-
To anyone looking to acquire commercial radio programming software:
Please do not make requests for copies of radio programming software which is sold (or was sold) by the manufacturer for any monetary value. All requests will be deleted and a forum infraction issued. Making a request such as this is attempting to engage in software piracy and this forum cannot be involved or associated with this activity. The same goes for any private transaction via Private Message. Even if you attempt to engage in this activity in PM's we will still enforce the forum rules. Your PM's are not private and the administration has the right to read them if there's a hint to criminal activity.
If you are having trouble legally obtaining software please state so. We do not want any hurt feelings when your vague post is mistaken for a free request. It is YOUR responsibility to properly word your request.
To obtain Motorola software see the Sticky in the Motorola forum.
The various other vendors often permit their dealers to sell the software online (i.e., Kenwood). Please use Google or some other search engine to find a dealer that sells the software. Typically each series or individual radio requires its own software package. Often the Kenwood software is less than $100 so don't be a cheapskate; just purchase it.
For M/A Com/Harris/GE, etc: there are two software packages that program all current and past radios. One package is for conventional programming and the other for trunked programming. The trunked package is in upwards of $2,500. The conventional package is more reasonable though is still several hundred dollars. The benefit is you do not need multiple versions for each radio (unlike Motorola).
This is a large and very visible forum. We cannot jeopardize the ability to provide the RadioReference services by allowing this activity to occur. Please respect this.
UHF Business band repeater? Can't connect
- Thread starter dubs0980
- Start date
- Status
You were absolutely right. I should have checked the led. They do blink a couple times and then there is the open channel tone. So if its all analog, and each channel has its own frequencies and they never move (none that I've ever heard) could it be anything but a simple LTR system?
Sounds like a basic LTR system to me. Honestly I don't understand why they are set up that way somtimes because it makes no sense to have trunking when the talkgroup is on one frequency.
Many times a customer will want to upgrade their system but cannot afford to do at one time and need to spread it out over a few budget cycles. Perhaps they want to implement a TRBO system in the future and started off with buying the radios now, then doing the system later on. I'd say before you go on a witch hunt over sales people, maybe you should think things through a few times. I have sat in many sales meetings where customers will want to play all sorts of games with funding. In scannerland it would come off as "dumb" but if you knew the whole story it may make better sense.
A single repeater capacity plus trunking makes for a nifty two time slot system that allows for future growth. Same with a single repeater LTR system. Many times they will start with one repeater and add more when the traffic loading requires it. Some customers also demand the features that are only available in a trunked format. System wide ALL CALL is a feature people want now. In a trunked world, this is easy to do. In a conventional world where radios can't hop channels to make a announcement, this is not practical.
Small capacity plus TRBO systems have been a huge seller for us. It's a perfect solution for someone who needs a simple trunked system, but don't need the expensive P25, Connect Plus ...etc.
As far as licensing goes, LTR, P25/Smartnet, Connect Plus, EDACS..etc need to be licensed as a trunked system. I want to say they are FB8 ? Not sure off the top of my head. Capacity Plus can be licensed as conventional which is easier and less expensive to get frequency pairs for. I was told this is due to the radio's ability to monitor before transmitting which makes the FCC happy. On LTR and P25 type systems, the radio can be told to trunk to a channel without monitoring first. This is the reason for the more difficult trunking licensing. Perhaps John Rayfield can confirm this.
Just throwing this out there to help bring to light that sometimes things are done a way for a reason that is often not public knowledge.
Last edited:
Thats the thing. I think they are using business band stuff. Not sure if you need a license for 461.2875 or 462.9125. But fcc local search doesn't pull that up. Just our uhf DMR frequencies we don't use. If that's not within the rules I'll let them know.
I finally got SDRtrunk working and sure enough it's getting LTR signals. LCN 16 on 461.2875 and LCN 11 on 462.1925.
Messages seem to show (for 461.2875)
LCN: 01 TG (0-01-001/unknown) free:11
LCN: 05 tg (1-11-175) free18
LCN: 27 tg (1-17-145) free:20
And more combinations like that. I clearly know nothing about LTR systems but does that seem like a standard single channel system or something else?
PS SDRTrunk with it's batch install was awesome, Had it running in 30 seconds from download.
rapidcharger
Member
Actually it might not. They might not even have a license if it's on someone else's LTR system.
I just ran one of the frequencies through the ULS for the OP's home state and nearly all of them are low power simplex. There are a couple of wireless companies licensed for them though, the station class would appear to be trunking of some sort.
Are there any bills or anything for the radio service? There's got to be some paperwork.
I take it there's no FCC license hanging on a wall somewhere with a copy of the rules handy. LOL
mmckenna
I ♥ Ø
I understand what you are saying. However, I work for a research university and me and my team run all the telecommunications systems. That includes trunked and conventional radio systems, both analog and digital, as well as a 10,000+ line PBX, PSAP, etc. I know all about being creative with the funding, been doing it for years. I don't need another Motorola sales guy telling me how I need to spend my money.
An elementary school with a single analog simplex channel does not need a top of the line XPR. Even if the district does eventually install a repeater, they don't need a top of the line radio. The dealer oversold, pure and simple. Unfortunately the school doesn't have anyone that understands this stuff and they'll buy whatever the sales guy tells them to. This is taxpayers money, and it's money that comes out of my sons education. Motorola should know better than this, and they should be discouraging the shops from selling products this way. It's irresponsible and just makes the M look bad to the rest of us. Using silly justifications to line pockets is wrong, doesn't matter how you look at it.
It's not a witch hunt. It's common sense. This sort of nonsense needs to be exposed, even if it upsets the radio shops and the manufacturers.
Well it seems you are the expert here (as always). I simply wanted to enlighten folks that sometimes.....the sales people sell things that customers ask for.
mmckenna
I ♥ Ø
Yep, I agree. I've worked with some great sales guys and factory reps. This was one of the things that drove us from Motorola to Kenwood. The products were similar, the prices were similar, but there was a huge difference in dealer attitude. Motorola attempting to call the shots and force our hand, Kenwood actually wanting to make sure we got what we needed and could afford.
I'm not anti-Motorola, I'm anti Motorola Sales tactic. The Motorola radios are mostly great, but so are other brands. When it comes down to it, it's about who treats you right for the amount of money you are spending.
Something Motorola has mostly forgotten.
Actually a single LTR system can have a few more whiz-bangs over a conventional community repeater set up. An "all call" function to broadcast to all talk groups is one (as mentioned). The other I can think of is "system busy" is more reliable than relying on carrier detect and busy channel lockout.
Anyway. the OP mentioned two separate groups he hears on two different frequencies. This could be two individual single freq systems OR more likely a two repeater LTR trunked system. If there were only two talk groups each using a different home channel then of course they would always use their assigned home channel and never trunk off to another repeater.
dubs0980, you look like you're logging more LCNs (and free LCNs) than your system actually is. Either you have more repeaters available or you are logging a neighboring system. If you can get close and reduce your antenna maybe you can just log your system.
In the system display X-XX-XXX the first single number is the area code, should be a 0 or a 1. The second is the LCN, the "slot" where the radio knows what the repeater frequency is programmed as (that should be between 1 and 20). Lastly is the group ID that the radios have to have in common to talk to each other (1 to 255). I don't know if your SDR decoder is looking at the LCN as the home channel (the repeater the radio would normally pick unless it's busy) or if the LCN number is the one currently in use if trunked off of the home channel. Either way, "free" is telling other talkgroups (different IDs) who would like to use the system what repeater is free to switch to and utilize. Are you swimming yet? Try to decode just your system by monitoring radio traffic on both groups and see if you can nail down the LCNs and IDs your SDR decoder is giving you.
If you can ever get to the repeaters and get some pics would be great. You'll find for every repeater will be a outboard LTR controller attached to it. If we saw a picture from the back on how things are wired would give a better swag on what you actually got there.
Last edited:
Just an update to the mystery. Looks like a single two channel repeater. General is 00-01-001 and Maintenance is 00-11-001. Still not sure if the frequencies need to be registered or not, but it's satisfying to know what they are using. Thanks for all the help guys.
- Status
