Why Storm-Based Warnings?

[Thunderbolt]

The National Weather Service (NWS) mission is defined as the provision of weather forecasts and warnings for the protection of life and property and the provision of weather information for the Nation’s economic well-being. The NWS currently issues and disseminates warnings for tornado, severe thunderstorm, flood and marine hazards using geopolitical boundaries. Realizing the continuing need to improve the specificity and accuracy of warnings for tornadoes, severe thunderstorms, floods and marine hazards, the NWS will implement Storm-Based Warnings on October 1, 2007.


Storm-Based Warnings (threat-based polygon warnings), are essential to effectively warn for severe weather. Storm-Based Warnings show the specific meteorological or hydrological threat area and are not restricted to geopolitical boundaries. By focusing on the true threat area, warning polygons will improve NWS warning accuracy and quality. Storm-Based Warnings will promote improved graphical warning displays, and in partnership with the private sector, support a wider warning distribution through cell phone alerts, pagers, web-enabled Personal Data Assistants (PDA), etc.

http://www.weather.gov/sbwarnings/

 

[DaveIN]

I like the idea. People get all worked up and sound the alarm for a thunderstorm that may not necessarily be a threat to an entire county. Granted lightning can travel for miles, but the watch or warning should say so. Listening to the weather net the other day, one ham reported light rain when another reported a 60MPH wind gust, yet the repeater said red alert, severe weather warning for twenty minutes of clear sky until a decision was made to stand down. Last year this time we had a weak waterspout one mile from the shoreline and the entire county and an adjacent county was put under a tornado warning. The previous year a dust devil was mistaken for a funnel cloud and a tornado warning was issued again for the whole county. I am all for being prepared for disasters and if a thunderstorm is going to cover an entire county then say so, but if it is limited to a small cell near somewhere town, then I want to know that too.

 

[n5ims]

Why? Because, that's why!

This very question was asked at a Skywarn class I attended this spring. The answer given was basically this.

The current warning system casts a pretty wide net so most of the times warnings are issues for areas that will not be affected. This causes people to ignore the warnings. By being pretty specific about a warning area, people will know to pay attention since there's a good chance that they will at least be somewhat affected by the storm.

The old system, which generally reports at a county level, may place you in a warning for something 30 or so miles away. While that storm may be fierce, you may not even get any rain or even hear the thunder. With the new system, chances are very good that even if you are not in the direct line for the worst of the weather, you'll be close enough to if not get wet, at least hear the thunder.

 

[JohnnyGalaga]

How will this affect the SAME codes.

 

[rdale]

No change at all. TV stations have done this for over a decade, NWS started this in test form a few years back and now it's just official. You won't notice anything different.

 

[daleduke17]

With this change, then there should be (in my opinion) additions to the SAME codes. Split some of the larger counties into small chunks. Some of the counties I can think of of hand are:

McLean County, IL
Cherry County, NE
Cook County, IL
Livingston County, IL

 

[rdale]

That isn't able to happen, because the way SAME codes are set up.

 

[StereoScout]

That isn't able to happen, because the way SAME codes are set up.

Not from what I've read. Ever notice that the first digit in all SAME codes is a 0 ? When fully implemented I've read that the first digit will designates what part of a county can be alerted exclusively. That means that a county can be split up into as many as 9 "alert zones". That of course means that all present SAME weather radios are already compatible and have the ability to "split" alert messages by just editing the first digit for your area.

 

[rdale]

Agreed, but if it's more than one zone then how would it be accomplished? What if it's the north half of the county? Sounds like weather people weren't included when they developed EAS.

 

[StereoScout]

Agreed, but if it's more than one zone then how would it be accomplished? What if it's the north half of the county? Sounds like weather people weren't included when they developed EAS.

Again, this is just from what I read from the NWS SAME developmental manual. Let's say your county SAME code is now 033333. The northern half of your county would be re-assigned as an example 133333 and the southern half 233333. It would require you to program both of these new codes into your radio in order to receive alerts for the whole county.

 

[ibagli]

It's always fun knowing that kids in schools 45 miles from a storm in my county are being sent to their shelters because a funnel cloud clips the opposite edge of the county, headed away from the town they're in.

 

[StereoScout]

It's always fun knowing that kids in schools 45 miles from a storm in my county are being sent to their shelters because a funnel cloud clips the opposite edge of the county, headed away from the town they're in.

And when this SAME Phase 2 is eventually implemented in your area these false alarms will practically be eliminated.

 

[daleduke17]

Again, this is just from what I read from the NWS SAME developmental manual. Let's say your county SAME code is now 033333. The northern half of your county would be re-assigned as an example 133333 and the southern half 233333. It would require you to program both of these new codes into your radio in order to receive alerts for the whole county.

Plus, that way they could have an "all-call" for the county. Pretty good idea, Scout.

 

[rdale]

Stereo - incorrect, 1 = NW, 2 = NC, 3 = NE, 4 = WC, 5 = C, 6 = EC, 7 = SE, 8 = SC, 9 = SW. So the option exists only for 1/9th of a county, and warnings almost always cover more than that.

Many EM's are not set up to only sound the sirens in a particular part of a county, so "false alarms" still will exist.

 

[mdulrich]

Stereo - incorrect, 1 = NW, 2 = NC, 3 = NE, 4 = WC, 5 = C, 6 = EC, 7 = SE, 8 = SC, 9 = SW. So the option exists only for 1/9th of a county, and warnings almost always cover more than that.

But multiple SAME codes could be sent. The NWS already does this to cover multiple counties.

Mike

 

[ka5lqj]

Recent Skywarn Class...

Hi All,

We just had a Skywarn class on Tuesday night for ALL of the area hams in the Ark-La-Tex who are under the "umbrella" of the NWS - Shreveport, LA office at our Amateur Radio Club of Shreveport monthly meeting. It was great and even though I've attended before, I got some 'additional learnings' (LOL!) from the speaker, Doug Butts. He's not only informative, but funny as well and you learn a lot that way.

Doug explained the new system, as it was only one day old. As we had before, entire parishes or counties were warned as to the approach of severe wx. Now, under the new system, warnings and watches will be given out for specific locations..(ie. Northern Caddo Parish, Western Harrison County, TX, Central Miller County Arkansas, etc.) THIS will be very helpful, not only to the Spotters, but the general public as well. If a tornado is moving from southwest Caddo parish up northeast, then I (in the middle of S'port, LA.) SHOULD be appraised and take appropiate action. But, if it's moving West to East, I can just "look" out my front door and watch it go by.

We get storm fronts 3 ways, Southwest to Northeast, West to East, along I-20, and Northwest to Southeast, Northern cold fronts. So far this year, we missed MOST of the severe wx and only got a lot of rain, March thru mid-June, then it all stopped dead and we went into a hot, dry spell. We're coming up on the rainy season soon and sometimes have the most severe wx here, other than the Spring pop-up storms. So, this new system will be readily used by us.

I've been doing the "Skywarn thing" since late 1981 and love it. Especially when the sky turns black and the thunder, lightning and rain is real heavy, LOL! Especially the 'lightshow' GOD puts on. Awesome! Makes you truly humble.

Respectfully,
73,
Don/KA5LQJ
Grid Sq: EM-32cl
29.600 mcs. FM simplex
10/10 #: 53243

 

[rdale]

But multiple SAME codes could be sent. The NWS already does this to cover multiple counties.

But people don't know what county they're in, let alone if they are in "central" vs "south central" or "south east", even if they were lucky enough to be in an Indiana square county!

This is NOT new from the NWS. They've been doing it for years, now it's just "official"