TriSquare TSX300

[brandon]

I didn't record it, but the file description says

"This is an audio sample of a near field surveillance receiver being able to lock onto the FHSS signal of a Trisquare eXRS 900MHz FHSS radio and demodulate the audio. Trisquare markets these radios as "providing completely secure conversation". The intercepted voice is completely intelligible.Trisquare eXRS radios change frequencies 2.5 times per second (400mS)."

 

[prcguy]

I believe the audio sample is from an Optoelectronics Explorer. I can also see the spectrum from my Trisquare radios on a spectrum analyzer, its just spread out over part of the 902-928MHz band.
prcguy

What receiver were you using for the audio sample?

 

[Squad10]

Using the OEM headset cable or getting inside the unit, anybody attempt to encoded/decode DTMF or 1200baud AFSK between a couple of Trisquare radios?

 

[Chris-KH2PM]

Using the OEM headset cable or getting inside the unit, anybody attempt to encoded/decode DTMF or 1200baud AFSK between a couple of Trisquare radios?

Haven't tried that yet, but if you retransmit DES-OFB encrypted audio from one TriSquare radio to another one, it comes out un-encripted (SIC) on the other radio. Kewlness.




















---------------------...........just joking! HAHAHAHAHAH

 

[W9NES]

per the Trisquare web site for the TSX-300. Look at these points 1. 10 Billion Channels 2.* Priviate and Secure Communications* 3.* No unathorized Listening* 4. Digital Radio System 5. 900Mhz transmit channels.I call to your attetion all of the points 1 thru 5. The company stands by these points and data has been done by beta testing and testing of the units in the field.

 

[prcguy]

And my testing in the field with my Trisquare radios shows they are narrow band FM modulated frequency hopping radios that are easily listened to using a fairly common Optoelectronics receiver that used to be sold at most major scanner and amateur radio stores.

They are nice radios for the price and reasonably secure from eavesdropping by your average neighbor kid but they are not secure from your slightly above average scanner enthusiast.

The points you state are advertising, take it for what it is and don't discuss anything over your Trisquare radios that you would not want posted on the internet.
prcguy

per the Trisquare web site for the TSX-300. Look at these points 1. 10 Billion Channels 2.* Priviate and Secure Communications* 3.* No unathorized Listening* 4. Digital Radio System 5. 900Mhz transmit channels.I call to your attetion all of the points 1 thru 5. The company stands by these points and data has been done by beta testing and testing of the units in the field.

 

[Utah_Viper]

I was also a beta tester for TriSquare. These are NOT Encrypted. Thedo use FHSS and are more secure, and not easily monitored buy any standard scanners. The radios though do function great and I would recommend them over a FRS

 

[W9NES]

Thank You Utah Viper. That is my point.They are secure and they are Digital.

 

[SkipSanders]

Thank You Utah Viper. That is my point.They are secure and they are Digital.

You just don't want to admit you fell for false advertising, do you?

No, they are not digital. Frequency Hopping is not 'digital'. The transmissions from these radios are pure, ordinary, narrow band FM Analog.

No, they are not 'secure' in that yes, they can be monitored if someone wants to take the expense and trouble, or is close by.

They are 'more secure' than GMRS radios, yes.

 

[prcguy]

I feel a little insulted after I tell someone I personally tested something and its narrow band FM frequency hopping and they still say its digital like I don't know WTF I'm talking about.

Ok, there whatever you want them to be.
prcguy

 

[prcguy]

Aah, just found this in the Trisquare web site advertisement: "This FHSS system combines the power of digital technology with narrow band FM modulation technique."

TriSquare eXRS Technology for 2 way Radio Communication

There, the Trisquare ad says it so its gotta be true.

A friend of mine has a new fancy toilet with heaters and a lid that closes by itself that uses digital technology. That doesn't mean its encrypted and you can't hear it flush.
prcguy

 

[K8TEK]

Thank You Utah Viper. That is my point.They are secure and they are Digital.

I would have expected a more intelligent argument from a ham radio operator. They are neither digital nor "encripted"

 

[kayn1n32008]

i have been trying to tell him for a few days now that those radios are not encrYpted nor secure.

right on trisquares web site they outrightly tell you that they are not encrYpted, that they use plain old NFM.

the reason that these radios donot show up on a frequency counter or service monitor is due to the frequency hopping, the frequency counter cannot react fast enough to the very rapid changes in frequency.

i guess ifhe wants to believe that they are encrYpted and secure he can but the rest of us know different, as HAS BEEN PROVED by memebers on the forum and other places as well.

 

[RayAir]

Simply put, the eXRS radio uses slow frequency hopping at a rate of 400mS and utilizes analog NFM. That's why the voice sounded a little off in that recording.

The Opto Interceptor is a neat little gadget that was sold as a piece of test equipment at one time. It is able to lock onto many FHSS signals. Transcrypt used to make frequency hopping radios for the feds back in the early 90's and testing with the Interceptor proved the audio could be intercepted from these FH radios albeit the audio sounded "clipped" (but intelligible). I used to have some literature on those old Transcrypt FH radios and I believe they hopped at 50 channels per second.

True, the eXRS radio by TriSquare will provide greater privacy than voice inversion, but calling them "completely secure" is ridiculous. Any near field receiver that sweeps 900MHz will decode them and I am sure if one wanted they could buy a few fast scanning scanners and divide up the frequencies used by the eXRS radio among the scanners for better results.

There is another radio that uses 900MHz FHSS that is much more secure if that is what you're looking for. They also cost more, but I also think they are built much better. It's the Motorola DTR. Or come to think of it, just buy some used Nextel i355's on Ebay, they run about $20 a pop. Most likely you'll need a sim card since most people remove them before selling. Put the i355 into Direct Talk mode (off-network, no service plan required) and you have 10 digital FHSS channels to choose from. You can also set up private calls between the Nextel radios. That means even if someone has another i355 on the same Direct Talk channel as you they still won't be able to hear you. Motorola DTR's can also be programmed to do private calls by programming in your own unique 11-digit code which sets the hop sequence. On a Nextel Direct Talk private call you use the other persons phone number that you're calling. That sets the unique hop sequence. Or you can just go to contacts and select the person you want to call instead of typing in the whole phone number.

Both the Motorola DTR and Nextel Direct Talk use the same technology, but they are not compatible.

Motorola DTR/ Nextel Direct Talk:

1W 900MHz FHSS, 90mS hop rate. Yes, a near field receiver (including mine) can lock onto this signal, but what does it hear? Initial data and then popping! The DTR and Direct Talk both use VSELP digital audio. So even though the signal can be tracked by some fancy radio gear they cannot decode the digital audio. You would need a way to decode VSELP if you wanted to hear anything.

I hope this clears some misconceptions up. Feel free to message me or reply if you have any questions.

 

[dipschitz]

TriSquare

Not a GMRS radio but I was wondering whether anyone had any experience with this type of radio and what you thought of it comapred to an FRS/GMRS radio.

I have a pair of Midland FRS and a pair of TriSquare. I like the TriSquare because I don't have to worry about someone else getting on the same channel. As far as the range? I haven't done a side by side comparison but they seem to work fine for normal shopping, driving down the highway, etc. Have been on a cruise and used each pair and could not tell the difference in range. The TriSquare are a smaller and lighter and maybe a little better in the audio claritiy. The battery lasts longer. The only thing I don't like are the belt clips, they are practically useless, so try and find some holsters for them (but be careful, some holsters block the speaker so you could lose audio). Overall I recommend them, especially for the price.

 

[SCPD]

I have 4 of the tri-square 300's, and i like them. except for the belt clips, and lousy ear-mikes. I would like them better if the came with sma connectors to allow a better antenna.
And wouldnt it be great if they offered a base station?

 

[W9NES]

Thank You for the kind words.I like mine and have no problems with them and I use them on major events where I am assigned a detail.When they make a base station I will buy one.

 

[RayAir]

I talked to someone at TriSquare back in late 2008 and they said they were coming out with a mobile eXRS radio (probably could be used as a base too). The gentleman told me it would be out in 2009, but it obviously never went into production.

I heard somewhere that TriSquare's sales weren't that good and then figure the dead economy into the mix and who knows when and/or if a mobile/base version will come out.

 

[iMONITOR]

Would the FCC approve them if they were encrypted? I thought it was illegal for civilians to use encrypted communications.

 

[W9NES]

These are type fcc accepted for secure communications.