Yaesu FT-817 Rubber Duck Information

[tweiss3]

Our local parks system is allowing us to do a parks on the air program. I hiked two last weekend with my Kenwood D74 clipped on my backpack and a speaker mike, however, I had zero contacts, though I was receiving APRS about 70% of the time. This was a quick 5 minute package thrown together to get the kids out of the house and enjoy the outdoors.

I figured, I have a bunch of materials sitting around, namely my FT-817nd. One of the great things about the 817 is the stock rubber ducky that does 6m pretty well out of the box. I also came across this site disusing how to get an antenna above my head: The Back-Pack-a-Tenna – Fauquier Amateur Radio Association

My dilema? I would like to put the 817 in the pack and build a small mast off my backpack to get the antenna over my head. I'd be ok if I had to by a signalstik antenna, but the stock rubber ducky works well, and includes 6m (which is what the first confirmed activation for our group was on). If I use the stock rubber ducky, and provided a longer counterpoise, will it work as anticipated, or will the antenna not work well not directly attached to the front BNC? I can't find many details on the Yaesu antenna.

 

[WB9YBM]

I would like to put the 817 in the pack and build a small mast off my backpack to get the antenna over my head. I'd be ok if I had to by a signalstik antenna, but the stock rubber ducky works well, and includes 6m (which is what the first confirmed activation for our group was on). If I use the stock rubber ducky, and provided a longer counterpoise, will it work as anticipated, or will the antenna not work well not directly attached to the front BNC? I can't find many details on the Yaesu antenna.

Do I understand correctly it's the rubber duck antenna that you can't find info on? If so, I'm guessing lack of information might be because not all that many people take a rubber duck seriously so it's not worth it for anyone to go through the effort & expense to print data about it.

At a few hamfests in the past I've seen people take a metal hard hat and mount either a duck or 1/4 wave on top of that, using the hardhat as a counterpoise. Not sure how much of a signal increase they got but I assume anything's better than a duck on the radio clipped to a belt.

 

[vagrant]

Hmm...I have not exactly tested the Yaesu rubber duck with a counterpoise at the feed point while using a short BNC patch cable. It should help, but that's quite a bit of counterpoise dragging. I will say that Yaesu antenna for 6m use is good. It beats any Diamond brand rubber duck that does 6m. I even purchased an additional Yaesu YHA-63 and the 2/6m stub. I use it on a 2/6m FM handheld for the local repeaters.

If I would be stationary during TX/RX I would use my 6m telescopic single band antenna. It is better on 6m and it is 45.5 inches long with a flexible base with a wire coil and a BNC connected on the end. Still, I would not use that telescoping extended while moving. It will die a quick death catching a branch, or whatnot. It is definitely not the MFJ 6m monoband. Actually, it looks very much (exactly) like this one on eBay. Ham Amateur Radio 6 Meter 6m Band 50MHz 45.5" BNC QRP Telescopic Antenna | eBay

I almost forgot that I have a Thales 1600629-2 which handles 30-90 MHz. It is the folding military style and works properly when fully extended. Anyways, all of these antennas work better with a counterpoise based on my testing.

 

[tweiss3]

Hmm...I have not exactly tested the Yaesu rubber duck with a counterpoise at the feed point while using a short BNC patch cable. It should help, but that's quite a bit of counterpoise dragging. I will say that Yaesu antenna for 6m use is good. It beats any Diamond brand rubber duck that does 6m. I even purchased an additional Yaesu YHA-63 and the 2/6m stub. I use it on a 2/6m FM handheld for the local repeaters.

If I would be stationary during TX/RX I would use my 6m telescopic single band antenna. It is better on 6m and it is 45.5 inches long with a flexible base with a wire coil and a BNC connected on the end. Still, I would not use that telescoping extended while moving. It will die a quick death catching a branch, or whatnot. It is definitely not the MFJ 6m monoband. Actually, it looks very much (exactly) like this one on eBay. Ham Amateur Radio 6 Meter 6m Band 50MHz 45.5" BNC QRP Telescopic Antenna | eBay

I almost forgot that I have a Thales 1600629-2 which handles 30-90 MHz. It is the folding military style and works properly when fully extended. Anyways, all of these antennas work better with a counterpoise based on my testing.

This information has been extremely helpful.

I bought a signalstik yesterday, its like anything, the more parts you have on the shelf, the better off you are. It will get used one way or the other.

Good to know that the YHA-63 outperforms many of the other options, I won't look at the Diamond stuff. I'm going to give it a shot with an adjustable counterpoise, permanently the counterpoise will be 19", but have a lead to add to it to make it 56" total. If it doesn't work, I'm only out my time. I think I have enough wire sitting around.

I have a multiband vertical that looks like that MFJ. I can't remember if it is MFJ or a similar competitor, but it has the coil with the lead. Its too tall/fragile to use mobile, but it works ok with counterpoise in my stationary testing at home.

I haven't heard of that Thales antenna. I may look into one at some point, depending on how things go, might be hard to hike with.

 

[tweiss3]

For what it's worth, I built a backpack with a PVC mast that sticks 2 above the top of the bag, BNC on top of the mast, and put the YHA-63 on it. I have a counterpoise at 19", with a removable lead that extends the counterpoise to 57" straight down. SWR wasn't measured officially, but on the radio, it matches the antenna directly connected to the front BNC.

The short, the antenna works the same, with acceptable SWR, remote mounted with 57" counterpoise as it does direct connected to the radio.

 

[sloop]

Use the counterpoise! I have the same rig and antenna. I tested the antenna with a MFJ antenna analyzer both with the antenna mounted directly to the analyzer and to a magnetic mount on a metal table. The antenna was spot on for frequency and as you would expect did better on the metal table. On the radio you act as the counterpoise (ground) and since you want to move it way from the radio a counterpoise will benefit you. You might also check (if you haven't already) www.hfpack.com. The site has a wealth of info. on backpack qrp and antennas.

 

[vagrant]

@tweiss3 I forgot about another antenna you may want to consider. It is a 6 meter Hamstick. The base length is around 35 inches and with the stinger it is about 49 inches long. I have a handful of various original Hamsticks that work fine, considering their size. I a unsure about the new versions made by MFJ and others. Actually, I have never tested them for portable use. Still, I would have a length of wire wound up and secure one end at the base of the antenna. Keeping the wire elevated I would then extend it out and secure it so that it is above ground. Actually, if you could string up two wires of correct equal length you should see an improvement and use plastic stakes or walking sticks at the ends. The more the merrier, but at some point it may lose quick setup/takedown.