the page. It is more efficient that way.

I hope that my effort will help people. If you have questions or think I should include or delete some other information, guess what? Please let me know.

I'm going to take some time off before I move on to writing pages for the National Park Service, BLM and U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service. I want to see if the information from this page is going to work out before doing another. I want to see how the database and Wiki are linked.

Thanks in advance for helping this effort!
 

QDP2012

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I'm finished with the Wiki page.... If any thing else doesn't match up with what I've written please let me know. Rather than post it on this thread, PM me and I will edit the page....
The forest-specific information from the United States Forest Service (CA) page has been moved to the related individual forest-specific pages.

The following pages had existing/"old" information on them already. The existing/"old" information was not overwritten. The new/moved information was placed at the top of the page/article. The existing/"old" information was placed at the bottom of that page under the heading "Information to be Reviewed/Confirmed/Deleted".
The existing/"old" information on each of the above pages does need to be reviewed to determine whether it is valid and needs to be kept, or whether it is either a duplicate of ExSmokey's information or is outdated, and needs to be deleted.

A light-grey navigation-table of links was added top and bottom to make it easier to navigate between the national forests in California. Since it is setup as a template, the table can be easily edited or deleted..

ExSmokey, per your request, a PM will be sent with this same message. Thank you for your hard work in maintaining the Wiki.

Hope this helps,
 

SCPD

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The forest-specific information from the United States Forest Service (CA) page has been moved to the related individual forest-specific pages.

The following pages had existing/"old" information on them already. The existing/"old" information was not overwritten. The new/moved information was placed at the top of the page/article. The existing/"old" information was placed at the bottom of that page under the heading "Information to be Reviewed/Confirmed/Deleted".
The existing/"old" information on each of the above pages does need to be reviewed to determine whether it is valid and needs to be kept, or whether it is either a duplicate of ExSmokey's information or is outdated, and needs to be deleted.

A light-grey navigation-table of links was added top and bottom to make it easier to navigate between the national forests in California. Since it is setup as a template, the table can be easily edited or deleted..

ExSmokey, per your request, a PM will be sent with this same message. Thank you for your hard work in maintaining the Wiki.

Hope this helps,
I deleted it all as it was either duplication, outdated or showed only part of the channel plan.
 

ecps92

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I beg to differ a little here, especially being the one who did most of the work on those original pages.

RF Links deleted ??

Yes some was a duplication, however it was created to assist folks with Confirming/Validation of the actual use, tones etc. Listing the info in USFS format (tone #) is fine for USFS, but not for scannists. Especially with Parks/Forests using different Tones on the output which was not the same as the input.

To just delete the info is a bad move w/o discussion as much of the info had been found from actual sites (usfs, bia, blm etc) that listed them in such zones

I deleted it all as it was either duplication, outdated or showed only part of the channel plan.
 

SCPD

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I would suggest, adding the tones to their own line for each repeater.
This way, each Repeater can be individually confirmed. Having the Tone # list is a nice reference if you hear them refer to tone #, but for actual confirmations having the PL listed to each Repeater as well as a field on the end for "Confirmation/ReConfirmation"

Great Work, I know it took a long time, but (Round of Applause)
I don't understand what you are saying. The information I just deleted had a table representing channel 1 and then below that listed each repeater. So for a forest with 12 repeaters on three different nets there would be 36 lines as each tone would have to be listed over again for each channel. Then the table would have to show the other channels in order as well. That seems very cumbersome, not only for writing it, but for the person using the tables.

The point of listing the channel plan as I've shown is to enable a listener to understand what frequency is being used when someone on a forest says "switch to 6," meaning channel 6. If you sat down in an agency vehicle and there was a card showing the channel plan for the radio it would look just like the way I've written it. I worked with this format on the job for a couple of decades in California.

The tables I've written gives people access to the information the database had 10 or more years ago when it was removed because duplicate listings of frequencies was being discontinued.

I don't think a column for conformation is needed given the data source.
 

SCPD

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I beg to differ a little here, especially being the one who did most of the work on those original pages.

RF Links deleted ??

Yes some was a duplication, however it was created to assist folks with Confirming/Validation of the actual use, tones etc. Listing the info in USFS format (tone #) is fine for USFS, but not for scannists. Especially with Parks/Forests using different Tones on the output which was not the same as the input.

To just delete the info is a bad move w/o discussion as much of the info had been found from actual sites (usfs, bia, blm etc) that listed them in such zones

I'm very sorry. I made a snap decision that I should not have. I thought the data was old and outdated.

I will add a column for the output tone on each tone table. Somehow in all the rush I forgot to list the output tone. I was going to put it in the narrative, but listing it in the table makes it more visible. It should not take too long to add the one column. I don't have data for every forest at this point, but I think people will start reporting on those forests I don't have info on.

I disagree with your assessment on the format. As I mentioned in my last post a forest with three nets that utilize 12 repeaters will have 36 lines just for the three nets. Then the rest of the channels would have to be listed beyond below that. With 36 lines 90% of the information is duplicated from one line to the next. This, in my opinion, makes it difficult to find the tone and matching repeater.

Doing it the way I've set it up results in 3 lines for the channels and 12 lines for the repeaters. The lines relate to the channel the radio is in and the table for the tones shows the tone option for each of the repeater channels.

When I started writing all of this the Angeles, Cleveland and Sequoia National Forests were formatted the way I set up the remainder of the forests.

Most forests have a common output tone for all the repeaters or transmit the input tone on the output. There are a couple, one I listen to every day, that have non standard output tones that are unique on each repeater. I will add a column to present that information.

I will use whatever format is the most understandable for the users of the site. If I get some feedback that indicates the format you suggest is more understandable then I will change it.
 

ecps92

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Correct.

The Wiki is/was not meant to be a replacement for the RRDB which if each Repeater has the same output, then it gets one line.

Each Repeater should have its own line, so it can be actually validated. So much info (Federal) has only been updated by a dedicated Few (and you are definitely one of them), with the Wiki we can actually put in a date that the info was last heard


I would suggest we add two/three more columns
TX Tone, RX Tone and Date Confirmed/Reconfirmed (date confirmed refers to actual OTA monitoring vs documents and "inside" sources, I've found many an error on a 205/217 in an IAP) Remember the data is only as current as of yesterday. There are channels in the RRDB that should have been deleted years ago, but they are still licensed. Others got removed because no one heard anything for months and assumed it was never used. The wiki is a different world that WE as users can use to our advantage to cover the multitude of ways folks will use it.

As for the USFS Tone # and channel #, it is good to have when listening (great Intel) but some folks do use the wiki to cut-paste into software to load and not having the tone in the actual table (it is a separate table) requires extra steps

Let me see what I can do for one of the Wiki's later this week as a test pilot with the additional fields. Tied up over the next few days, so it might not be till Thur/Fri before I can mark one up.

We also need to ensure the Links (RF Links) are kept as I have seen them in some recent documents, just not listed in channel plans. I looks only at two, and saw good info/intel deleted.

Also there have been some channel plans listed breaking up the forest into NETS by Zone (guess the new Motorola/EFJ radios than the BK)

Again, a lot of good work and some ideas to apply to the other WIKIs outside of California once we get this worked out.


I don't understand what you are saying. The information I just deleted had a table representing channel 1 and then below that listed each repeater. So for a forest with 12 repeaters on three different nets there would be 36 lines as each tone would have to be listed over again for each channel. Then the table would have to show the other channels in order as well. That seems very cumbersome, not only for writing it, but for the person using the tables.

The point of listing the channel plan as I've shown is to enable a listener to understand what frequency is being used when someone on a forest says "switch to 6," meaning channel 6. If you sat down in an agency vehicle and there was a card showing the channel plan for the radio it would look just like the way I've written it. I worked with this format on the job for a couple of decades in California.

The tables I've written gives people access to the information the database had 10 or more years ago when it was removed because duplicate listings of frequencies was being discontinued.

I don't think a column for conformation is needed given the data source.
 

brcoz

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Smokey thank you for all of the work you put in to providing this info. You are now a WIKI master. I agree the WIKI is not easy to enter the information. Where I work they want us to put all of our documentation on how to install the software and new systems we support. Thanks again.
 

scottyhetzel

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Thanks Fred for spending the time on your replies, priceless. I'm looking forward to buying a map and checking sites out. Also looking forward to seeing your info on BLM CCD district. I read the wiki 3 times and still trying to grasp the info..

The ranger stations at glamis are Gecko and buttercup . I use to ride their a lot till I got air lifted out of Brawley. The LEO were: San Diego sheriff, imperial sheriff, USFS ranger, and BLM ranger and CHP el centro. On presidents holiday it would be radio nightmare. Hardly any interop... Had my scanner on close call mostly. The helicopter would be on CALCORD.

Scott
Fred, I bought the maps from the Santa Rosa visitor center...it is water proofed and shows all the details. It is hard to imagine they have three lookouts in my BDF San jaciento / Santa Rosa mountains.. Looking forward to your BLM CCD notes.
 

scannerbuff999

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Hi Exsmokey and everyone just found some good news that has been a big question mark sorry to everyone here if this off topic
and we started a new Thread if we need to Exsmokey i thing i answed a big question here all of the Nifc command channels from the 2008 fire season that were taken out of Fed Inter-op Pool are still in used today Ch.) RX / TX
1. ) 168.700/170.975
2. ) 168.100/170.425
3. ) 168.075/170.425
4. ) 166.6125/168.400
5. ) 167.100/169.750
6. ) 168.475/173.8125 (Cant be used in most of AZ due to interference w/ Phx Dist BLM)
7. ) 162.9625/171.7875
8. ) 169.5375/164.7125
9. ) 170.0125/165.250 (VHF 5 in Fed Interop Pool)
10. ) 170.4125/165.9625 (VHF 6 in Fed Interop Pool)
11. ) 170.6875/166.575 (VHF 7 in Fed Interop Pool)
12. ) 173.0375/167.325 (VHF 8 in Fed Interop Pool)
13. ) 166.3125/ ???? (Borrowed Freq)
14. ) 164.7125/169.5375 (VHF Calling in Fed Interop Pool)
15. ) 165.250/170.0125 (VHF 1 in Fed Interop Pool)
16. ) 165.9625/170.4125 (VHF 2 in Fed Interop Pool)
17. ) 166.575/170.6875 (VHF 3 in Fed Interop Pool)
18. ) 167.325/173.0375 (VHF 4 in Fed Interop Pool)
19. ) 169.3625/173.675
20. ) 167.9875
21. ) 169.540
22. ) 166.3625
23. ) 164.0125
24. ) 166.9625
25. ) 170.5125/168.475
26. ) 165.450
27. ) 165.0125
28. ) 166.6125
29. ) 166.5625
 

SCPD

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Hi Exsmokey and everyone just found some good news that has been a big question mark sorry to everyone here if this off topic
and we started a new Thread if we need to Exsmokey i thing i answed a big question here all of the Nifc command channels from the 2008 fire season that were taken out of Fed Inter-op Pool are still in used today Ch.) RX / TX
1. ) 168.700/170.975
2. ) 168.100/170.425
3. ) 168.075/170.425
4. ) 166.6125/168.400
5. ) 167.100/169.750
6. ) 168.475/173.8125 (Cant be used in most of AZ due to interference w/ Phx Dist BLM)
7. ) 162.9625/171.7875
8. ) 169.5375/164.7125
9. ) 170.0125/165.250 (VHF 5 in Fed Interop Pool)
10. ) 170.4125/165.9625 (VHF 6 in Fed Interop Pool)
11. ) 170.6875/166.575 (VHF 7 in Fed Interop Pool)
12. ) 173.0375/167.325 (VHF 8 in Fed Interop Pool)
13. ) 166.3125/ ???? (Borrowed Freq)
14. ) 164.7125/169.5375 (VHF Calling in Fed Interop Pool)
15. ) 165.250/170.0125 (VHF 1 in Fed Interop Pool)
16. ) 165.9625/170.4125 (VHF 2 in Fed Interop Pool)
17. ) 166.575/170.6875 (VHF 3 in Fed Interop Pool)
18. ) 167.325/173.0375 (VHF 4 in Fed Interop Pool)
19. ) 169.3625/173.675
20. ) 167.9875
21. ) 169.540
22. ) 166.3625
23. ) 164.0125
24. ) 166.9625
25. ) 170.5125/168.475
26. ) 165.450
27. ) 165.0125
28. ) 166.6125
29. ) 166.5625
What is the source of this information?
 
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