Whistler vs. Uniden on milair.

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scannersnstuff

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Looking for user experience with Whistler scanner's vs. Uniden, on milair sensitivity. Interested in any report's especially from the ws-1040. Not being kurt, just not interested in all the other scanne's/receiver's. Thank you.
 

a417

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Are you planning on using the stock antenna (or a screw-on replacement) or do you have a more elaborate signal path in mind?
 

scannersnstuff

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It would be used where my Uniden bc898t sit's now. Connected to a small mag mount antenna, stuck to an indoor metal curtain holder,built into the wall. My option's are limited. My Whistler ws-1010 get's bleed over just from the stock antenna. Vhf airband bleed's onto vhf-hi.
 

522

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I found the Whistler TRX-2 to work very well on VHF/UHF air-bands, better than any Uniden, even the BCT15X.

I'd be interested to hear from someone who can say first hand between the TRX-1 vs the TRX-2 receive quality. (mil air or any band)
I will say my TRX-1 is better than my SDS100 on Mil Air FWIW

Also as mentioned above... antenna plays a major role.
 

vagrant

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I just tested a Whistler WS-1040 against a Uniden BC125AT. The same antenna and coax was used. The BC125AT had better audio in that it had much less background hiss and slightly better punch. This was even more evident down in 138~150 MHz. The BC125AT wins in my test for selectivity and sensitivity. It is probably why I have three BC125AT scanners and one WS1040, plus the Uniden costs less. The BC125AT also handles VHF low stuff 30~50 MHz, as we have mil air rotor using that around here. ( I still use the 1040 for mil air to specifically handle a nearby naval air station, but that will soon change to a new BC125AT. The 1040 will eventually just handle strong signal commercial/public service repeater traffic )

* The BC125AT does not cover 380~400 MHz. I use another scanner for that range, but I have extremely low traffic in that slot. It may be different in other regions.

I should note that for this test I used a discone antenna outdoors with 50' of LMR-400 coaxial cable, various filters and a RX amplifier at 10 dB gain. Additionally, I have one Uniden BC125AT that only handles 225~380 MHz traffic and has a 225~400 MHz bandpass filter made by Dale Parfitt. That really suppresses RFI and by having more scanners covering different frequencies, I am more apt to hear traffic.
Looking for user experience with Whistler scanner's vs. Uniden, on milair sensitivity. Interested in any report's especially from the ws-1040. Not being kurt, just not interested in all the other scanne's/receiver's. Thank you.
 
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signal500

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I just tested a Whistler WS-1040 against a Uniden BC125AT. The same antenna and coax was used. The BC125AT had better audio in that it had much less background hiss and slightly better punch. This was even more evident down in 138~150 MHz. The BC125AT wins in my test for selectivity and sensitivity. It is probably why I have three BC125AT scanners and one WS1040, plus the Uniden costs less. The BC125AT also handles VHF low stuff 30~50 MHz, as we have mil air rotor using that around here. ( I still use the 1040 for mil air to specifically handle a nearby naval air station, but that will soon change to a new BC125AT. The 1040 will eventually just handle strong signal commercial/public service repeater traffic )

* The BC125AT does not cover 380~400 MHz. I use another scanner for that range, but I have extremely low traffic in that slot. It may be different in other regions.

I should note that for this test I used a discone antenna outdoors with 50' of LMR-400 coaxial cable, various filters and a RX amplifier at 10 dB gain. Additionally, I have one Uniden BC125AT that only handles 225~380 MHz traffic and has a 225~400 MHz bandpass filter made by Dale Parfitt. That really suppresses RFI and by having more scanners covering different frequencies, I am more apt to hear traffic.

I will 2nd vagrant's thoughts on the Uniden BC125AT for MilAir monitoring. I have five military bases within a 75 mile radius of my location with non-stop MilAir traffic. The Uniden BC125AT receives extremely well just using the stock antenna. It also has good audio and is easy to manually program. The Whistler WS1040 is a good MilAir scanner, but if I had to choose between the two, I would go with the Uniden BC125AT. I do not own a Whistler TRX-2 so I cannot speak of its performance.
 

nsrailfan6130

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I have a TRX-2 so I could offer a little insight. I haven't had much of an issue rx'ing milair. I got a couple of bases within earshot of my area. I run a pair of indoor magmounts and they have done the trick.
 

GROL

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The BCT15X and BCD325P2 have the best civilian and military performance of all my scanners. Sensitivity is more than adequate with any of the modern scanners. Equally important is signal to noise ratio, image rejection and selectivity. Sensitivity can be too high if the rest of the specs are not as good. High sensitivity can severely impact marginal image rejection and selectivity, which can reduce signal to noise ratio. Both the BCT15X and BCD325P2 have very good performance in all regards. The audio is very good from the BCD325P2. Clear and loud. The audio from the BCT15X is excellent. I have compared BCD396XT, BCD325P2, BCT15X, BCD996P2, Pro-164 and SDS100 recently. The SDS100 is actually more sensitive, but suffers from poorer image rejection and adjacent channel rejection. No matter which filter I use I can often hear weaker transmissions on adjacent channels. So SNR also suffers. It is usable on air bands, but I would not recommend it for that.
 

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The BCT15X and BCD325P2 have the best civilian and military performance of all my scanners. Sensitivity is more than adequate with any of the modern scanners. Equally important is signal to noise ratio, image rejection and selectivity. Sensitivity can be too high if the rest of the specs are not as good. High sensitivity can severely impact marginal image rejection and selectivity, which can reduce signal to noise ratio. Both the BCT15X and BCD325P2 have very good performance in all regards. The audio is very good from the BCD325P2. Clear and loud. The audio from the BCT15X is excellent. I have compared BCD396XT, BCD325P2, BCT15X, BCD996P2, Pro-164 and SDS100 recently. The SDS100 is actually more sensitive, but suffers from poorer image rejection and adjacent channel rejection. No matter which filter I use I can often hear weaker transmissions on adjacent channels. So SNR also suffers. It is usable on air bands, but I would not recommend it for that.

AKA: Dynamic range
 

GROL

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AKA: Dynamic range
I hadn't directly addressed dynamic range, but a receiver that is overly sensitive can get desensitize easier and dynamic range could be negatively affected which really screws up everything. Another reason high sensitivity is not necessarily a good thing. You don't usually see that listed as a receiver spec. It is definitely a radar spec. I suppose the point is that, a receiver can be more sensitive than another, but does it overall perform better than another that is less sensitive. It may not and the extra sensitivity may work well for one tuned signal, but not so well on another. There are many factors to consider. You should not necessarily consider a receiver that has a specification of 0.25 uV to perform better than one that has a sensitivity of 1 uV. It may or may not. And what is the signal-to_noise ratio? Since it is more sensitive, that receiver will require better image rejection and selectivity to perform well. Also consider that any received noise will be amplified at the same gain as the tuned signal at the RF front end, which is why external amplifiers at the antenna jack of the receiver can really mess up performance. RF amplifiers should be used as close to the antenna as possible to overcome feed line losses. They are good for that. They are not good for improving receiver performance.
 

GROL

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I hadn't directly addressed dynamic range, but a receiver that is overly sensitive can get desensitize easier and dynamic range could be negatively affected which really screws up everything. Another reason high sensitivity is not necessarily a good thing. You don't usually see that listed as a receiver spec. It is definitely a radar spec. I suppose the point is that, a receiver can be more sensitive than another, but does it overall perform better than another that is less sensitive. It may not and the extra sensitivity may work well for one tuned signal, but not so well on another. There are many factors to consider. You should not necessarily consider a receiver that has a specification of 0.25 uV to perform better than one that has a sensitivity of 1 uV. It may or may not. And what is the signal-to_noise ratio? Since it is more sensitive, that receiver will require better image rejection and selectivity to perform well. Also consider that any received noise will be amplified at the same gain as the tuned signal at the RF front end, which is why external amplifiers at the antenna jack of the receiver can really mess up performance. RF amplifiers should be used as close to the antenna as possible to overcome feed line losses. They are good for that. They are not good for improving receiver performance.
External amplifiers commonly sold as pre-amps or antenna amplifiers are the problem when connected at the receiver. Connection directly at the receiver should be avoided. There are well designed very low noise amplifiers that may improve receiver performance placed before the RF front-end amplifier to improve the noise figure, but you would need to put that on the test bench to determine the resulting performance unless that amplifier was already designed to mate with that receiver. Such amplifiers usually cost well more than any of the scanners, even the SDS scanners.
 

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External amplifiers commonly sold as pre-amps or antenna amplifiers are the problem when connected at the receiver. Connection directly at the receiver should be avoided. There are well designed very low noise amplifiers that may improve receiver performance placed before the RF front-end amplifier to improve the noise figure, but you would need to put that on the test bench to determine the resulting performance unless that amplifier was already designed to mate with that receiver. Such amplifiers usually cost well more than any of the scanners, even the SDS scanners.

It's not always convenient or possible to mount the preamp at the antenna end of the coax. There are numerous resonably priced preamps more than suitable for home receivers/scanners. The ones you're refering to that cost more and SDS scanners are more for special applications, military ETC. In most cases I think preamps overused or not even required. You can't amplify signals that aren't even there to begin with, and you can easily overload and desensitize hobby grade receivers/scanners.
 

GROL

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It's not always convenient or possible to mount the preamp at the antenna end of the coax. There are numerous resonably priced preamps more than suitable for home receivers/scanners. The ones you're refering to that cost more and SDS scanners are more for special applications, military ETC. In most cases I think preamps overused or not even required. You can't amplify signals that aren't even there to begin with, and you can easily overload and desensitize hobby grade receivers/scanners.
Not just military. Military does not have an exclusivity on technology. What you just said is contradictory. Antenna amplifiers are used to overcome feedline losses. Assume your feedline loss is 10db. With a 10db low noise amplifier you can compensate for that if the amplifier is at the antenna. You can always use an amplifier at an antenna if you have a bias T or DC power injector. TV antenna amplifiers work this way and the amplifier is at the antenna and a power injector is at the end of the cable inside the house. But if your feedline has lost 10 db of signal to the receiver, it cannot recover what is not there as you just said at the receiver.
 

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Not just military. Military does not have an exclusivity on technology. What you just said is contradictory. Antenna amplifiers are used to overcome feedline losses. Assume your feedline loss is 10db. With a 10db low noise amplifier you can compensate for that if the amplifier is at the antenna. You can always use an amplifier at an antenna if you have a bias T or DC power injector. TV antenna amplifiers work this way and the amplifier is at the antenna and a power injector is at the end of the cable inside the house. But if your feedline has lost 10 db of signal to the receiver, it cannot recover what is not there as you just said at the receiver.

I said "military" because they overspend on everything without concern. Spending more money and mil-spec does not mean better in any way.

I know the advantages of mounting a preamp at the antenna and I know about power injectors. Not everyone can access the antenna. For example I'm 72 years old and in poor health. I can't go up on a ladder, or the roof, let alone a 100ft tower. When I said you can't amplify what is not there I wasn't refering at the receiver end I was referring to what is not at the antenna to begin with. If someone can't receive signals from a distant airport due to terrain or other obsticles a preamp most likely won't help. You'll just amplify everything else that reaches the antenna IE; noise, strong FM broadcast stations, pagers, ham radio, ETC. I've asked some to disconnect their high gain antennas that are mounted up high, disconnect the preamp and just use the back of set stock telescoping whip and it solved their problem!
 

GROL

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I said "military" because they overspend on everything without concern. Spending more money and mil-spec does not mean better in any way.

I know the advantages of mounting a preamp at the antenna and I know about power injectors. Not everyone can access the antenna. For example I'm 72 years old and in poor health. I can't go up on a ladder, or the roof, let alone a 100ft tower. When I said you can't amplify what is not there I wasn't refering at the receiver end I was referring to what is not at the antenna to begin with. If someone can't receive signals from a distant airport due to terrain or other obsticles a preamp most likely won't help. You'll just amplify everything else that reaches the antenna IE; noise, strong FM broadcast stations, pagers, ham radio, ETC. I've asked some to disconnect their high gain antennas that are mounted up high, disconnect the preamp and just use the back of set stock telescoping whip and it solved their problem!
I have had 24 years in the military. Mil spec is more about interoperability, adaptibilty, survivability and extremely rugged. More than over spending. And the military uses plenty of COTS. COTS? Congress allocates the money. The military has to cope with the budget they are given and we have been very creative. Very creative! The military does not waste. Congress does. B52s in service since the last one rolled off the line in 1962 are expected to be in service until 2050. F15s are still the leading air superiority fighter bomber first entered service in 1976 and developed starting in the late 1960s. F15s are expected to be in service until 2035 and maybe beyond. Not to mention the KC135 airframe (Boeing 707) still in service and the C-130 which is probably one of the most rugged airframes ever. Congress canceled the F-22 contract for 750 and left it to 187 operational aircraft. Depending on who is controlling congress or in the Oval office it is either feast or famine. With a few years break in service I was in the military from 1978 to 2012 and most of those years were famine. Worst years were 1978 to 1981, 1992 to 2001, 2009 to 2012 for while I was in. Extrapolate the politics. BTW the F-35 is one of the worst projects ever approved by congress. The F-22 could be a replacement for the F-15. Keeping the F-15 and B52 in service has been a huge benefit to air superiority and tax payer savings. All the hype about Mig 25 and Mig 29s were just that. Russian propaganda. And the Mig 35 is being called the Dead Duck. And the Chinese copy of the F-22 does not have a marble size radar signature but instead as big as a Cessna!
 
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