New Fairfax Co Public Safety System Coming Online

[freqhopping]

Sysid: 03C9
Site: 0102
WACN: BEE00
NAC: 3C2
Primary control channel: 856.2625
Alternate CCs per Pro96Com: 857.2625 859.2625

Running UniTrunker will show 6 frequencies no longer in use on the existing system. One is currently the CC for this new system. The others now missing are 853.4625; 853.6375; 853.7875; 853.9125; 854.4625

A sample of the packet dump:

BB 00 00 BE E0 03 C9 03 49 70 38 82 04/08 23:21:00 Network Status Broadcast - WACN: BEE00 Control: 0-0841(856.26250) Cap: Data,Voice,Registration
3D 00 13 25 E0 32 09 15 75 62 1B 36 04/08 23:21:00 Identifier Update - ID: 01 Base: 762.00625 Spacing: 0.00625 Bandwidth: 0.00625 TX Offset: 30.00000
0D 90 30 A5 80 64 09 15 75 62 C5 AA 04/08 23:21:01 TDMA (Motorola) Identifier Update - ID: 03 Base: 762.00625 Spacing: 0.01250 Bandwidth: 0.01250 TX Offset: 30.00000 Slots: 2
39 00 01 02 03 E9 04 05 29 04 D0 31 04/08 23:21:01 Alternate Control Broadcast - Channel 1: 0-1001(857.26250) Cap: Backup control channel only Channel 2: 0-1321(859.26250) Cap: Backup control channel only
05 90 00 00 00 01 41 00 00 00 63 BA 04/08 23:21:01 Unknown Op=05 Mfg 90(Motorola)
39 00 01 02 03 E9 04 05 29 04 D0 31 04/08 23:21:01 Alternate Control Broadcast - Channel 1: 0-1001(857.26250) Cap: Backup control channel only Channel 2: 0-1321(859.26250) Cap: Backup control channel only


For comparison the Loudoun packet dump looks like:
3B 00 00 BE E0 03 73 0B 31 70 6D 9D 04/08 23:34:44 Network Status Broadcast - WACN: BEE00 Control: 0-2865(868.91250) Cap: Data,Voice,Registration
05 90 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 D1 C3 04/08 23:34:44 Unknown Op=05 Mfg 90(Motorola)
B0 00 00 00 68 16 89 1C 8C E4 D6 C7 04/08 23:34:44 TDMA Sync Broadcast - 2011/04/09 03:36 (3300l) -8
02 00 0A 61 0A F5 0A 61 0A F5 B5 F0 04/08 23:34:44 Group Voice Grant Update - Group: 2805 Channel: 0-2657(867.61250) Group: 2805 Channel: 0-2657(867.61250)
3A 00 00 13 73 01 01 0B 31 70 C6 07 04/08 23:34:44 RFSS Status Broadcast - SysID: 373 Status: Connected Zone: 1 Site: 1 Control: 0-2865(868.91250) Cap: Data,Voice,Registration
8D 90 30 A5 80 64 09 15 75 62 21 9E 04/08 23:34:44 TDMA (Motorola) Identifier Update - ID: 03 Base: 762.00625 Spacing: 0.01250 Bandwidth: 0.01250 TX Offset: 30.00000 Slots: 2
39 00 01 01 0B 09 04 0B 1B 04 46 0B 04/08 23:34:44 Alternate Control Broadcast - Channel 1: 0-2825(868.66250) Cap: Backup control channel only Channel 2: 0-2843(868.77500) Cap: Backup control channel only
16 00 00 C0 0A 0B FF FF 00 01 90 DF 04/08 23:34:44 Data Channel Update - Status: C0 Channels: RX: 0-2571(867.07500)
89 90 0C 80 00 00 00 00 00 00 68 C7 04/08 23:34:44 Unknown Op=09 Mfg 90(Motorola) Binary Value: 00001100 10000000
3D 00 03 22 D0 32 0A 25 10 A2 63 A0 04/08 23:34:44 Identifier Update - ID: 00 Base: 851.00625 Spacing: 0.00625 Bandwidth: 0.00625 TX Offset: -45.00000


The rest of the funding for it isn't due until FY2012. So it probably won't be operational until next year.

 

[freqhopping]

Logged a little bit of activity today which so far confirms 853.4625, 853.6375 and 853.7875 for voice channels.
Talkgroups: 1281, 1289,1291

 

[mike_s104]

Looks like another TDMA system. I wished Uniden would release something (hardware or firmware) to monitor these fully.

 

[brownlab]

Gee whiz!! If Fairfax goes TDMA then Uniden will have to do something or else they will be driving customers to GRE,

 

[mike_s104]

Gee whiz!! If Fairfax goes TDMA then Uniden will have to do something or else they will be driving customers to GRE,

Both will eventually have something that will fully support TDMA. There's going to be more and more TDMA systems as time goes on. I prefer Uniden over GRE...I think I'll wait. I'd rather spend $500 on a scanner that will fully support TDMA and can handle direct programming.

 

[fireradio]

Don't worry, Fairfax has no plans to implement TDMA anytime soon.

 

[FFEMTCURRENCE]

are they using the newer freqs from the mot 800 system or whole new freqs for the p25 system and if they have all new freqs then why request more frqs for the 800 system earlier this year

 

[freqhopping]

They were doing grid testing today. Also communicating on Coord D1 of the current system.

Sounds like some of what they were doing early on was fixing an issue caused by a lightning strike at the Lorton site.

 

[steve888]

Gee whiz!! If Fairfax goes TDMA then Uniden will have to do something or else they will be driving customers to GRE,

Yep...this is why I'm probably going to buy a PSR-800. I'd really rather go with Uniden but they don't have anything that can receive TDMA broadcasts, so...gotta do what I gotta do I guess.

You are right though. The more systems that go TDMA, the more customers there will be that will go to GRE. Uniden knows that and I'm sure they'll address it.

 

[brownlab]

Yep...this is why I'm probably going to buy a PSR-800. I'd really rather go with Uniden but they don't have anything that can receive TDMA broadcasts, so...gotta do what I gotta do I guess.

You are right though. The more systems that go TDMA, the more customers there will be that will go to GRE. Uniden knows that and I'm sure they'll address it.

I think it is going to be a relatively long time before the finale X2 TDMA Specification are decided on and then I imagine after that, they will have to manufacture the equipment. So if that is true, why would Fairfax go to TDMA if they will have to change out the radios in lets say a year (they have a lot of radios in Fairfax) unless the existing TDMA radios can be easily reprogrammed to the final specs and if that is true, then GRE could probably send down a new firmware for the 800s. Maybe yes, maybe no, we will see. But the thing about the 800 is that you do not have the same amount of control over the programming as you do with the 996XT however I am listening to Loudoun right now which is why I like it. But If you ever want to read about the effect TDMA has on users, go the Maryland Forum and read the "What is going on in PG" thread. I feel bad for those guys.

 

[CqDx]

But the thing about the 800 is that you do not have the same amount of control over the programming as you do with the 996XT

I couldn't agree more!

I have a PSR-800 and uses it regularly to listen to local P25 systems (5 UHF ones in NYC area and Baltimore City when I'm away), it has fantastic performance and great audio. But I still can't find myself a reason to give up my PSR-500, simply because I can have direct tuning and be able to search for control channel with all the information right on the screen. I can also create a trunking system simply by its control channel on the front keypad on the 500, something 800 can't do as of the current firmware.

 

[steve888]

I think it is going to be a relatively long time before the finale X2 TDMA Specification are decided on and then I imagine after that, they will have to manufacture the equipment. So if that is true, why would Fairfax go to TDMA if they will have to change out the radios in lets say a year (they have a lot of radios in Fairfax) unless the existing TDMA radios can be easily reprogrammed to the final specs and if that is true, then GRE could probably send down a new firmware for the 800s. Maybe yes, maybe no, we will see. But the thing about the 800 is that you do not have the same amount of control over the programming as you do with the 996XT however I am listening to Loudoun right now which is why I like it. But If you ever want to read about the effect TDMA has on users, go the Maryland Forum and read the "What is going on in PG" thread. I feel bad for those guys.

You're listening to Loudoun on the PSR-800, right? The 996XT can't pick up Loudoun because they're running on a TDMA system...correct?

Thanks again for helping me learn about all of the different technologies that are out there!

 

[brownlab]

Yes, buy the PRS 800 if you want to hear all of Loudoun all of the time. The 996XT will monitor Loudoun traffic if a FDMA radio "marks up" on the Loudoun TDMA/FDMA system. This happens quite a bit and can give one the impression that the 996XT receives Loudoun but you are not hearing everything (car to car for example for example) and if there is not a FDMA radio using the system, then you will not hear anything. That is the simple explanation.

 

[steve888]

Yes, buy the PRS 800 if you want to hear all of Loudoun all of the time. The 996XT will monitor Loudoun traffic if a FDMA radio "marks up" on the Loudoun TDMA/FDMA system. This happens quite a bit and can give one the impression that the 996XT receives Loudoun but you are not hearing everything (car to car for example for example) and if there is not a FDMA radio using the system, then you will not hear anything. That is the simple explanation.

Thanks a lot for all of your help, I really appreciate it and you've helped me learn a lot about the hobby.

 

[brownlab]

No problem. Send me a PM if you need any help with programing

 

[rnehls]

System On-Line Somewhat

I am monitoring the system and it appears they are at least simulcasting police and school security. The following talkgroups are currently active and is currently P25 phase 1:

1077
1071
1095
1404

 

[brownlab]

I think it is going to be a relatively long time before the finale X2 TDMA Specification are decided on and then I imagine after that, they will have to manufacture the equipment. So if that is true, why would Fairfax go to TDMA if they will have to change out the radios in lets say a year (they have a lot of radios in Fairfax) unless the existing TDMA radios can be easily reprogrammed to the final specs and if that is true, then GRE could probably send down a new firmware for the 800s. Maybe yes, maybe no, we will see. But the thing about the 800 is that you do not have the same amount of control over the programming as you do with the 996XT however I am listening to Loudoun right now which is why I like it. But If you ever want to read about the effect TDMA has on users, go the Maryland Forum and read the "What is going on in PG" thread. I feel bad for those guys.

This was really a dumb post on my part. Talk about something I would like to remove (lol). Anyhow "relatively long time" apparently equals a couple of months. Seems like they are field testing Fairfax "big time" now but does anyone want to venture a guess when the new system will be implemented? And will it be TDMA? I am guessing it will be but I have no information on that.

 

[russ410]

I think that Fairfax switching has to do with the FCC. I think the FCC told all of public safety to switch to P25 systems by a certain date. That is why Arl Co,Alex City and others in the metro area are changing to the P25 FULLY. Can be FMDA or TMDA but P25 all the way.

 

[russ410]

I have NOT heard of Fairfax Co going to TMDA.

 

[radioman2001]

There is no mandate by the FCC or others to switch to digital, whether it be phase I or II.