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  #41 (permalink)  
Old 07-09-2018, 6:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hiddenrun View Post
Just to correct this before it causes confusion.

The Unication G4 Pager is only 700-800 mhz. ( NOT available in any other bands )

The Unication G5 Pager is available in VHF/700-800 MHz, and various UHF/700-800 MHz.
I think their point was the G4 does receive in the UHF frequencies: 300MHz to 3GHz, and DMR is not tied to a frequency range.
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Old 07-09-2018, 6:20 AM
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Originally Posted by belvdr View Post
I think their point was the G4 does receive in the UHF frequencies: 300MHz to 3GHz, and DMR is not tied to a frequency range.
My point is:

The G4 does NOT receive UHF frequencies.

The G5 does receive UHF.

The G4 is a different model then the G5.
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  #43 (permalink)  
Old 07-09-2018, 6:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hiddenrun View Post
My point is:

The G4 does NOT receive UHF frequencies.

The G5 does receive UHF.

The G4 is a different model then the G5.
The bolded statement is not correct. UHF goes from 300MHz to 3GHz so the G4 does technically receive UHF frequencies.

The marketing spin from Unication is not technically correct. It's simply used to designate the difference between the models.
  #44 (permalink)  
Old 07-09-2018, 6:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by belvdr View Post
The bolded statement is not correct. UHF goes from 300MHz to 3GHz so the G4 does technically receive UHF frequencies.

The marketing spin from Unication is not technically correct. It's simply used to designate the difference between the models.
I get what you are saying, but is there any DMR in the G4 763 - 776MHz and 851 - 870MHz range?
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  #45 (permalink)  
Old 07-09-2018, 7:07 AM
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Originally Posted by hiddenrun View Post
I get what you are saying, but is there any DMR in the G4 763 - 776MHz and 851 - 870MHz range?
I don't know if any DMR is deployed in that frequency range or not. I don't see why it's not possible to do so.

EDIT: After a bit of searching, I did find Carroll County, TN:

https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?sid=8625

Runs roughly 854-858 MHz and is DMR Tier 3.

Last edited by belvdr; 07-09-2018 at 8:01 AM..
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Old 07-09-2018, 7:40 AM
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Originally Posted by lsh1885 View Post
what good what it do to have DMR on the G4 since DMR is on the UHF band.
DMR can be found on VHF, UHF, and 800/900Mhz ranges in lots of places....
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  #47 (permalink)  
Old 07-09-2018, 8:01 AM
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I know here in Orlando all DMR is in the 400 MHZ range there isn't any DMR in the 700/800 MHZ range here.
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Old 07-09-2018, 8:12 AM
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When I lived in Maryland, I was shocked to find a concrete business operating on 860Mhz DMR.... it's amazing what you might find out there.
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  #49 (permalink)  
Old 07-09-2018, 10:25 AM
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You'll see many more DMR systems in the 7-800mHz range as SMR operators convert to DMR. Another example: https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?sid=8423
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Old 07-09-2018, 5:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lsh1885 View Post
I know here in Orlando all DMR is in the 400 MHZ range there isn't any DMR in the 700/800 MHZ range here.
Ahhhmm....try searching 900 MHz.
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Old 07-09-2018, 5:10 PM
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Originally Posted by radio3353 View Post
I don't think that is even the issue. Unication's pagers are made for and marketed to professional users, i.e. emergency responders. If a feature the hobbyist want (like a hold feature) could inadvertently interfere with receiving an emergency page, Unication will not do it. That's just my conjecture, of course. All things considered there are features I would like to see added, all of which have been previously mentioned here, but I am still mindful of who the pagers are made for. And it is not the hobbyist.
But couldn't even a fire chief wanna have a scan delay and a hold / resume button? If a chief is wanting to keep an ear out for all the activity, wouldn't it be nice to stop and hold an a talk group in case something big's hittin' the fan? And to have a scan delay to avoid getting a mixture of unrelated conversations like you're just conventionally scanning?
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  #52 (permalink)  
Old 07-09-2018, 5:12 PM
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The G4 does not receive 900 MHZ
  #53 (permalink)  
Old 07-09-2018, 6:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Homeboys-Scanna View Post
But couldn't even a fire chief wanna have a scan delay and a hold / resume button? If a chief is wanting to keep an ear out for all the activity, wouldn't it be nice to stop and hold an a talk group in case something big's hittin' the fan? And to have a scan delay to avoid getting a mixture of unrelated conversations like you're just conventionally scanning?
I don't think that is the purpose of a pager.
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Old 07-09-2018, 7:19 PM
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Originally Posted by radio3353 View Post
I don't think that is the purpose of a pager.
You can hold on a frequency on the VHF/UHF side, but not the 7/800 side. I'm sure there's a reason for it, but it is easily adjusted for by putting single talkgoup scanlists in adjacent knob positions. I can see a chief wanting to keep tabs on an adjacent jurisdiction when they have something going that might eventually involve their own assets, while keeping their radio on their own department. The pager is versatile as is, and the hobbyist user has to keep in mind that it is not a scanner. The fire chief (or any other member who has an assigned pager for that matter), on the other hand, is using it as a tool and most likely doesn't have the ability to alter the settings as easily as the hobbyist due to restrictions on the radio system preventing them from programming it, so this might be a desirable option for them as well. The purpose is what the user defines it to be.

I'd also be interested in how many units are sold to departments vs. hobbyists. Since this was discovered by hobbyists it seems to have gained significant popularity and the numbers might be closer than one would think. I have to agree that options that affect emergency conditions must be considered, but when the pager is under the control of a system manager with training and uniformity, the presence of options that wouldn't be used shouldn't be an issue.

EDIT:

A department that ordered 100 pagers is always going to have more clout than 100 individuals that purchased 1 pager each, but in the end, it's still 100 pagers sold.
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  #55 (permalink)  
Old 07-09-2018, 7:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lsh1885 View Post
The G4 does not receive 900 MHZ
I believe that was pointed out for those asking about DMR above 400 MHz, not specific to the G4
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  #56 (permalink)  
Old 07-09-2018, 7:48 PM
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The average first responder / volunteer fire fighter has two knob positions and 3 or 4 TGID's. One position is his group of ID's they need to respond to the other is usually set to monitor. Some are locked out of programming and some know better than listening to other traffic an missing their primary calls.

Hobbyists make maybe 2-5% of users. Maybe. As you know by our Taiwan site, we are working on other models. Public safety devices will stay what benefits public safety. Good things to come from Unication.
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Old 07-09-2018, 9:01 PM
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Really looking for that VHF/UHF version for Public Safety.
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Old 07-10-2018, 7:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Uni1 View Post
The average first responder / volunteer fire fighter has two knob positions and 3 or 4 TGID's. One position is his group of ID's they need to respond to the other is usually set to monitor. Some are locked out of programming and some know better than listening to other traffic an missing their primary calls.

Hobbyists make maybe 2-5% of users. Maybe. As you know by our Taiwan site, we are working on other models. Public safety devices will stay what benefits public safety. Good things to come from Unication.
Thank you for the numbers. There must be many more units out there than I figured with hobbyist numbers being so low.

As far as listening to other traffic and missing their own calls.....that's BS. If someone is savvy enough to monitor other departments using the pager, they are also smart enough to ensure they don't miss their own calls. Before the Unication, I had a Motorola EX600XLS in my pocket scanning the other two public safety agencies in my jurisdiction and several adjacent jurisdictions while my Motorola XTS2500 on my belt was on the department frequency. It is the job of the system manager to keep it is simple as possible for the end user and they may design the programming to specifically not allow the possibility to exist, but to suggest that someone will miss calls because they are listening to other traffic is demeaning to public safety officials using your product.

Of course, the opposite could be true and the user would use the department radio or scanner to monitor other activity while using the pager to ensure they don't miss a call. While more reliable than a scanner, the pager is not as reliable as a two-way.

I've been showing my bosses the Unication, and they like it. We recently added a P25 channel and the EX600XLS's they bought years ago can't receive it, so they are looking for affordable compact solutions for the command staff. They like the form factor and love the ability to monitor the other UHF public safety in the city as well as the 700MHz overlay system that is in place, so don't discount the ability to monitor as something that doesn't benefit public safety because they might miss something on their own channel. I believe we have bought our final batch of alpha pagers from you because Everbridge is being deployed, but hopefully I can drive some G5 sales your way.
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  #59 (permalink)  
Old 07-10-2018, 10:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Citywide173 View Post
Thank you for the numbers. There must be many more units out there than I figured with hobbyist numbers being so low.

As far as listening to other traffic and missing their own calls.....that's BS. If someone is savvy enough to monitor other departments using the pager, they are also smart enough to ensure they don't miss their own calls. Before the Unication, I had a Motorola EX600XLS in my pocket scanning the other two public safety agencies in my jurisdiction and several adjacent jurisdictions while my Motorola XTS2500 on my belt was on the department frequency. It is the job of the system manager to keep it is simple as possible for the end user and they may design the programming to specifically not allow the possibility to exist, but to suggest that someone will miss calls because they are listening to other traffic is demeaning to public safety officials using your product.

Of course, the opposite could be true and the user would use the department radio or scanner to monitor other activity while using the pager to ensure they don't miss a call. While more reliable than a scanner, the pager is not as reliable as a two-way.

I've been showing my bosses the Unication, and they like it. We recently added a P25 channel and the EX600XLS's they bought years ago can't receive it, so they are looking for affordable compact solutions for the command staff. They like the form factor and love the ability to monitor the other UHF public safety in the city as well as the 700MHz overlay system that is in place, so don't discount the ability to monitor as something that doesn't benefit public safety because they might miss something on their own channel. I believe we have bought our final batch of alpha pagers from you because Everbridge is being deployed, but hopefully I can drive some G5 sales your way.

I appreciate you insight , but do you really think most volunteers have a P25 portable they use in addition to the G5? They do not. If they had a portable, the would not need our device. When the are off listening to an adjacent county, the miss their messages. Passworded programming is for this very reason.
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Old 07-10-2018, 2:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Uni1 View Post
I appreciate you insight , but do you really think most volunteers have a P25 portable they use in addition to the G5? They do not. If they had a portable, the would not need our device. When the are off listening to an adjacent county, the miss their messages. Passworded programming is for this very reason.
I'm going to get eaten alive for this, but pagers are designed to alert a large group so that hopefully a small group shows up to respond. For the most part, if you are tethered to a pager, there is no expectation that you will be available 100% of the time, and as such, a missed call is not as much of an impact on the system as some would have you believe.

I believe that if they are interested enough to listen to adjacent jurisdictions, they are also cognizant of the fact that the potential exists to miss a call in their own jurisdiction while they are doing so, and because of that, have another way to ensure it doesn't happen.

Having owned a shop, I can tell you that the statement
Quote:
Originally Posted by Uni1 View Post
If they had a portable, the would not need our device
is not true. I have known many volunteers that were issued both so that they didn't have to carry a bulky radio all the time. That was when the Minitor III was king, but with the realization that if you issue a radio to someone it gets better care and longer service life, I would expect to see more of it today, especially among company officers. The statement is also a bit of a defeatist view from a sales perspective. Unication pagers offer great flexibility that may not be realized until it is pointed out to the customer.

I'm not trying to badmouth anyone or the Unication line here, the pagers are one of the most versatile tools I have seen, and the potential use goes well beyond its initial intended design. With a few more bells/whistles such as those that people have mentioned above included in the PPS that could be controlled by the system manager in places where the department has purchased them and available to individual owners it could probably own specific markets. I am a scanner user, but not in the way most here are. While I still use scanners for listening and searching at home, my G5 is a tool for me that has almost completely replaced my scanner outside of the house, both in work at Boston EMS and when I'm off duty doing fire scene photography. The form factor and performance make it perfect for those who are reporters, news photographers, insurance adjusters and probably many tow operators. All I'm saying is don't discount other markets that it could generate sales in simply because of its intended purpose. I am truly excited to see what the future holds for the company.
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