What is Causing Interference in NFL Patriot Headsets ?

[Katmandu]

I'm looking for Technical reasons as the why this is an issue. Given today's technology, this stuff "should" not happen.

The NFL blames an "electrical issue" hampered by the bad weather. Really ? What type of "electrical issue and why would the weather effect the headsets ?

Patriots cleared of wrongdoing regarding Steelers' headsets - NY Daily News

“Based on our review to date, we believe that the audio interference on Steelers' headsets last night was entirely attributable to an electrical issue made worse by the inclement weather; that it involved no manipulation by any individual; and that the Patriots had nothing to do with it. The issue was promptly resolved and there were no further problems for the remainder of the game. We will continue to review the matter to determine if there are technical steps that can be taken to avoid similar problems from occurring in other games.” [quote/]


At least five teams have suspected Patriots of headset tampering | ProFootballTalk

At least five teams have suspected Patriots of headset tampering

Posted by Michael David Smith on September 11, 2015, 9:38 AM EDT
Bill Belichick AP

The term “Headsetgate” has just been coined and may not last, but the allegations that the Patriots tamper with visiting teams’ communications at Gillette Stadium are nothing new.

With the Steelers suggesting that something was afoul on Thursday night in New England, there are now at least five teams that have accused the Patriots of tampering with communications:

1. After the Jaguars lost to the Patriots in the playoffs following the 2005 season, then-Jacksonville coach Jack Del Rio said the headsets “mysteriously malfunctioned.”

2. In 2006, then-Lions offensive coordinator Mike Martz suspected the Patriots of preventing him from communicating with his quarterback. As reported by Paul Zimmerman of Sports Illustrated, Martz had Detroit’s offense off to a good start until he lost the ability to call plays because the communications system went out. According to that report, it happened to the Lions twice, both times in the middle of drives when the Lions were picking up steam.

3. Bengals coach Marvin Lewis was quoted by Zimmerman as responding to Martz’s accusation by saying the same thing that happened to the Lions had happened to the Bengals as well: “Yeah, I know,” Lewis said. “Headset went out. It happened to me in Foxboro, too.”

4. Karlos Dansby said in an appearance on PFT Live this year that he suspected the Patriots of wrongdoing in 2008, when Dansby’s Cardinals visited New England and had trouble with their coach-to-helmet communications system.

5. The Steelers now become at least the fifth team making accusations, with the team saying that its coach-to-coach communications repeatedly faced interference from the Patriots’ radio broadcast, and that the interference would stop when a league official came to the sideline to deal with it, only to start up again when the league official walked away.

Unlike Spygate and Deflategate, these cheating accusations have not resulted in NFL discipline. But they’re part of a perception around the league that the Patriots win by skirting the rules.

How possible is it for an outside source (sabator with radio jamming equipment) to cause havoc on NFL headsets ? ie rogue fan trying to "help" out his home team Some NFL fans are crazy enough to do this!

 

[ecps92]

All Coordinated, Licensed, Operated and run by the NFL

#TBT: When Tom Brady Made His Debut and No One Really Gave it Much Thought - Touching All the Bases - Boston.com

"The radio system in my helmet went down," said Bledsoe, "so we went to the hand signals, which means [John] Friesz has to get it over to me. That cost us time, and that was a factor."

Back then it was a UHF system, on shared Part 90 Frequencies. Hmm,..many of those licensed within a few miles of each stadium and back then the NFL kept saying 800 Mhz. Even now it's on Part 90 Shared frequencies. Just now DMR not Analog

Given todays technology, it's bound to happen. And does regularly. Even other stadiums
RF overload at a major venue
Crossed Wires, Cables over lapping etc

I'm looking for Technical reasons as the why this is an issue. Given today's technology, this stuff "should" not happen.

The NFL blames an "electrical issue" hampered by the bad weather. Really ? What type of "electrical issue and why would the weather effect the headsets ?

Patriots cleared of wrongdoing regarding Steelers' headsets - NY Daily News



How possible is it for an outside source (sabator with radio jamming equipment) to cause havoc on NFL headsets ? ie rogue fan trying to "help" out his home team Some NFL fans are crazy enough to do this!

 

[Katmandu]

Given todays technology, it's bound to happen. And does regularly. Even other stadiums. RF overload at a major venue, Crossed Wires, Cables over lapping etc

Back in the day, a lot of folks ran Linears on CB equipment that of course cause massive RF overload. Bleeding over on stereo equipment speakers, setting off car alarms, opening garage doors etc...

How possible is it for an outside source (sabator with radio jamming equipment) to cause havoc on NFL headsets ? ie rogue fan trying to "help" out his home team.

Some NFL fans are crazy enough to do it ! Just like back in the old CB days with Linears.

 

[Katmandu]

Given todays technology, it's bound to happen. And does regularly. Even other stadiums
RF overload at a major venue
Crossed Wires, Cables over lapping etc

They did say they were here the Patriot's radio broadcast over the head sets.

How possible would it be for a nearby AM radio station to bleed over into these headsets ?

Would the mobile van (out back behind the stadium) running the radio broadcast possibly interfere like this ?

 

[Voyager]

Not knowing anything about the setup, I would suspect maybe a ground loop or a patch cable plugged into the wrong place.

If you want a funny answer, a radio shop owner in Pittsburgh said it was the fact they weren't running enough power that caused the interference. Of course, any competent operator knows that it's usually too much power that causes interference, and the more everyone runs, the better the odds of interference.

What is odd is that it's my understanding that whenever one team's headsets become unusable, BOTH teams must discontinue use of the headsets. Either Mike Tomlin (Steelers HC) didn't think they were at that point, or there was some issue that was being condoned by someone.

I wouldn't rule out the theory of "fan help" as described above either, but everything I've heard points to old aged equipment.

BTW, for anyone who doesn't know, there are people (NFL employees) dedicated to coordinate the frequencies used in the stadiums at each game, so unless someone is totally incompetent I think we can rule out a frequency re-use issue.

It would be funny if it happened in the offense/defense headsets since those are encrypted MotoTRBO, as that would leave only the patch cable issue or intentional interference as the potential causes, but this was reportedly the coach's headsets.

 

[AlexC]

FYI - The NFL uses people that are called "Game Day Coordinators" which are responsible for coordination of everything RF that goes on in a stadium during a game. Every wireless microphone, headset, radio, TV microwave, etc is coordinated through the GDC's. There is typically two per team I believe.

You can read about them here: NFL Gameday Frequency Coordinators | NFL Football Operations

Most carry spectrum analyzers and predetermined frequency plans to know who is where and ensure that everything goes perfectly.

These coordinators are often present at a lot of other events and venues where large groups of people come together with their wireless devices. The Pope Visit had several of them working when he was in Yankee Stadium a few years back.

It has always seemed like a pretty cool gig to have. More than likely these guys where on the case. If they find something they usually have a state trooper or other official with them as if you read the terms of service for entry in the venue you can not bring an unlicensed two-way transmitter in to the venue (I'm pretty sure I found this one time when looking for it...)

Alex

 

[ecps92]

Why even go all conspiracy of a rogue fan.

Two radio users, competing for the same Air Space = Problems
The NFL does not have exclusive rights to those Frequencies :roll:

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Back in the day, a lot of folks ran Linears on CB equipment that of course cause massive RF overload. Bleeding over on stereo equipment speakers, setting off car alarms, opening garage doors etc...

How possible is it for an outside source (sabator with radio jamming equipment) to cause havoc on NFL headsets ? ie rogue fan trying to "help" out his home team.

Some NFL fans are crazy enough to do it ! Just like back in the old CB days with Linears.

 

[ecps92]

a. The Patriots haven't been on AM for many years. 98.5 Mhz, Prior to that 104.1 (WBCN)
b. The RF Remote hasn't been used for 15+ Years, it's all hard-wired down there
Unless they are on the field doing interviews

More than likely, it was bad cabling. AS they said in Ghost Busters - Don't Cross the Beams, the same goes for laying cables

They did say they were here the Patriot's radio broadcast over the head sets.

How possible would it be for a nearby AM radio station to bleed over into these headsets ?

Would the mobile van (out back behind the stadium) running the radio broadcast possibly interfere like this ?

 

[Katmandu]

Why even go all conspiracy of a rogue fan.

Just like I said above..... Some people are crazy enough to do it. Just like back in the old CB days with Linears. I've had experience with some of these people. I would not for one second not believe that someone would not try something sinister such as this.

 

[Katmandu]

More than likely, it was bad cabling.

Ok. Bad cabling.

Someone please explain in technical terms what exactly bad cabling is and how exactly it can cause said issues with the headsets.

 

[Voyager]

If you lose the ground, RF (or even AF) can be induced on the line resulting in audio crosstalk.

 

[ecps92]

Henry's Laws of Induction is one.


The size and strength of a magnetic field is relative to the amount of current flowing through the wire within. For very low voltage wires, like network cables, bundling them together generally doesn't create a strong enough field to disturb the other lines in the bundle.

However, if you loop the cables, you end up running the same current through very nearly the same space - over, and over, and over - and this can amplify the magnetic field that's created, enough that it can interfere with other signals.

With power cables, they run much more current and so create much bigger fields. Big and strong enough to interfere with the tiny currents going thru the other cables. Looping them is even stronger and more problematic.

Brings us back to Ghost Busters - Don't Cross the streams

Ok. Bad cabling.

Someone please explain in technical terms what exactly bad cabling is and how exactly it can cause said issues with the headsets.

 

[krokus]

Henry's Laws of Induction is one.

The size and strength of a magnetic field is relative to the amount of current flowing through the wire within. For very low voltage wires, like network cables, bundling them together generally doesn't create a strong enough field to disturb the other lines in the bundle.

If you lose the ground, RF (or even AF) can be induced on the line resulting in audio crosstalk.

There are long runs of these cables, which can help induce signals on other lines. Especially if you have a higher level signal on one set.

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