Yaesu going to a LMR/Mototrbo type radio
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Apparently, Yaesu-Vertex no longer exists (oh, one of my pet peeves is seeing Yaesu misspelled).
Yaesu’s Amateur Radio Division Breaks with Motorola, Changes Name to Yaesu Musen
The amateur radio, marine, and air band radio divisions will split from Vertex Standard and will be known as Yaesu Musen. The land mobile products remain Vertex Standard and remain part of Motorola.
VK5ZEA
Member
...and now I am getting confused.
http://bit.ly/rR2Qmt
Does this mean the upcoming Yaesu DMR radio/s won't have Motorola influences? Vertex Standard LMR business radio is being transferred to Motorola. Yaesu will be the ham radios and Standard Horizon marine and air band.
http://bit.ly/rR2Qmt
Does this mean the upcoming Yaesu DMR radio/s won't have Motorola influences? Vertex Standard LMR business radio is being transferred to Motorola. Yaesu will be the ham radios and Standard Horizon marine and air band.
VK5ZEA
Member
N8IAA
Member
I have long loathed ham gear for its total lack of quality. If they churn something out like the VXD-720 that looks even similar and does V & U with a TRBO compatible voice mode? I'll buy two, the day they come out. It's about time we had DECENT equipment. P25 is VERY alive and well up here on ham, no idea about down in the USA however.
Maybe (doubtfully) this will be the begining of the end for D-STAR. It is a horrible technology that should never have been introduced in the first place. IMHO, of course.
In some areas of the US it outnumbers D*. The hamfests are also crawling with folks who utilize XTS and APX series radios.
If this forum had been around fifty years ago, I wonder if the same fervor would have been applied to the argument between AM and FM emissions?
The more proprietary a system is, the more profits it generates for the manufacturer. It’s VHS vs. Beta all over again. How many billions did we spend before we trashed both and bought DVD’s? For the amateur or hobby listener, keeping up with the increasing number of proprietary technologies is an inconvenience. For the emergency responder directing traffic at an accident, it’s a dangerous very real nightmare.
Quoting the "About" page from the NXDN-Forum:
Quote "Kenwood Corporation and Icom Incorporated developed NXDN™ in a collaborative effort, and now the basic outline of the NXDN™ specification is completed. Both companies have released initial products based on this spectrum efficient protocol, and the next stage is to standardize the specification and also allow other vendors to provide NXDN™ compliant products to the market to make this a true multi-vendor standard technology." End quote, my emphasis added.
Question: Is there any sort of statement similar to the emphasized part of the above from the Yeasu organization?
The more proprietary a system is, the more profits it generates for the manufacturer. It’s VHS vs. Beta all over again. How many billions did we spend before we trashed both and bought DVD’s? For the amateur or hobby listener, keeping up with the increasing number of proprietary technologies is an inconvenience. For the emergency responder directing traffic at an accident, it’s a dangerous very real nightmare.
Quoting the "About" page from the NXDN-Forum:
Quote "Kenwood Corporation and Icom Incorporated developed NXDN™ in a collaborative effort, and now the basic outline of the NXDN™ specification is completed. Both companies have released initial products based on this spectrum efficient protocol, and the next stage is to standardize the specification and also allow other vendors to provide NXDN™ compliant products to the market to make this a true multi-vendor standard technology." End quote, my emphasis added.
Question: Is there any sort of statement similar to the emphasized part of the above from the Yeasu organization?
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I agree. The way these companies are implementing it, we're gonna end up with D* only repeaters and radios, along with Yaesu only repeaters and radios. Hams aren't going to support that type of set up, especially in smaller areas where there aren't very many repeaters to begin with.
W2NJS
Member
JayEmbee wrote:
"Expected Q1/Early Q2 2011."
You meant to write "2012," right?
"Expected Q1/Early Q2 2011."
You meant to write "2012," right?
D
DaveNF2G
Guest
Death by a thousand cuts. There are hams who will buy just enough so they can talk with their elite inner circles. Standardization won't happen in the amateur service unless it is imposed from outside (such as by regulatory bodies).
but... did HF rigs include multiple bands, AM, SSB, FM and even digital modes capability back in the day? No, but in time technology caught up and things were integrated. I see no reason multiple protocols can't and won't be included as things start to stabilize over time.
fineshot1
Member
x2 - thank you -well said. too much negativity around these days. some of you folks need to
lighten up. it will all work itself out over time as mancow has posted.
oh and while we are at it i need a subspace radio protocol so i can talk to my buds in space.
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The Dawn Of Digital Communications In The Amateur Radio World
So, if I understand this correctly, these will be capable of P25. If they also tune out of band, then this will allow people to use amateur radios to listen to P25 public safety. Not much help for trunked systems, but for conventional, this will once again be handy. For example, my local digital, trunked 800 system would be a scanner or other equipment to monitor it properly. However, there are also a number of off-network simplex 800 mHz frequencies that can be used for on scene. I would certainly consider adding those to the scan list of an amateur radio rather than having the scanner switch off the trunked system. Also, since many federal users are conventional P25, this would be handy for scanning them, as well.
So, if I understand this correctly, these will be capable of P25. If they also tune out of band, then this will allow people to use amateur radios to listen to P25 public safety. Not much help for trunked systems, but for conventional, this will once again be handy. For example, my local digital, trunked 800 system would be a scanner or other equipment to monitor it properly. However, there are also a number of off-network simplex 800 mHz frequencies that can be used for on scene. I would certainly consider adding those to the scan list of an amateur radio rather than having the scanner switch off the trunked system. Also, since many federal users are conventional P25, this would be handy for scanning them, as well.
VK5ZEA
Member
Even now there are multiple non-compatible internet linking systems for FM repeaters/nodes.
IRLP
Echolink
AllStarLink
Wires
Wires II
CQiNet
eQSO
FRN (Free Radio Network)
The same thing will happen with digital radio too. The DMR-MARC group is busy getting things happening and they seem to be endorsed by the Yaesu "glossy" brochure.
I'm sure there will be people out there who get hold of the yet-to-be-released Yaesu DMR radios and don't want to buy a MotoTRBO repeater and the proprietary Rayfield C-Bridge. They will buy another vendors DMR repeater and their internet linking systems and then there will be a splinter group network that can't talk to the DMR-MARC network.
The same thing has happened with D-Star, even right at the beginning the US D-Star network was not connected to the Japanese network. Splinter groups formed by people who reverse engineered the software and those who developed open-source software. At least with the arrival of ircDDB, D-Star has some common glue that allows (most) systems to talk to each other.
I don't want to see the same thing happen to Yaesu... but unless they take command and quickly and ratify standards on repeater and internet linking hardware... well, who knows what will happen.
My D-Star repeater has the traditional Icom G2 software, the Dplus linking add on, Dextra linking for connecting to non-Icom systems, ircDDB for exchanging callsign information with non-Icom systems, it can pass received GPS information to the APRS-IS system... efforts have been made to open things up for connectivity. All of this can be replicated with a free software download, running on a fanless thin client PC with some simple RF hardware. A complete open-source D-Star repeater (sans RF duplexing hardware) can be had for a hundred dollars. I hope Rayfield doesn't sue the life out of the first person that reverse-engineers their internet linking protocol.
There are groups setting up P25 repeaters & NXDN repeaters (both IDAS and NexEDGE)... so already Yaesu has competition in the commerical/amateur digital field.
Enough rambling from me for now....
IRLP
Echolink
AllStarLink
Wires
Wires II
CQiNet
eQSO
FRN (Free Radio Network)
The same thing will happen with digital radio too. The DMR-MARC group is busy getting things happening and they seem to be endorsed by the Yaesu "glossy" brochure.
I'm sure there will be people out there who get hold of the yet-to-be-released Yaesu DMR radios and don't want to buy a MotoTRBO repeater and the proprietary Rayfield C-Bridge. They will buy another vendors DMR repeater and their internet linking systems and then there will be a splinter group network that can't talk to the DMR-MARC network.
The same thing has happened with D-Star, even right at the beginning the US D-Star network was not connected to the Japanese network. Splinter groups formed by people who reverse engineered the software and those who developed open-source software. At least with the arrival of ircDDB, D-Star has some common glue that allows (most) systems to talk to each other.
I don't want to see the same thing happen to Yaesu... but unless they take command and quickly and ratify standards on repeater and internet linking hardware... well, who knows what will happen.
My D-Star repeater has the traditional Icom G2 software, the Dplus linking add on, Dextra linking for connecting to non-Icom systems, ircDDB for exchanging callsign information with non-Icom systems, it can pass received GPS information to the APRS-IS system... efforts have been made to open things up for connectivity. All of this can be replicated with a free software download, running on a fanless thin client PC with some simple RF hardware. A complete open-source D-Star repeater (sans RF duplexing hardware) can be had for a hundred dollars. I hope Rayfield doesn't sue the life out of the first person that reverse-engineers their internet linking protocol.
There are groups setting up P25 repeaters & NXDN repeaters (both IDAS and NexEDGE)... so already Yaesu has competition in the commerical/amateur digital field.
Enough rambling from me for now....
Yaesu appears to be talking about DMR, not P25, for these amateur radio offerings.
And, since they are intended for the amateur radio market, I suspect that they will be designed for the 2m and 440 MHz bands, not 800 MHz.
The Dawn of Digital Communications in the Amateur Radio World
I re-read the announcement and it sort of sounds like they are coming out with:
-C4FM FDMA (APCO P25) transceivers first, and
-C4FM TDMA (MOTOTRBO) transceivers later.
unless I am totally misunderstanding this.
I re-read the announcement and it sort of sounds like they are coming out with:
-C4FM FDMA (APCO P25) transceivers first, and
-C4FM TDMA (MOTOTRBO) transceivers later.
unless I am totally misunderstanding this.
I agree with you totally, I have never seen the need to talk to my "elite inner circles" on any amateur band;--I just use good ol' Verizon for that. Being involved with LMR so much since I retired from my real job, I find it pointless to talk on my ham stuff about who just had knee surgery or whose wife died.
When I was young I was around a lot of guys that either built their own stuff or could afford high end Collins equipment and got on the lower bands for the wonder of directly talking all over the world and talking to others they may not talk to ever again. Those days are long gone for better or worse
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