Weird CSP "patching" issues tonight??

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natedawg1604

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For the last hour+ I've been hearing CSP dispatch traffic for the 3-Adam and 3-Charlie troops on 3-Adam (TG 2451) via Thorodin. However, Pro96Com shows no patches for 2451. I do show patches for the 1-David Channels (2389 and 2305), but not 3-Adam/Charlie. Also, I'm not seeing any affiliations from the 3-Charlie TG. What might be going on here??

-Nate
 

natedawg1604

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Okay, now Pro-96Com is showing 3-Adam and 3-Charlie Patched like normal, on the Lookout site. For the last couple hours I was only getting 3-Adam on Thorodin, now its on Lookout as well. However, on the Thorodin Site 3-Adam is still showing no patches. Weird...
 
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greenthumb

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If there's only 3A radios and no 3C radios on Thorodin, there's no need to broadcast the patch, so I would assume that is probably what is going on. Might be worth verifying to see if you have any 3C affiliations on Thorodin, and what happens if a 3C radio shows up to the party.
 

natedawg1604

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If there's only 3A radios and no 3C radios on Thorodin, there's no need to broadcast the patch, so I would assume that is probably what is going on. Might be worth verifying to see if you have any 3C affiliations on Thorodin, and what happens if a 3C radio shows up to the party.
If they weren't broadcasting the patch data on Thorodin (and it appears they weren't), why was I still hearing 3A/3C patched anyway?
 

greenthumb

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My guess would be that the system knows that the patched audio needs to get there, but since there's no reason to have the site act like the two are patched (which takes overhead on the control channel) it just treats it like it's a single TG and deals with the complexities on the back-end. Motorola has been at the P25 game long enough to get this fancy, so I wouldn't be surprised if this is the case.
 

natedawg1604

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With DTRS, do patch messages only get broadcast if a radio affiliates with the Supergroup TG? For example, suppose a dispatcher patches 3 TG's together, and a radio affiliates with a single "Member group" TG on a particular site, but no radios affiliate with the "Supergroup". During this condition/state, does the site refrain from broadcasting broadcast any patch messages, even though a scanner/radio still registers the "Member group" TG and you still hear all traffic from all patched TG's on the single member TG?

Also, if radios affiliate with 2 member group TG's but no supergroup, does the site activate patch messages at that point?
 

Steve2003

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I'm not sure of the whole nomenclature when it comes to P25 Patching.


Based on my understanding, for a patch like this:
"06/30 10:17:59","Added Patch: 2451 (CSP Troop 3A) --> 2455 (CSP Troop 3C)"
  • The patch will be broadcast over the control channel if there is a radio affiliated with the source talkgroup (2451) on that particular tower.
  • If the tower only has radios affiliated with the destination talkgroup (2455) the patch will not be broadcast.

Also, if you have a weak decode rate in Pro96Com you may see the patch drop in and out.
 

natedawg1604

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I'm not sure of the whole nomenclature when it comes to P25 Patching.


Based on my understanding, for a patch like this:
"06/30 10:17:59","Added Patch: 2451 (CSP Troop 3A) --> 2455 (CSP Troop 3C)"
  • The patch will be broadcast over the control channel if there is a radio affiliated with the source talkgroup (2451) on that particular tower.
  • If the tower only has radios affiliated with the destination talkgroup (2455) the patch will not be broadcast.

Also, if you have a weak decode rate in Pro96Com you may see the patch drop in and out.
It would be nice if someone with "inside" knowledge could confirm how DTR sites are actually programmed to broadcast patch messages; do others agree with Steve's theory on this?
 
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