Arvada PD gone dark

Status
Not open for further replies.
Joined
Jan 27, 2008
Messages
83
Location
Scottsbluff, NE 69361
why can't these departments just put up their own feeds with a delay added in to make using it to evade law enforcement useless but still allow the public to monitor them?

seems to me this would be a good compromise.
 

dw2872

Member
Joined
Sep 23, 2009
Messages
1,050
Location
Colorado
I seriously doubt this is happening with encrypted talkgroups. If it is/was, ANYONE with a home-made press badge and a blog could contact the agency and demand the same access, and sue in Federal Court if they don't get it based on the First Amendment. And, they would likely have a good case. Of course, the judge could only afford relief of "equal" access, which could be 100% or 0% depending on the agency's course of action.

If this is happening, it would have to be a very, very, very well kept secret...

Yep, it did happen and I can see the same thing happening in Denver Metro with the news agencies there IF larger agencies do the same thing as Arvada and Fort Collins. I don't see the Fort Collins Coloradoan newspaper monitoring 24/7 though and so much is missed.

Awtry: The big compromise on police radio traffic encryption | The Coloradoan | coloradoan.com
 

Kevin_N

Member
Joined
Nov 6, 2008
Messages
231
Location
Littleton, CO
That might sound like a good solution, but I think it has some major drawbacks.

Audio quality...............Most of the streaming stuff doesn't sound very good.

No control over what channel you are listening to or any customization.........meaning what's in your scan list or not.

How to listen.............either stuck on your computer with decent speakers or listening on a smart phone with a crummy speaker or earphone.

It seems like the perfect compromise is to just have encrypted channels for the RARE occasion where it's needed. The VAST majority of calls don't need it. If they did all the agencies would have had it years ago.

Then the department, the media, and the citizens are all happy with a nice compromise and trade off between officer safety and the ability to know what's going on.

Assuming that something happened to cause Arvada to make the change, what was it, something like 1 call in how many thousand?

They didn't need to lock out everything. Didn't they already have an encrypted TAC channel?

Locking out everything is at least a big overreaction to something, but begs the question about what's really going on there.


why can't these departments just put up their own feeds with a delay added in to make using it to evade law enforcement useless but still allow the public to monitor them?

seems to me this would be a good compromise.
 

natedawg1604

Member
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Jun 29, 2013
Messages
2,732
Location
Colorado
Yep, it did happen and I can see the same thing happening in Denver Metro with the news agencies there IF larger agencies do the same thing as Arvada and Fort Collins. I don't see the Fort Collins Coloradoan newspaper monitoring 24/7 though and so much is missed.

Awtry: The big compromise on police radio traffic encryption | The Coloradoan | coloradoan.com

Well anyone on this forum who lives in that area probably has standing to sue if you get yourself a blog and a homemade press badge. Also, you would have to find some way to offer plausible evidence that the agency was actually giving a newspaper access to encrypted talkgroups. Finally, you would also have to formally request access to the same radio provided to the other news outlet, and get them to formally deny your request.

Like I said earlier, if someone actually pursued such a suit it is highly likely the agency would simply cut off access to all media outlets instead of paying attorneys to fight your lawsuit, which might be why few people challenge the practice. However, in my view it is totally illegal and unconstitutional for any government agency to offer selective access to official information/records based upon the size of a particular media organization (i.e. a "full time journalist" at a newspaper vs. citizen blogger). The First Amendment does not distinguish between institutional press vs. any other kind of press.

Update: based on the article I just read, it should be quite easy to allege in a complaint the existence of this bizarre selective-access policy. So all you'd have to do is establish you lived in the jurisdiction in question and actually attempted without success to obtain access to the same radio talkgroups provided to the Coloradoan. As long as you present yourself as a bonafide journalist reporting upon matters affecting the Fort Collins area, you should have the exact same access as any other newspaper. And if they deny you, don't THREATEN to sue them, just file a damn complaint in Federal Court.
 
Last edited:

JoeyC

Senior Member
Joined
Dec 19, 2002
Messages
3,523
Location
San Diego, CA
why can't these departments just put up their own feeds with a delay added in to make using it to evade law enforcement useless but still allow the public to monitor them?

seems to me this would be a good compromise.
Because the intended recipient is not the general public and they have no obligation to provide workarounds to hobbyists for their enjoyment.
 

natedawg1604

Member
Premium Subscriber
Joined
Jun 29, 2013
Messages
2,732
Location
Colorado
Yep, it did happen and I can see the same thing happening in Denver Metro with the news agencies there IF larger agencies do the same thing as Arvada and Fort Collins. I don't see the Fort Collins Coloradoan newspaper monitoring 24/7 though and so much is missed.

Awtry: The big compromise on police radio traffic encryption | The Coloradoan | coloradoan.com

Also, at this point Fort Collin's PD cannot necessarily be accused of having a "selective access" policy, if nobody else ever requested the same access! Has anyone who lives near Fort Collins simply requested access to these same talkgroups, in accordance with their need to report timely and relevant information to the community in their capacity as a citizen journalist (whether via this forum, incident paging networks, blogs or other media channels)? If I lived in the area I would do it myself, but I don't. Just a thought folks...
 

dw2872

Member
Joined
Sep 23, 2009
Messages
1,050
Location
Colorado
This was sent out on Mountain News Net last night at 9:45 pm but Arvada PD finally confirmed the incident this morning around 6 am.

Denver Post
http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_27820389/arvada-cop-crashes-into-denver-ravine-near-stock

They wont say what an on duty Arvada officer was doing in Denver when he crashed into a ravine but we wont know until they tell us because their communications are now encrypted.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top