scanner laws

[sojo96]

i'm leaving for california in 5 days and want to know about scanner laws in california. here in michigan you can have a police scanner as long as you have not had a felony in the past 5 years, or are using it for a crime. is that the law there? i have two newer scanners, and an older one. i want to only take the older scanner. it goes up to 512, which is all i really need. and because it is very old, and not worth much, i would put it in my checked baggage. what is the likelyhood of either it not getting past the checkpoint, or the machines possibly ruining my scanner?

thanks a lot

 

[Mick]

Here's a good thread on your info at the socalscan Yahoo group:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/socalscan/message/55137

Short answer, yes, you can bring your scanners through the checkpoint w/o them getting damaged, onto the plane, and use them all day long as you drive around California.

 

[sojo96]

thanks for the answer. i can't view that forum thing for some reason. just want to make sure you're 100% possitive. because i don't want any trouble at the airport or with my luggage not making it to the destination because they had to hold it. or else me missing my flight or something. where i'm going to be just uses the 154mhz area for PD and FD operations. i'll also be next door to an a county airport a lot of the time. not one that's too busy i dont think but has united airlines operating a few flights per day out of there, and i think one other airline too. operating twin prop planes. so i need to make sure there will be no problem before i will take it. i have a pro-96 but i don't really want to take that expensive one. the one that i do want to take is an old base scanner i got from my father a few years ago. it got me started into scanning. from there it went to the pro-96. i love it. can't say i wouldnt trade it for a uniden so i could recieve the military though. that's the downside to radioshack that i see. thanks

 

[Mick]

I'm 100% positive; I fly often with a warbag full of 6 or 7 scanners and ham radios and GPS units, the works, right to my seat on the place.

Using them in a car on the roadways of California is 100% legal.

thanks for the answer. i can't view that forum thing for some reason. just want to make sure you're 100% possitive. because i don't want any trouble at the airport or with my luggage not making it to the destination because they had to hold it. or else me missing my flight or something. where i'm going to be just uses the 154mhz area for PD and FD operations. i'll also be next door to an a county airport a lot of the time. not one that's too busy i dont think but has united airlines operating a few flights per day out of there, and i think one other airline too. operating twin prop planes. so i need to make sure there will be no problem before i will take it. i have a pro-96 but i don't really want to take that expensive one. the one that i do want to take is an old base scanner i got from my father a few years ago. it got me started into scanning. from there it went to the pro-96. i love it. can't say i wouldnt trade it for a uniden so i could recieve the military though. that's the downside to radioshack that i see. thanks

 

[Radio_Lady]

Mick is 100% correct. You should have no trouble whatsoever with your scanner going through flight check-in. I've flown across the country several times since 9/11, and I always take a scanner with me, and never had a problem. I usually take my Pro-96 and carry it on. One time I was asked by the gate folks to just turn it on for a few seconds, presumably so they'd see that it really was a working radio and not something more sinister.

As far as scanner laws, California is a completely different world from Michigan. As long as you're not out committing crimes, the police here aren't paranoid about scanners like they can be in MI. The only "scanner" laws in California are reasonable and straightforward - you can't use one to help you or someone else commit a crime, or escape arrest. That's about it.

There are a couple 60-year-old local ordinances in L.A City and L.A. County that technically prohibit using a scanner in a car, but they've never been enforced and aren't worth even giving a second thought to. Scanners just aren't a big deal with 99% of the cops in California 99% of the time.

Bring it out here and enjoy it.

 

[sojo96]

sweet. thanks a lot mick, and radio lady. for both of your information. i emailed the head of michigan state police communications and she said that they passed a law last year that states unless you have had a felony within the past 5 years, or are using it to assist in a crime or avoid arrest or trials, you can have one without permission. i carry her email with me just in case the cops do throw a fit about it. they'd have no grounds. and i still have it saved in my inbox. i'm going to give it a bit more thought still. it would be a definite yes except for this reason... i'm going to be out in california with people who aren't interested in hearing things. i think it would be awesome to take my pro-96 with me though and be able to hear the san diego beach patrol and such. i'll give it some thought. i just don't want to put my scanner in danger if i'm not even going to get to use it. because i don't have the money to replace it. thanks a lot again guys.

 

[iepoker]

If the current government hadn't made things so retraded the last 6 years or so he wouldnt even be asking questions like these.

Yes, even in the post-911, non-habeas corpas world you can still bring your scanner with you on trips.

...god I cant wait until *they* are gone!

 

[sojo96]

hey guys. i'm having some trouble in a different thread that i posted. they say i can't use it in the plane at all. what do you think about actually using it on the plane though?

 

[SkipSanders]

You are not permitted (by FAA regulations) to use ANY 'portable electronic device' aboard a commercial aircraft, unless the air carrier (not the pilot), gives permission.

AFAIK, at this time, NO commerical air carrier allows scanners in flight.

No matter how many times you ask the question, demanding an 'accurate' answer because the answer isn't the one you want, that's the accurate answer.

[Code of Federal Regulations]
[Title 14, Volume 2]
[Revised as of January 1, 2007]
From the U.S. Government Printing Office via GPO Access
[CITE: 14CFR91.21]

[Page 508]

TITLE 14--AERONAUTICS AND SPACE

CHAPTER I--FEDERAL AVIATION ADMINISTRATION, DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION
(CONTINUED)

PART 91_GENERAL OPERATING AND FLIGHT RULES--Table of Contents

Subpart A_General

Sec. 91.21 Portable electronic devices.

(a) Except as provided in paragraph (b) of this section, no person
may operate, nor may any operator or pilot in command of an aircraft
allow the operation of, any portable electronic device on any of the
following U.S.-registered civil aircraft:
(1) Aircraft operated by a holder of an air carrier operating
certificate or an operating certificate; or
(2) Any other aircraft while it is operated under IFR.
(b) Paragraph (a) of this section does not apply to--
(1) Portable voice recorders;
(2) Hearing aids;
(3) Heart pacemakers;
(4) Electric shavers; or
(5) Any other portable electronic device that the operator of the
aircraft has determined will not cause interference with the navigation
or communication system of the aircraft on which it is to be used.
(c) In the case of an aircraft operated by a holder of an air
carrier operating certificate or an operating certificate, the
determination required by paragraph (b)(5) of this section shall be made
by that operator of the aircraft on which the particular device is to be
used. In the case of other aircraft, the determination may be made by
the pilot in command or other operator of the aircraft.
------
The pilot would be allowed to give you permission on a commercial aircraft ONLY if the air carrier has specifically delegated that authority to him. The regulation does NOT allow flight crew to authorize exceptions.

Take note that the regulation is not a list of prohibited things, it's a flat statement that ALL items, unless specifically allowed in the regulation, are prohibited. The default permission is 'NO'.

 

[iepoker]

You can "Take" it on the plane... but you need to keep it in your bag and NOT use it.

NO Exceptions.

You will be fine transporting your scanner, but using it on the plane can supposedly cause interference to the planes navigation and radio equipment which is not something you want happening at 35K Ft.

So, to encapsulate:

DO bring your scanner

DO use it while mobil ein a car (if you are capable of handling a car and a scanner)

DO enjoy what So Cal has to offer

DONT use it on the plane.

...this should make things clear, but one can never tell...

 

[SkipSanders]

Just to cover the 'does X airline allow it?', here's a quick gathering of airline rules regarding personal electronic devices, from their current websites. Note that not a single one allows scanners (AM-FM transmitters-receivers) in flight.

American Airlines:

Electronic Equipment/Personal Devices
All portable electronic devices must remain off and properly stowed during taxi, takeoff, approach, and landing
until the plane is at the gate and the seat belt sign is off. Cellphones may be used on certain aircraft after
landing in the U.S., the U.S. Virgin Islands, and Puerto Rico, once authorized by a flight attendant. Your flight
attendant will tell you when you may use approved portable electronic devices in-flight. Devices with transmitting
capabilities may only be used if the transmit capability is turned off and can be verified by a flight attendant
(example: combination cellphone/PDA devices or laptop computers with wireless capabilities). During flight, never
use cellphones (to make or receive calls), two-way pagers, radios, TV sets, remote controls (example: DVD, CD,
game, or toy remote controls), a cordless computer mouse, commercial TV cameras, or Global Positioning Systems.
Radio transmission using personal communications devices (example: walkie-talkies, two-way pagers, or wireless
headphones) is prohibited, as it may interfere with the aircraft's communications and navigation systems.
Devices that could cause damage to equipment or that may diminish the design, function, or capability of the
aircraft are prohibited. You may use audio and video devices only with a headset. Use of still and video cameras,
film or digital, is permitted only for recording personal events. Photography or video recording of airline
personnel, equipment, or procedures is strictly prohibited.*

----------
Continental Airlines:

Electronic DevicesLiability
Continental will not accept liability for computers or computer related equipment when accepted as checked baggage. Small laptop computers may be considered as carry-on baggage.

Personal Electronic Devices
It has been determined that certain electronic devices could cause minor interference with aircraft navigational instruments. Therefore, restrictions on the use of personal electronic devices are necessary.

Passengers may turn on and use cellular phones only when the main cabin door is open. Pagers may be used to receive messages at any time.

Devices that may be used only when announced by the flight attendants and the aircraft is above 10,000 feet in altitude:

electronic games
personal computers
entertainment players
recorders (audio and/or video, such as tape/CD/MiniDisc/MP3 players and camcorders)
calculators
shavers
cameras
aircraft power ports for laptops.
Devices that are not permitted for use at any time:

battery operated personal air-purifying device
TVs
radio receivers and/or transmitters (including AM/FM/SW, CB and scanners)
remote-control toys.
Passengers must not wear Continental-provided headsets and should not wear personal headsets during taxi, takeoff and landing.

Passengers may always use any medically prescribed, physiological instrument, such as a hearing aid or a pacemaker.
----------

Delta Airlines:

Portable Electronic Devices
It's never been so cool to be a geek but there's a few things you'll need to know about operating your gadgets
on board our planes. Your flight crew will remind you again, but it's always good to know ahead of time.

While these are good general guidelines, remember that the flight crew may, at any time, ask you to turn off
a portable electronic device for safety reasons.

Devices You Can't Use
For safety reasons, you may not operate the following devices onboard:

Two-way transmitters such as walkie-talkies, amateur radios, citizen band (CB) radios, 49 MHz transmitters
Devices designed to radiate radio frequency energy on specific frequencies
Peripheral devices for computers or games connected by cable
AM/FM radios
Portable television sets
Remote control toys


Devices You Can Sometimes Use
You can only use these devices while the plane is at the gate with the doors open or after the plane has landed
and is taxiing to the gate.

cellular phones
one and two-way pagers

You can use the following devices while the plane is at the gate with the doors open, after the plane has taken
off and reached its cruising altitude and before it begins to descend for landing.

Personal computers
Personal computer peripheral devices
Compact disc players
Digital cassette tape player/recorders
Video recorder/playback systems
Calculators

You can use these while the plane is at the gate with the doors open, after the plane has taken off and reached
its cruising altitude and before it begins to descend for landing, and after the plane has landed and is taxiing
to the gate.

Personal digital assistants
Personal computer games
GPS (global positioning satellite) systems
Your flight attendant will announce when it is safe to use these devices.

Devices You Can Always Use
You may use the following devices at any time:

Hearing aids
Heart pacemakers and other implanted medical devices
Electronic watches
Electronic nerve stimulators
Electric shavers
Delta's installed equipment
Acceptable personal life support systems and accompanying pagers
--------

United Airlines:

Electronic devices
Certain electronic devices may not be used on our planes for safety reasons. Such devices may cause electromagnetic
interference with cockpit navigation or communications systems during ground operations and while the aircraft is
flying below 10,000 feet. However, when an aircraft is traveling above 10,000 feet (normally about ten minutes
after takeoff), passengers can use many of the devices listed.

Hearing aids, heart pacemakers, and watches are acceptable at all times.

These electronic devices can be used in the cabin, but may not be used during takeoff and landing:
Calculators
Handheld computer games
Shavers
Portable CD and tape players
Laptop computers/accessory printers/tape drives
Portable VCRs/video players

These electronic devices cannot be used on the airplane at any time:
Cellular phones (cellular phones maybe used on the plane at the gate before the aircraft door is closed or at
captain's discretion when the plane is away from the gate and on the ground)
Televisions
AM/FM transmitters-receivers
Remote-controlled toys
----------

Northwest Airlines:

Electronic Devices

On board the Aircraft: Certain electronic devices may not be used on Northwest aircraft for safety reasons.
Such devices may cause electromagnetic interference with cockpit navigation or communications systems during
ground operations and while the aircraft is flying below 10,000 feet. However, when an aircraft is traveling
above 10,000 feet (normally about ten minutes after takeoff), passengers can use many electronic devices.

Electronic devices that can be used at all times

Hearing aids
Heart pacemakers
Watches

Electronic devices that can be used on board the aircraft, but may not be used during takeoff and landing:

Laptop computers
Portable CD and tape players
Calculators
Portable DVD players
Handheld computer games

Electronic devices that cannot be used on the airplane at any time:

Cellular phones
AM/FM transmitters-receivers
Televisions
Remote-controlled toys
Personal Air Purifier

Personal Camera Equipment: Northwest allows passengers to carry on cameras in addition to the normal carry-on
luggage allowance.

 

[sojo96]

Just to cover the 'does X airline allow it?', here's a quick gathering of airline rules regarding personal electronic devices, from their current websites. Note that not a single one allows scanners (AM-FM transmitters-receivers) in flight.

American Airlines:

Electronic Equipment/Personal Devices
All portable electronic devices must remain off and properly stowed during taxi, takeoff, approach, and landing
until the plane is at the gate and the seat belt sign is off. Cellphones may be used on certain aircraft after
landing in the U.S., the U.S. Virgin Islands, and Puerto Rico, once authorized by a flight attendant. Your flight
attendant will tell you when you may use approved portable electronic devices in-flight. Devices with transmitting
capabilities may only be used if the transmit capability is turned off and can be verified by a flight attendant
(example: combination cellphone/PDA devices or laptop computers with wireless capabilities). During flight, never
use cellphones (to make or receive calls), two-way pagers, radios, TV sets, remote controls (example: DVD, CD,
game, or toy remote controls), a cordless computer mouse, commercial TV cameras, or Global Positioning Systems.
Radio transmission using personal communications devices (example: walkie-talkies, two-way pagers, or wireless
headphones) is prohibited, as it may interfere with the aircraft's communications and navigation systems.
Devices that could cause damage to equipment or that may diminish the design, function, or capability of the
aircraft are prohibited. You may use audio and video devices only with a headset. Use of still and video cameras,
film or digital, is permitted only for recording personal events. Photography or video recording of airline
personnel, equipment, or procedures is strictly prohibited.*

----------
Continental Airlines:

Electronic DevicesLiability
Continental will not accept liability for computers or computer related equipment when accepted as checked baggage. Small laptop computers may be considered as carry-on baggage.

Personal Electronic Devices
It has been determined that certain electronic devices could cause minor interference with aircraft navigational instruments. Therefore, restrictions on the use of personal electronic devices are necessary.

Passengers may turn on and use cellular phones only when the main cabin door is open. Pagers may be used to receive messages at any time.

Devices that may be used only when announced by the flight attendants and the aircraft is above 10,000 feet in altitude:

electronic games
personal computers
entertainment players
recorders (audio and/or video, such as tape/CD/MiniDisc/MP3 players and camcorders)
calculators
shavers
cameras
aircraft power ports for laptops.
Devices that are not permitted for use at any time:

battery operated personal air-purifying device
TVs
radio receivers and/or transmitters (including AM/FM/SW, CB and scanners)
remote-control toys.
Passengers must not wear Continental-provided headsets and should not wear personal headsets during taxi, takeoff and landing.

Passengers may always use any medically prescribed, physiological instrument, such as a hearing aid or a pacemaker.
----------

Delta Airlines:

Portable Electronic Devices
It's never been so cool to be a geek but there's a few things you'll need to know about operating your gadgets
on board our planes. Your flight crew will remind you again, but it's always good to know ahead of time.

While these are good general guidelines, remember that the flight crew may, at any time, ask you to turn off
a portable electronic device for safety reasons.

Devices You Can't Use
For safety reasons, you may not operate the following devices onboard:

Two-way transmitters such as walkie-talkies, amateur radios, citizen band (CB) radios, 49 MHz transmitters
Devices designed to radiate radio frequency energy on specific frequencies
Peripheral devices for computers or games connected by cable
AM/FM radios
Portable television sets
Remote control toys


Devices You Can Sometimes Use
You can only use these devices while the plane is at the gate with the doors open or after the plane has landed
and is taxiing to the gate.

cellular phones
one and two-way pagers

You can use the following devices while the plane is at the gate with the doors open, after the plane has taken
off and reached its cruising altitude and before it begins to descend for landing.

Personal computers
Personal computer peripheral devices
Compact disc players
Digital cassette tape player/recorders
Video recorder/playback systems
Calculators

You can use these while the plane is at the gate with the doors open, after the plane has taken off and reached
its cruising altitude and before it begins to descend for landing, and after the plane has landed and is taxiing
to the gate.

Personal digital assistants
Personal computer games
GPS (global positioning satellite) systems
Your flight attendant will announce when it is safe to use these devices.

Devices You Can Always Use
You may use the following devices at any time:

Hearing aids
Heart pacemakers and other implanted medical devices
Electronic watches
Electronic nerve stimulators
Electric shavers
Delta's installed equipment
Acceptable personal life support systems and accompanying pagers
--------

United Airlines:

Electronic devices
Certain electronic devices may not be used on our planes for safety reasons. Such devices may cause electromagnetic
interference with cockpit navigation or communications systems during ground operations and while the aircraft is
flying below 10,000 feet. However, when an aircraft is traveling above 10,000 feet (normally about ten minutes
after takeoff), passengers can use many of the devices listed.

Hearing aids, heart pacemakers, and watches are acceptable at all times.

These electronic devices can be used in the cabin, but may not be used during takeoff and landing:
Calculators
Handheld computer games
Shavers
Portable CD and tape players
Laptop computers/accessory printers/tape drives
Portable VCRs/video players

These electronic devices cannot be used on the airplane at any time:
Cellular phones (cellular phones maybe used on the plane at the gate before the aircraft door is closed or at
captain's discretion when the plane is away from the gate and on the ground)
Televisions
AM/FM transmitters-receivers
Remote-controlled toys
----------

Northwest Airlines:

Electronic Devices

On board the Aircraft: Certain electronic devices may not be used on Northwest aircraft for safety reasons.
Such devices may cause electromagnetic interference with cockpit navigation or communications systems during
ground operations and while the aircraft is flying below 10,000 feet. However, when an aircraft is traveling
above 10,000 feet (normally about ten minutes after takeoff), passengers can use many electronic devices.

Electronic devices that can be used at all times

Hearing aids
Heart pacemakers
Watches

Electronic devices that can be used on board the aircraft, but may not be used during takeoff and landing:

Laptop computers
Portable CD and tape players
Calculators
Portable DVD players
Handheld computer games

Electronic devices that cannot be used on the airplane at any time:

Cellular phones
AM/FM transmitters-receivers
Televisions
Remote-controlled toys
Personal Air Purifier

Personal Camera Equipment: Northwest allows passengers to carry on cameras in addition to the normal carry-on
luggage allowance.

well that's great but the airline i'm flying isn't on this list. i'm going to call them. i'll let everyone know what they have to say. ok?

 

[iepoker]

Hello... Mc Fly...

<knock> <knock> <knock>

...anyone in there? Hello, McFly???

Damn...

 

[Radio_Lady]

well that's great but the airline i'm flying isn't on this list. i'm going to call them. i'll let everyone know what they have to say. ok?

No matter who you talk to on the telephone, or what they tell you, keep in mind that it's not worth the paper it's printed on. If you tell the flight crew "I called your company and so-and-so told me..." it will be the same as if a police officer stops you and you tell him/her "A policeman friend of mine told me it's OK to do 10 over the speed limit along here." It will get you precisely nowhere. They are most certainly not bound by what you tell them "somebody" told you on the phone, or even by some printed piece of paper you might whip out to show them "the law" or "THEIR company's rules."

Whether your airline is on that list or not, the final decision once you're aboard will be your specific aircraft's pilot. In my experience, they will almost always follow their company's rules.

By the way, I haven't heard mention of what it is that you plan to hear once you're up there? At 35,000 feet the best I've ever done is to pick up an occasional strong transmitter for maybe two or three minutes, otherwise it's either a jumble of overlapping signals from miles and miles out, or else a brief couple seconds of "something" from "somewhere" that's totally meaningless. As a result, I almost never even take my scanner out of my bag anymore, although I sometimes do ask the attendant before take-off if it will be OK. If it's "no" they'll usually tell me immediately, but before telling me "yes" they have always told me "Let me check with the captain."

If I want to hear radios, I'll use their headphones, and if it's not on there (and it's a long enough flight to make it worthwhile), I sometimes ask if they could pipe the aircraft frequencies to one of the channels. Sometimes they will, sometimes they won't.

Enjoy your flight. If scanning while enroute is a huge, gigantic priority for me, I either drive or take the train.

 

[sojo96]

well according to someone in the other post that the captain has absolutly no say over it. i told him he's wrong but he says no only the airline has the authority to tell you. none of the flight crew does. and what i plan on listening to is my airplane talking to atc. i didnt plan on much. and i didnt plan on all the time. i planned on taking it out for like 5 minutes each othe hours. flipping it on, seeing if i could hear anything, and flipping it off. i wouldnt want to waste the batteries anyways. especially bc i definitly would use it at the gates while waiting for my connecting flight. and i would like to take the train but it costs a heck of a lot more for me. and driving. well i dont have a car and it's like 2500 miles that i'd have to drive. that would take me forever. i dont have that kind ot time. plus then you knw i'd want to listen to everything along the way and i'd have to reprogram it like every state and plus i'd have to do the looking up. there'd be no point. i wasnt planning on like listening to a FD being dispatched or something. i just wanted to listen to my flight number being told to decend for landing or something. the tsa says the faa says it doesnt harm anything, and i checked with the faa directly and they say it wont harm anything. yet it's up to the airline still. then the ppl are telling me that if one airline was to say no you cant use it, then all of the sudden it becomes a federal law. although if i had been told by the faa and everyone else TOO that it causes interference. that there's a good chance of it. and i did it anyways, then i could see definitly it being a federal law. and i would get charged with like malicious conduct or whatever it is. i didnt mean to make this a huge deal but ppl started fighting in my thread and then i got into it a little bit bc of what i was reading and what ppl were saying. then i got critized for being a child and acting like one and not being able to use correct punctuation and crap. i'm not entering things that bad and i'm really not missing that much. and what i do miss is intentional. the guy n jay was very rude to me and i didnt feel that i deserved it. just because i may be a little stupid and have no experience with this doesn't mean i have to be picked on.

 

[loumaag]

Well sojo96, you are a persistent person aren't you?

I am closing this thread also.

Go read the Wiki as instructed in the other closed topic. I will tell you that the captain of a commercial aircraft does not have authority to tell you you can use a scanner on board. There is a list of "accepted personal electronic devices" that every airline has and, that list is made up of tested types of devices, and no one has shown me one yet that says a scanner is on it.

You have the answers you need in regard to what you originally asked in this topic.
Even the original poster doesn't have the right to steer a topic into an off-topic area, especially when the answer has already been provided in another topic.
Don't keep up this nonsense.