I am interested in joining my local CERT Group,
I was told they can help me get my 440 and 2M Ticket, what benifit does this hold in CERT?
I was told they can help me get my 440 and 2M Ticket, what benifit does this hold in CERT?
CERT and Ham?
- Thread starter SKYNET156
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RadioDaze
Member
CERT members who are ham operators will coordinate various events using their radios. In the event of an emergency, the ability to communicate will be critical, and some of the CERT groups will work in conjunction with their local RACES group. Some CERT organizations will host a ham licensing class, such as Gordon West. You would probably need to pay for the ham class, but the CERT training itself is usually free to residents of the city.
You will find your CERT program to be fun and educational. You'll learn disaster preparedness, light search & rescue, basic first aid, fire suppression, and maybe even CPR. And you will instantly have a lot of new friends to talk with once you get your Technician ham license, as well as a lot of mentoring from the members who have been hams for a while.
You will find your CERT program to be fun and educational. You'll learn disaster preparedness, light search & rescue, basic first aid, fire suppression, and maybe even CPR. And you will instantly have a lot of new friends to talk with once you get your Technician ham license, as well as a lot of mentoring from the members who have been hams for a while.
Locally we find that most CERT members who are instructed to get their license; 1) have no real interest in radio and loose interest very quickly and; 2) quickly forget how to use the radio when it becomes a time that they actually need it. We have seen this up-close and personal on numerous occassions.
Part 90 equipment, sponsored by your local agency, or Part 95 equipment is the proper place for those activities.
Part 90 equipment, sponsored by your local agency, or Part 95 equipment is the proper place for those activities.
N0BDW
Member
I'll echo RadioDaze's comments re: CERT. It's fun, educational, and overall worth-while. However I also agree with KS4VT that for the most part CERT is not the appropriate target for amateur radio licensing unless they also happen to be interested in the hobby. That's exactly what it is: a hobby. Forcing a hobby on someone is generally a Bad Idea(TM). I think radio communications are essential to CERT groups, but I don't think part 97 is the way to accomplish that in most cases.
I am interested in CERT as far as the activities mentioned, i am not really interested in Ham (No Offense) but it's just alot of talking, maybe i can suggest a GMRS Repeater or something along those lines for my local CERT Group for offical communications.
I am interested in SAR and Neighborhood Patrols and Disaster Services as a Volunteer Responder, But not so much Ham.
I am interested in SAR and Neighborhood Patrols and Disaster Services as a Volunteer Responder, But not so much Ham.
N0BDW
Member
No offense taken. It's not for everyone. And no offense to you, but I'd just as soon not have people who aren't interested in the hobby using our spectrum. GMRS, FRS (if you wana go the cheap route), or a part 90 commercial license could all work. The county the CERT group is organized in may have a part 90 license they could transfer to you. It isn't uncommon for example to have some VHF spectrum licensed that the PD used to use and they have now migrated to UHF.
I forget what CERT group in Orange County. But one of them helped out at the fire camp few years ago doing the brush fire season.
West County CERT - (Orange County, California)
http://westcountycert.com/
San Diego, California does weekly CERT Ham check-ins.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SDG-InterCERT/
West County CERT - (Orange County, California)
http://westcountycert.com/
San Diego, California does weekly CERT Ham check-ins.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SDG-InterCERT/
RadioDaze
Member
I agree that a significant number of hams, if not most, who become licensed for CERT purposes don't go on to become active ham hobbyists. But those who drill with the check-in nets and attend subsequent training for correct operation of their radios will probably know what to do when needed.
Since the non-hobbyist CERT communicators tend to restrict their operations to a few select repeaters, and infrequently at that, they probably have little impact on the overall resources. Many of them most likely stash their radios away until needed.
As far as using GMRS, it probably won't happen. Ham radio is simply more integral with emergency communications; the infrastructures are in place, and have been for a long time. The capabilities of ham equipment, especially when deployed in emergency scenarios, are greater and more standardized. Also, CERT has an organizational relationship with RACES and FEMA.
In an objective list of pros and cons for utilizing licensed hams and their equipment for CERT, I think you'll ultimately find ham as the best alternative.
Since the non-hobbyist CERT communicators tend to restrict their operations to a few select repeaters, and infrequently at that, they probably have little impact on the overall resources. Many of them most likely stash their radios away until needed.
As far as using GMRS, it probably won't happen. Ham radio is simply more integral with emergency communications; the infrastructures are in place, and have been for a long time. The capabilities of ham equipment, especially when deployed in emergency scenarios, are greater and more standardized. Also, CERT has an organizational relationship with RACES and FEMA.
In an objective list of pros and cons for utilizing licensed hams and their equipment for CERT, I think you'll ultimately find ham as the best alternative.
The problem of using disinterested ham licensees who are there for CERT operations only is, I think, a significant one, and something that should be addressed by the groups that put on the licensing classes and recruit people.
As I see it, the folks who just pull out the radio for nets and exercises aren't always developing the radio skills that makes amateur radio so valuable in an emergency. Their operating practices can be awkward, their familiarity with their radios is minimal, and should something break, they frequently don't have the skill sets necessary to effect even a simple repair.
Now, that being said, I'm not advocating that CERT groups move away from amateur radio altogether. I think better education, particularly pointing out that public safety is just one of several reasons that the amateur service exists at all in the first place. Emphasis on operations and co-existing with other interest groups within amateur radio would be helpful. Routine use of the radio would enhance their abilities during an emergency, even if it's just to talk to other CERT members on a daily basis. Pulling out a radio once a month for a net is probably not sufficient to insure that the operator is up to snuff, and it's not enough to insure that the radio will work when it's really needed.
As I see it, the folks who just pull out the radio for nets and exercises aren't always developing the radio skills that makes amateur radio so valuable in an emergency. Their operating practices can be awkward, their familiarity with their radios is minimal, and should something break, they frequently don't have the skill sets necessary to effect even a simple repair.
Now, that being said, I'm not advocating that CERT groups move away from amateur radio altogether. I think better education, particularly pointing out that public safety is just one of several reasons that the amateur service exists at all in the first place. Emphasis on operations and co-existing with other interest groups within amateur radio would be helpful. Routine use of the radio would enhance their abilities during an emergency, even if it's just to talk to other CERT members on a daily basis. Pulling out a radio once a month for a net is probably not sufficient to insure that the operator is up to snuff, and it's not enough to insure that the radio will work when it's really needed.
mjthomas59
Member
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I have read the posts and tend to agree with most of them to a certain point. The 1st question you have to ask though is what does the CERT Team that I am trying to join currently using for communications.
It obviously isn't a requirement to have a Ham License just to be on a CERT team. Maybe they already have enough comm guys for ham radio equipment and it isn't needed. Perhaps they have a good foothold with the local emergency management agency or local fire dept to fill the comm needs with commercial equipment, either way the answer you need is what is the team currently doing and what is the team planning to do in the future with their communications. Maybe the team doesn't have anything beyond cell phones, maybe they have a cache of public safety radios they can access and a licensed frequency to use them on, maybe they have HAM radio, amateur repeaters, and APRS position tracking, I mean seriously who knows?? There is no standard whatsoever so you have to ask. If you want to do CERT, but your group uses public safety radios/freqs, then it wouldn't make much sense to study for a HAM license anyway unless you just simply enjoy the hobby.
On another note I have seen just as many inactive HAMS misuse spectrum as I have inactive CERT teams which are absolutely worthless in real disasters. I'm not knocking either one, but just because you have one or the other doesn't necessarily make you useful or dependable in an emergency.
As far as Amateur Radio in general, yes it does play a huge role in emergency response when your normal everyday communication systems fail or become overloaded. The Redcross uses them at shelters, I've even seen HAM radio guys sitting at firestations to assist in dispatching trucks to emergencies. If its all you have left then you do what you have to do.
So to answer the OP's question. How does a amateur license help you in CERT? It doesn't, unless the team you are joining uses amateur radio to conduct its operations on. Then it only will if you take the time to learn your equipment, get comfortable talking on the radio, and getting to know all the other folks in your area that have amateur licenses.
The solution we have found in my area was asking the local ARES groups to provide qualified folks who are licensed amateur operators, are passionate about HAM radio just for the sake of HAM radio, but who also have been through CERT training, and that are also passionate about emergency preparedness and disaster response.
Remember, the key to being a good CERT member isn't going out and saving injured people, or playing hero on the 5 o'clock news. Its about keeping yourself and your family, and maybe even your neighbors, from becoming victims in the disaster. Take care of your family for at least 96hrs (use to be 72hrs but that isn't always enough time for the FEDS to get on scene) following a disaster without any assistance from anyone. CERT is ultimately about taking care of yourself. Period. Everything else about CERT is less important. You approach CERT with that attitude and you will be satisfied with it. Go into it thinking you will run into burning buildings and do heavy search and rescue and play hero, you are wasting your time.
It obviously isn't a requirement to have a Ham License just to be on a CERT team. Maybe they already have enough comm guys for ham radio equipment and it isn't needed. Perhaps they have a good foothold with the local emergency management agency or local fire dept to fill the comm needs with commercial equipment, either way the answer you need is what is the team currently doing and what is the team planning to do in the future with their communications. Maybe the team doesn't have anything beyond cell phones, maybe they have a cache of public safety radios they can access and a licensed frequency to use them on, maybe they have HAM radio, amateur repeaters, and APRS position tracking, I mean seriously who knows?? There is no standard whatsoever so you have to ask. If you want to do CERT, but your group uses public safety radios/freqs, then it wouldn't make much sense to study for a HAM license anyway unless you just simply enjoy the hobby.
On another note I have seen just as many inactive HAMS misuse spectrum as I have inactive CERT teams which are absolutely worthless in real disasters. I'm not knocking either one, but just because you have one or the other doesn't necessarily make you useful or dependable in an emergency.
As far as Amateur Radio in general, yes it does play a huge role in emergency response when your normal everyday communication systems fail or become overloaded. The Redcross uses them at shelters, I've even seen HAM radio guys sitting at firestations to assist in dispatching trucks to emergencies. If its all you have left then you do what you have to do.
So to answer the OP's question. How does a amateur license help you in CERT? It doesn't, unless the team you are joining uses amateur radio to conduct its operations on. Then it only will if you take the time to learn your equipment, get comfortable talking on the radio, and getting to know all the other folks in your area that have amateur licenses.
The solution we have found in my area was asking the local ARES groups to provide qualified folks who are licensed amateur operators, are passionate about HAM radio just for the sake of HAM radio, but who also have been through CERT training, and that are also passionate about emergency preparedness and disaster response.
Remember, the key to being a good CERT member isn't going out and saving injured people, or playing hero on the 5 o'clock news. Its about keeping yourself and your family, and maybe even your neighbors, from becoming victims in the disaster. Take care of your family for at least 96hrs (use to be 72hrs but that isn't always enough time for the FEDS to get on scene) following a disaster without any assistance from anyone. CERT is ultimately about taking care of yourself. Period. Everything else about CERT is less important. You approach CERT with that attitude and you will be satisfied with it. Go into it thinking you will run into burning buildings and do heavy search and rescue and play hero, you are wasting your time.
RadioDaze
Member
Amen to that!
elk2370bruce
Member
Just having a brandy new technician license does not make you an immediate emergency communictions asset for your CERT Unit. It takes operational experiene, experience in directed net operations, and some additional training before you can hold your own and complete your assigned communications tasks in support of first responders.. Not every CERT member needs to be a ham and not every ham should be involved in CERT. This does not seem to be the match for the interest and experience of the original poster. Simply, from some 30 years as a professional disaster bum, an untrained and inexperienced volunteer isn't worth a damn and can be a real liability to a community experiencing a disaster or emergency event. If the OP has other talents and is willing to spend the time to cultivate those talents with drilling, excercizing, and lots of training then GO FOR IT but stay current in all assigned roles and tasks and know where he/she fits into the larger response organization..
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