• To anyone looking to acquire commercial radio programming software:

    Please do not make requests for copies of radio programming software which is sold (or was sold) by the manufacturer for any monetary value. All requests will be deleted and a forum infraction issued. Making a request such as this is attempting to engage in software piracy and this forum cannot be involved or associated with this activity. The same goes for any private transaction via Private Message. Even if you attempt to engage in this activity in PM's we will still enforce the forum rules. Your PM's are not private and the administration has the right to read them if there's a hint to criminal activity.

    If you are having trouble legally obtaining software please state so. We do not want any hurt feelings when your vague post is mistaken for a free request. It is YOUR responsibility to properly word your request.

    To obtain Motorola software see the Sticky in the Motorola forum.

    The various other vendors often permit their dealers to sell the software online (i.e., Kenwood). Please use Google or some other search engine to find a dealer that sells the software. Typically each series or individual radio requires its own software package. Often the Kenwood software is less than $100 so don't be a cheapskate; just purchase it.

    For M/A Com/Harris/GE, etc: there are two software packages that program all current and past radios. One package is for conventional programming and the other for trunked programming. The trunked package is in upwards of $2,500. The conventional package is more reasonable though is still several hundred dollars. The benefit is you do not need multiple versions for each radio (unlike Motorola).

    This is a large and very visible forum. We cannot jeopardize the ability to provide the RadioReference services by allowing this activity to occur. Please respect this.

XTL Repeater

nikronzo

Member
Joined
Dec 28, 2020
Messages
253
A new project I am working is building a small P25 repeater out of 2 UHF XTL's; my goal is to have a low power, low duty cycle P25 machine built out of two XTL2500's. I've done my research and have not seen a lot of info regarding building something like this outside of using XTL's for DVRS'. I know there are a few limitations such as lack of passing on RIDs and duty cycle problems but this is experimental at this stage.

Does anybody have any experience building something like this and if so, what sort of pinouts would I need out of J2 ports in the back. I am looking to build a custom cable for this as well. Also what CPS settings would I be looking at for the Rx and Tx side of things.

Closest helpful info I could find was the PDF of the Astro Spectra Consolette manual appendix A on page 107

Moreover, does everyone think this project is feasible?
 

jeepsandradios

Member
Feed Provider
Joined
Jul 29, 2012
Messages
2,005
Location
East of the Mississippi
I built one. Used it once. Swapped in a Quantar.

1 - No it will not pass ID of the radio talking. You will only see the ID of the transmitting radio.
2 - Encryption will not pass thru the repeater. You would need both radios setup for encryption, one to decode and one to encode.
3 - All signals are on J2 however there was a version where the detect circuit changed. Early went high on RX and later went low. (Pin 13 - Channel Activity)

To be honest unless its a one time use thing spend a few $$ and grab a quantar.
 

prcguy

Member
Joined
Jun 30, 2006
Messages
15,224
Location
So Cal - Richardson, TX - Tewksbury, MA
Yes yes yes on this! A used Quantar will usually cost less than two XTL2500 mobiles.


I built one. Used it once. Swapped in a Quantar.

1 - No it will not pass ID of the radio talking. You will only see the ID of the transmitting radio.
2 - Encryption will not pass thru the repeater. You would need both radios setup for encryption, one to decode and one to encode.
3 - All signals are on J2 however there was a version where the detect circuit changed. Early went high on RX and later went low. (Pin 13 - Channel Activity)

To be honest unless its a one time use thing spend a few $$ and grab a quantar.
 

nikronzo

Member
Joined
Dec 28, 2020
Messages
253
Yes yes yes on this! A used Quantar will usually cost less than two XTL2500 mobiles.
While this can be true, I already have the XTL's and they arent doing anything as of right now so I wanted to experiment a bit. For the sake of argument, what if I just wanted to do FM with the two mobiles.
I'm waiting for someone to say sell the mobiles and use the cash to buy the quantar, which isn't the worst idea lol
 

nikronzo

Member
Joined
Dec 28, 2020
Messages
253
I built one. Used it once. Swapped in a Quantar.

1 - No it will not pass ID of the radio talking. You will only see the ID of the transmitting radio.
2 - Encryption will not pass thru the repeater. You would need both radios setup for encryption, one to decode and one to encode.
3 - All signals are on J2 however there was a version where the detect circuit changed. Early went high on RX and later went low. (Pin 13 - Channel Activity)

To be honest unless its a one time use thing spend a few $$ and grab a quantar.
Do you still happen to have the pinouts for the crosspatch cable on the J2 ports?
 

MTS2000des

5B2_BEE00 Czar
Joined
Jul 12, 2008
Messages
5,173
Location
Cobb County, GA Stadium Crime Zone
Hams and their fetishes for building repeaters out of mobile radios.
Aside from the obvious as mentioned, XTLs aren't rated for even 50 percent duty cycle. Gas bagging hams with 3 minute keydowns won't lead to much service life.
A Quantar, OTOH, can be keyed up 24/7/365 (as many were used in trunking environments where active CC stayed up continuously) and will never skip a beat.
They are also miles above some uniboard disposable mobile radio in performance in all respects if aligned properly.
 

nikronzo

Member
Joined
Dec 28, 2020
Messages
253
Fetish is such a strong word. I prefer mild preoccupation. I have an MTR2k set up as a repeater and love it to death, its duty cycle is unparalleled as I'm sure the quantar is even better.
I just wanted to mess around with the XTL's as a mini repeater as I have never done that before, only with CDM's.
 

Moto_Dan

Member
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Oct 26, 2010
Messages
45
I built one just to try it out. The digital audio quality was not horrible, but was not perfect. The radio did heat up rather quickly so if you are dead set on it add a few fans to the TX radio. I have attached below a cable diagram.



XTL UNI DIR RPT CABLE.PNG
 

jeepsandradios

Member
Feed Provider
Joined
Jul 29, 2012
Messages
2,005
Location
East of the Mississippi
They work but as said not ideal. Ours was a for a SAR interop unit. Simple and effective but other than voice you loose all the P25 features that benefit from P25 (ID mostly). Still it filled the void for the incident. If it was long term the quantar is the go to for me.
 

Project25_MASTR

Millennial Graying OBT Guy
Joined
Jun 16, 2013
Messages
4,163
Location
Texas
Simoco has a (licensed) function which allows two SRM9000 bricks to become a P25 repeater by simply crossing the RX Data line on one's control head to the TX data line of the other's. They call it Simple P25 Repeater. There are some limitations but for just repeating P25 it works (there's some issue when you try and get it to repeat analog and digital or analog but I can't remember what it is).

Theroretically, that's the 10,000 ft overview of how any P25 repeater works...receiver demodulates datastream and sends it over to the transmitter via serial bus. This is why Quantars don't even have IMBE vocoders in them....all of the vocoding is done by either the SU's, the system or the console. I'm not sure if anyone has ever really figured out a way to pull the SB9600 data off a RX radio and send it back out a TX radio's SB9600 bus (which would eliminate the double vocode issue) though.
 

redbeard

OH, PA, WV Regional Admin
Database Admin
Joined
Feb 5, 2003
Messages
1,237
Location
BEE00.348-3.1
Simoco has a (licensed) function which allows two SRM9000 bricks to become a P25 repeater by simply crossing the RX Data line on one's control head to the TX data line of the other's. They call it Simple P25 Repeater. There are some limitations but for just repeating P25 it works (there's some issue when you try and get it to repeat analog and digital or analog but I can't remember what it is).

Theroretically, that's the 10,000 ft overview of how any P25 repeater works...receiver demodulates datastream and sends it over to the transmitter via serial bus. This is why Quantars don't even have IMBE vocoders in them....all of the vocoding is done by either the SU's, the system or the console. I'm not sure if anyone has ever really figured out a way to pull the SB9600 data off a RX radio and send it back out a TX radio's SB9600 bus (which would eliminate the double vocode issue) though.
@nikronzo You should ask our Vodka-named friend about his project.

It seems that when an XTL is tricked into thinking it's connected to a DVRS unit, it passes quite a bit of info out of it including raw IMBE. The right piece of software could connect two XTLs together and not only not double-vocode but also pass all the required data like RIDs. This is all functionality that is standard when an XTL is paired with a DVRS (Digital Vehicular Repeater System).
 
Top