X36 "huge, tremendous, fantastic feature addition"?

[harryshute]

The concept of pay for some upgrades was mentioned as far back as when the XT scanners were announced. It's a good idea and I hope that Uniden expands upon it during the life of the x36HP. Uniden is putting a lot of effort and money into the x36HP, especially when it comes to fixing hardware problems. I don't expect them to abandon the platform for some time to come.

I think that just about everyone would like to see DMR, but I fear that the licensing costs will be steep. That's if licensing is even available.

I thought the pay for features was starting when the Uniden 250D and 785D were released. If you wanted P25 you bought the card to insert for $100. I had hoped other formats like Provoice could be added by buying and inserting another card. That didn't happen. At least now I'll be able to monitor Provoice in my 436 and 536.

 

[garys]

No really, those were hardware options. What we are talking about with the x36HP radios are firmware options. Which have been around for years in other fields, but not scanners. The Pro Voice feature is the start and I hope won't be the end of this.

I thought the pay for features was starting when the Uniden 250D and 785D were released. If you wanted P25 you bought the card to insert for $100. I had hoped other formats like Provoice could be added by buying and inserting another card. That didn't happen. At least now I'll be able to monitor Provoice in my 436 and 536.

 

[SOFA_KING]

The concept of pay for some upgrades was mentioned as far back as when the XT scanners were announced. It's a good idea and I hope that Uniden expands upon it during the life of the x36HP. Uniden is putting a lot of effort and money into the x36HP, especially when it comes to fixing hardware problems. I don't expect them to abandon the platform for some time to come.

I think that just about everyone would like to see DMR, but I fear that the licensing costs will be steep. That's if licensing is even available.

Licensing is what it is. With all the REALLY CHEAP DMR radios out there, likely CSI and TYT, it can't be that much. But I do wonder if Whistler has an "ace in the hole" and is about to make a "sneak attack" with DMR. Surely, they have been reading the mail. It's just a matter of time.

Phil

 

[Voyager]

What we are talking about with the x36HP radios are firmware options. Which have been around for years in other fields, but not scanners. The Pro Voice feature is the start and I hope won't be the end of this.

Actually, the Extreme option on the HP-1 was the start of it a couple years ago.

 

[Citywide173]

I thought the pay for features was starting when the Uniden 250D and 785D were released. If you wanted P25 you bought the card to insert for $100. I had hoped other formats like Provoice could be added by buying and inserting another card. That didn't happen. At least now I'll be able to monitor Provoice in my 436 and 536.

If you're counting hardware additions, you have to go way further back than that. CTCSS boards and pre-amps have been add ons since the BC-760XLT generation.

 

[garys]

True. I just never had enough interest in the HP1 to pay attention to that.

Actually, the Extreme option on the HP-1 was the start of it a couple years ago.

 

[slicerwizard]

I think that just about everyone would like to see DMR, but I fear that the licensing costs will be steep. That's if licensing is even available.

What's to license? NXDN/IDAS/NEXEDGE/DMR/TRBO all broadcast identically interleaved 72 bit Golay-protected AMBE+2 voice frames. None of those protocols "own" that voice frame format, and that is the only thing you need to look for in order to detect/extract/FEC/synthesize voice in all of those formats.

Trunking? No need to monitor/decode a control/rest channel - just fast scan the voice channels or simultaneously monitor all of them. There's this hardware that can simultaneously monitor a wide swath of spectrum - it usually goes by the moniker "SDR". I'm sure some of you have heard of it...

 

[Voyager]

I don't think DVSI would agree. But, I look forward to buying one of the scanners you make.

 

[Citywide173]

What's to license? NXDN/IDAS/NEXEDGE/DMR/TRBO all broadcast identically interleaved 72 bit Golay-protected AMBE+2 voice frames. None of those protocols "own" that voice frame format

ummmm.....apparently you haven't read the thread. You still have to pay licensing to DVSI to have a radio decode it, and TRBO is most definitely NOT open protocol. The patents are referenced earlier in this thread I believe.

 

[lelanjlaborde]

The scanner id number will be the hardest thing to copy once you get ready to pay your 50 bones....the last time i had to take a photo with my phone the number is so long!

 

[Voyager]

I use that 'cheat' all the time with registration numbers. I take a photo of them on one PC and enter that on another. Much easier than remember-n-paste.

 

[slicerwizard]

ummmm.....apparently you haven't read the thread. You still have to pay licensing to DVSI to have a radio decode it

Uniden already pays to license a 3600-2250 AMBE+2 vocoder.

and TRBO is most definitely NOT open protocol. The patents are referenced earlier in this thread I believe.

And no patented TRBO IP is required to monitor TRBO voice slots. Apparently you haven't paid any attention.

 

[Citywide173]

Uniden already pays to license a 3600-2250 AMBE+2 vocoder.


And no patented TRBO IP is required to monitor TRBO voice slots. Apparently you haven't paid any attention.

Yes, they do, for P25 P1, P2 and ProVoice. They would have to pay additional licensing for any other mode. Motorola does have licensing fees for any implementation of DMR that accesses a TRBO system. If you don't trust that which has been posted regarding this, please call DVSI at 978 392 0002. I stopped by their offices today, and they confirmed this for me.

Here is where Uniden said this same thing:

http://forums.radioreference.com/un...grade-bcdx36hp-line-radios-6.html#post2487041

 

[nbarco]

TRBO yes...but DMR no. Sure you won't be able to follow trunked systems using Motorola protocols...but you will hear voice transmissions on conventional frequencies as well as trunked as long as they don't follow...just implement the no-cost DMR options which will be enough for some people and of no licensing requirements. This too has been confirmed.

 

[Citywide173]

TRBO yes...but DMR no. Sure you won't be able to follow trunked systems using Motorola protocols...but you will hear voice transmissions on conventional frequencies as well as trunked as long as they don't follow...just implement the no-cost DMR options which will be enough for some people and of no licensing requirements. This too has been confirmed.

DVSI's chips are IP....you have to license with them for the use on each mode, open protocol or not, as UPMan said in the linked post....to operate legally

 

[slicerwizard]

DVSI's chips are IP....you have to license with them for the use on each mode, open protocol or not, as UPMan said in the linked post....to operate legally

Motorola's TRBO is not a mode that involves DVSI. If a device (like the AOR AR-DV1) is tuned to an RF carrier that is broadcasting DMR voice, the device will decode it. It doesn't matter if it's DMR Tier I, II or III, or if it's TRBO - the device won't care and probably won't even know which DMR variant is being monitored. DVSI saying that you need a separate license for TRBO wouldn't make much sense if you can't even detect when you're monitoring TRBO. Same deal for Motorola licensing, which Paul referenced; if TRBO voice looks like standard DMR voice, what IP are you supposed to license from Motorola?

 

[Voyager]

The control channel protocol which is proprietary to Motorola (TRBO)?

 

[Citywide173]

Motorola's TRBO is not a mode that involves DVSI. If a device (like the AOR AR-DV1) is tuned to an RF carrier that is broadcasting DMR voice, the device will decode it. It doesn't matter if it's DMR Tier I, II or III, or if it's TRBO - the device won't care and probably won't even know which DMR variant is being monitored. DVSI saying that you need a separate license for TRBO wouldn't make much sense if you can't even detect when you're monitoring TRBO. Same deal for Motorola licensing, which Paul referenced; if TRBO voice looks like standard DMR voice, what IP are you supposed to license from Motorola?

It's not a matter of what it looks like, it's a matter of what the US has allowed patents to be issued for. I don't think anyone is of the opinion that other modes are capable using the current hardware after the PV announcement. If Uniden turned around tomorrow and offered all modes without paying the appropriate licensing fees to the patent holders, how fast do you think they would be sued by DVSI and Motorola and an injunction to not release the firmware issued?

 

[slicerwizard]

The control channel protocol which is proprietary to Motorola (TRBO)?

Eh? The AR-DV1 will decode voice on TRBO channels, but it's not even a scanner, never mind a trunking scanner. And you think AOR should license TRBO IP from Motorola? IP that AOR has no use for and no interest in? And more importantly - doesn't use.

 

[MStep]

Eh? The AR-DV1 will decode voice on TRBO channels, but it's not even a scanner, never mind a trunking scanner. And you think AOR should license TRBO IP from Motorola? IP that AOR has no use for and no interest in? And more importantly - doesn't use.

My understanding is that the DV1 does have a scan function, but not a trunking function.