WORLD WAR 2: Walkie Talkie questions

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Archie

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After seeing early generation Motorola walkie talkies in repeats of Combat and other WWII media, was wondering what range did they have without repeaters? Were they VHF or UHF? Lastly, why didn't police and fire not get them until the late 1960's ? Or were they still not perfected enough for Public Safety users ? Yes I held a heavy HT200 and know why they called it a brick. LOL
 

chrismol1

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Some police dept did have them war surplus for specialty uses, and some lunchbox sized types with a shoulder strap, but it wasn't until transistors, once those became possible in the mid 50's everything became possible. The HT200 and more like post HT220, the standard HT size, did every cop start getting a radio on their belt. I have some mid 1950's HTs before the HT200 that Motorola were marketing as handhelds that are smallish and uses mini vacuum tubes, metal cases and were around the size of HT200, not the lunchbox types but actual HT size in a belt holster. They operated the same as the WW2 HT where pulling up the antenna turns it on and used internal batteries instead of drop in charger of the HT200 series
 
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ofd8001

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I'm sure the biggest reason was cost. When I first got into public safety in the early 70's, the cops would have speakers under the hood for their mobile radios. A flip of a switch and they could at least listen.

Mid 70's saw some "civil unrest" and the cops started getting portables for their officers.

For us fire guys, chief officers would have one portable. Then we started to see one portable for each fire apparatus. It was only about 10-12 years ago when there was a push for each person on an emergency scene to have his/her own radio.

See: SCR-536 - Wikipedia
 

prcguy

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The SCR-536 is also known as the BC-611. It runs about .025 watt output power, AM mode over about 3.5 to 6MHz and they commonly come with a crystal for 3.85MHz. Advertised range of the BC-611 was about 1 mile over land and 3 miles over water, but I don't know if that was between two BC-611s or a 611 and a larger radio/antenna. I have one and have personally done about 25mi over water to a ship based radio.
 

RFI-EMI-GUY

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Some police dept did have them war surplus for specialty uses, and some lunchbox sized types with a shoulder strap, but it wasn't until transistors, once those became possible in the mid 50's everything became possible. The HT200 and more like post HT220, the standard HT size, did every cop start getting a radio on their belt. I have some mid 1950's HTs before the HT200 that Motorola were marketing as handhelds that are smallish and uses mini vacuum tubes, metal cases and were around the size of HT200, not the lunchbox types but actual HT size in a belt holster. They operated the same as the WW2 HT where pulling up the antenna turns it on and used internal batteries instead of drop in charger of the HT200 series
Would love to see pictures of those!
 

es93546

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After seeing early generation Motorola walkie talkies in repeats of Combat and other WWII media, was wondering what range did they have without repeaters? Were they VHF or UHF? Lastly, why didn't police and fire not get them until the late 1960's ? Or were they still not perfected enough for Public Safety users ? Yes I held a heavy HT200 and know why they called it a brick. LOL

I've been around some military personnel (USMC) in the field at the Mountain Warfare Training Center in the Sierra Nevada. They had a packset on low band VHF with AM transmissions. The radio had no squelch so they had to listen to a lot of noise for the entire time the radio was on. It is my impression and I could be wrong that the portables used in WWII didn't have squelch either. So if you read the information rk911 provided the link to you see that they were not on VHF and UHF was way outside anything even dreamed about at the time. They were on a lower portion of HF, or just "High Frequency" not all that much higher than the broadcast radio spectrum.

The dawn of police radio found just receivers in cars. So dispatch just transmitted "in the blind" not knowing if a car heard there transmissions. If possible the officers would stop by at special phones locked up in "Gamewell" boxes located every block or two or three. As for handhelds until the mid 60's portable radios were fairly big, the battery alone being 12-16" long, 6-8" wide and 8-10" high. It wasn't a brick, it was a small suitcase and heavy. Mobiles still had tubes and were in a big box behind the seat of pickups, in trunks of cars and took a lot of power to run. Solid state, crystal tuned handhelds started to be more available in the very late 60's and early 70's. They weren't very cheap either. Repeaters were uncommon. A dispatch center might have a few remote bases linked by telephone lines. I started with the U.S. Forest Service in the early 70's and if we were in a location the remote base on a National Forest could not pick you up on, you had to call a lookout and have them pass along the radio traffic you had by voice repeating what you said. Of course, later repeaters were placed in those lookouts and remote bases were linked by UHF radios. At first there might be multiple repeaters and no way to select only one, so two or more repeaters might transmit your signal. Two signals on FM transmitting at the same time was hard on the ears.

It was the mid to late 70's before handhelds started to be common. Sometimes the number and type of handhelds was a function of what police departments could afford.

I could provide additional observations and the history of radio on wildland fires, but this message is already long enough.
 

es93546

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One point I didn't make well is that you just don't add handhelds, you have to build up the infrastructure of receivers and transmitters capable of allowing communications with the lower powered radios. These smaller radios put out 5 watts max and the existing infrastructure was built for at least 25 watt mobiles, sometimes even more. It wasn't a situation where one day an agency would issue a bunch of new handhelds, do nothing else and tell everyone to go forth and do good.
 

merlin

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BC-611-d no doubt. Low end of HF band, with fresh batteries could do nearly 1/4 watt. Maybe a few miles Irregardless terrain and vegetation.
Motorola coined these post WWI, had A battery and B battery for 'pencil tubes. Lots were made in France.
Mid WWII these morphed into BC-721, a 35-40 Mhz version. A little more power and better range.
They went through Korean war and then the man-pack.
Enter Vietnam and the PRC-10. Still low band VHF but transistorized. Confirmed QSOs with US from Vietnam. Very ruged and would stop a bullet.
If you have the $$, these can still be had. Last I saw was BC-721 on ebay for $450, in excellent vintage shape.
Cheers
 

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David628

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BC-611-d no doubt. Low end of HF band, with fresh batteries could do nearly 1/4 watt. Maybe a few miles Irregardless terrain and vegetation.
Motorola coined these post WWI, had A battery and B battery for 'pencil tubes. Lots were made in France.
Mid WWII these morphed into BC-721, a 35-40 Mhz version. A little more power and better range.
They went through Korean war and then the man-pack.
Enter Vietnam and the PRC-10. Still low band VHF but transistorized. Confirmed QSOs with US from Vietnam. Very ruged and would stop a bullet.
If you have the $$, these can still be had. Last I saw was BC-721 on ebay for $450, in excellent vintage shape.
Cheers
This above!!!!!
 
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