Help with simplex DMR programming

[bobruzzo]

I was able to get my codeplug working with 3 repeaters and all their talkgroups. Each repeater is on its own zone. I am trying to do DMR Simplex but having trouble. I programmed the DMR simplex freq of 145.790. I have TYT MD UV380 and using outside antenna. My friend has identical radio with identical codeplug as me. When I transmit on 145.790 DMR he can hear me fine but I cant hear him even though I see a signal coming thru on radio. I set color code to 1 and slot to 1. Not sure what I am doing wrong. Also when programming conventional repeaters and simplex freqs, the software assigns RANDOM TG numbers (????) I am able to use the conventional repeaters with no issues, but the 1 conventional simplex freq (146.520) and the DMR simplex freq (145.790) are not being heard. How do I correctly program these? Are the random TG numbers the problem? I had no issues programming all the other DMR stuff. Everything works great except for this issue. I sure could use a detailed step by step instruction. I searched online but didnt find anything helpful.

 

[jeepsandradios]

You both have your DMR ID set correctly ? You say he has identical codeplug. Each radio must have a different DMR ID to talk.

 

[dcr_inc]

You both have to be on the same talkgroup

 

[hill]

TYT Radios don't care about radio ids. Played around with simplex and both passed audio with the same ids.


Did you set a contact for the channel. Simplex mainly uses talkgroup 99.

Are the transmit and receive frequencies in the software the same, as it's simplex.

Going forward it seams you don't have the frequencies right.

 

[hill]

I see your also have issues conventional simplex.

Do you have a pl or dpl on the analog simplex frequency. If so turn it off to CSQ on receive.

 

[hill]

Derailed instructions would be:

Set channel for digital

Set the receive frequency to 145.790

Set the transmit frequency to 145.790

Set color code to 1

Set slot to 1

Enter a talkgroup in the contact list as a group call with an id 99. For contact name use Simplex.

Set the contact for your simplex channel as the Simplex one.

For analog simplex:

Set channel for analog

Set receive frequency to 146.520

Set transmit frequency to 146.520

Set bandwidth to 25 wide band.

Make sure the pl and dpl are turned off, since no tones are required.

 

[bobruzzo]

OK I did figure it out, thank you....its working fine now....still learning!

 

[hill]

As we are following this tread and posting stuff to assist I kind want to know what it was.


I am guessing you both had different talkgroup contacts.

 

[bobruzzo]

As we are following this tread and posting stuff to assist I kind want to know what it was.


I am guessing you both had different talkgroup contacts.

We tested power output of both radios (TYT MD uv380) and they both only putting out 3.5 watts on high power setting. So its probably the low power and distance. We got together with radios and tested out closer and they work fine. In process of getting higher power mobile rigs. The HT's were a good learning tool but weak output.

 

[tweiss3]

We tested power output of both radios (TYT MD uv380) and they both only putting out 3.5 watts on high power setting. So its probably the low power and distance. We got together with radios and tested out closer and they work fine. In process of getting higher power mobile rigs. The HT's were a good learning tool but weak output.

How did you test that power. Since DMR uses the two slots, timed to alternate, a normal power meter will show power at approximately 1/2 its actual power output, since the signal "pulses" when it alternates between TS1 and TS2 in the RF stream (on for TS1, off for TS2). This also causes issues with many scanners that have the "Close Call" feature, and is not picked up.

 

[hill]

3.5 watts isn't bad, since they are only rated for 4 watts.

Don't check on DMR do the power check on FM. With TDMA won't get the true reading.

 

[ramal121]

How did you test that power. Since DMR uses the two slots, timed to alternate, a normal power meter will show power at approximately 1/2 its actual power output

Don't check on DMR do the power check on FM. With TDMA won't get the true reading.

Not on simplex which the OP had a question on (unless TYT does Dual Capacity Direct Mode which I doubt).

 

[sallen07]

Not on simplex which the OP had a question on (unless TYT does Dual Capacity Direct Mode which I doubt).

Pretty sure DMR radios use TDMA even on simplex. You have to pick a time slot, no?

 

[ramal121]

A repeater is the master cog that synchronizes the radios into their respective time slots. On simplex there is no synchronization so the radios transmit on both time slots (continuously). But yes, you still have to declare a time slot for simplex. On simplex my old Bird 43 does just fine for power measurements.

The latest fad is dual direct simplex where there is two true timeslots but that's a whole 'nother deal.

 

[ramal121]

A repeater is the master cog that synchronizes the radios into their respective time slots. On simplex there is no synchronization so the radios transmit on both time slots (continuously). But yes, you still have to declare a time slot for simplex. On simplex my old Bird 43 does just fine for power measurements.

The latest fad is dual direct simplex where there is two true timeslots but that's a whole 'nother deal.

Correction on last. Some radios do, some don't.

 

[Clats97]

Not on simplex which the OP had a question on (unless TYT does Dual Capacity Direct Mode which I doubt).

TYT does do dual capacity direct mode. It's in the MD750 software as an option when programming a channel.

 

[k6cpo]

Derailed instructions would be:

Set channel for digital

Set the receive frequency to 145.790

Set the transmit frequency to 145.790

Set color code to 1

Set slot to 1

Enter a talkgroup in the contact list as a group call with an id 99. For contact name use Simplex.

Set the contact for your simplex channel as the Simplex one.

For analog simplex:

Set channel for analog

Set receive frequency to 146.520

Set transmit frequency to 146.520

Set bandwidth to 25 wide band.

Make sure the pl and dpl are turned off, since no tones are required.

This is one of the big fallacies about DMR. You should just be able to program a simplex frequency, push the PTT and talk. That's what I like about Yaesu Fusion.® You can talk digitally on any simplex frequency you want without any additional programming.

 

[Skypilot007]

This is one of the big fallacies about DMR. You should just be able to program a simplex frequency, push the PTT and talk. That's what I like about Yaesu Fusion.® You can talk digitally on any simplex frequency you want without any additional programming.

Well, DMR wasn't created for the hammy world, it's intended purpose is for business and industry usage. Hams took it upon ourselves to use it to fit our needs as best as possible. So one must think just a little to setup a simplex DMR channel. Fusion is a hammy thing so it's easy, like the extra class test!

 

[ve3rd]

Just came on this thread and I see a few minor errors. The ETSI spec shows that single frequency and two frequency transmissions are handled differently.

In simplex mode with a single frequency, only one time slot is used. Radio 1 on TS1 will transmit on TS1, with TS2 idle. Radio 2 will listen on both time slots and receive the transmission from Radio 1 on TS1 and open its receiver regardless of which TS is programmed. Radio 2 will answer back on either TS1 or TS2 (whichever is programmed). Radio 1 listening on both time slots will then open its receive accordingly.

Simplex Basics
1) Use the same simplex frequency
2) Use TG99 (assigned for simplex, but not required, but you must have all radios on the same TG)
3) Time slot not important in DMO/Simplex Mode

New modes on the Scene which again are completely different.
DCDM TS Split ie: TX on TS1, RX on TS2
DCDM Double Slot ie: Two independent Time slots similar to two frequency repeater mode)

As for Fusion, you have a radio that comes out of the box, you program in a frequency and you are on the air. Simplicity yes! But then we are Ham Radio Operators, not appliance operators. There is a lot more complexity in DMR, but then there is a lot more functionality , and options available in DMR.
I have a Fusion Radio(hardly on the air anymore), a P25 Radio, (occasionally on) and 4 DMR radios that swap around on 8 hotpots configured for different uses (DMR, P25 etc)

 

[dazey77]

Correction on last. Some radios do, some don't.

This is true, but no radios are meant to transmit on both timeslots if they comply to specs. This is not the same as dual capacity or other schemes. the base way of working is meant to be to transmit on one. Extra bits are needed to sync slots to for example to enable motorola dual capacity, or hytera pseudo trunk (which is why they are proprietry). By default all DMR radios are all meant to transmit on one slot, which is also where the DMR battery save (vs analogue) comes from. Things like the early baofengs are known to be problematic by transmitting on both slots.