AARRS seriously 😡

[SA_tx_88116]

Been saving up for a uniden BCD436HP only to find out SA has switched to digital simulcast and encrypted everything, like digital simulcast is something I would’ve been ok with because I heard you could do some tweaking to make a BCD436HP work with simulcast, but encryption I don’t think that was really necessary because they we’re already using ESK and no officers were ever put in danger by their own radios if you look at the SAPD fallen officers page most of those officers died by car accidents and if go farther back in the 2000s and 1990s it’s more serious but that’s just because it was a different time back then. And also why is there no dispatch tgrp’s listed I saw at the bottom That there were dispatch tgrps for school districts is that it?

 

[hiegtx]

Been saving up for a uniden BCD436HP only to find out SA has switched to digital simulcast and encrypted everything, like digital simulcast is something I would’ve been ok with because I heard you could do some tweaking to make a BCD436HP work with simulcast, but encryption I don’t think that was really necessary because they we’re already using ESK and no officers were ever put in danger by their own radios if you look at the SAPD fallen officers page most of those officers died by car accidents and if go farther back in the 2000s and 1990s it’s more serious but that’s just because it was a different time back then. And also why is there no dispatch tgrp’s listed I saw at the bottom That there were dispatch tgrps for school districts is that it?

With the 436HP, there are limited things you can do to deal with simulcast. Simulcast distortion is extremely location specific. Sometimes, moving a scanner a short distance, even as little as a foot or so, to a slightly different location in your house can make the difference between being unable to monitor the system, to finding a sweet spot where it works. In some cases, you can use 'less' (not more) antenna and get it to work. A directional antenna might also help when aimed at one specific transmit tower, but doing that may hinder your ability to hear other systems in a different direction.

Here in my area, Dallas public safety agencies (both the city, as well as the county, as well as some of the smaller cities) are transitioning to a P25 Phase II system, with simulcast sites. from their current conventional channels. While I do have both an SDS100 as well as SDS200, I wanted to park a scanner on the new system to look for new talkgroups as they become available. What works (for me) is to lay a 436HP flat on my desk, without a 'gain' type antenna. That, as well as the fact that my house has aluminum siding, which also helps attenuate signals from some directions and thus the 436 works satisfactorily. Those various possibilities to make a non-simulcast scanner work may be possible, but those method are ineffective (or just not doable) when you are out mobile, Of course, when out in the area, in my SUV, none of that helps, so the SDS100 rides along with me.

 

[SA_tx_88116]

Never thought my own city would go encrypted

 

[RaleighGuy]

no officers were ever put in danger by their own radios if you look at the SAPD fallen officers page most of those officers died by car accidents and if go farther back in the 2000s and 1990s it’s more serious but that’s just because it was a different time back then.

Encryption isn't just about officer deaths, but also about news media, or public playing cop and chasing police calls, or the unintended release of information.

And also why is there no dispatch tgrp’s listed I saw at the bottom That there were dispatch tgrps for school districts is that it?

Probably because they are encrypted and no one has been able to verify the usage of the encrypted TGs as dispatch so it could be submitted to the database. The departments don't submit that info, listeners do.

 

[SA_tx_88116]

Encryption isn't just about officer deaths, but also about news media, or public playing cop and chasing police calls, or the unintended release of information.


Probably because they are encrypted and no one has been able to verify the usage of the encrypted TGs as dispatch so it could be submitted to the database. The departments don't submit that info, listeners do.

I really never got a chance to listen to SAPD and BCSO because all I currently have is a pro 197 and I don’t actually live in San Antonio I live in the suburbs in Cibolo. I agree with the media part although as far as I know KSAT or KENS 5 never discriminated police.

 

[RaleighGuy]

Never thought my own city would go encrypted

Then you weren't reading the threads about your city's system, it was on the RR Forums over a year ago...

Alamo Area Regional Radio System (AARRS)

65xxx are Supergroups(Multiselect/patch) they can show up anywhere on the network and are usually used when toning out multiple departments. Schertz, Universal City, Live Oak, Cibolo, and Selma are all part of the Randolph Metrocom area and usually have patches in the 653xx range. as Rattler...

forums.radioreference.com

I agree with the media part although as far as I know KSAT or KENS 5 never discriminated police.

It's not about discrimination or bad press, it is about controlling information and limiting what does get out.

 

[hiegtx]

I really never got a chance to listen to SAPD and BCSO because all I currently have is a pro 197 and I don’t actually live in San Antonio I live in the suburbs in Cibolo. I agree with the media part although as far as I know KSAT or KENS 5 never discriminated police.

You may find that you are far enough outside the focused signal pattern that simulcast will not be an issue. Several of the simulcast systems here in DFW are far enough away from me that I can monitor them with any scanner capable of receiving their frequencies & system type.

Encryption isn't just about officer deaths, but also about news media, or public playing cop and chasing police calls, or the unintended release of information.

Here in my area, that was a significant factor in Arlington going fully encrypted for PD. There was a 'citizens monitoring group' that was showing up at scenes where police were dispatched, and filming the actions of the officers on scene.

Note that these 'video monitors' were not from any of the local radio or TV stations, nor were they affiliated with a newspaper or any other press agency.

 

[SA_tx_88116]

T

Then you weren't reading the threads about your city's system, it was on the RR Forums over a year ago...

Alamo Area Regional Radio System (AARRS)

65xxx are Supergroups(Multiselect/patch) they can show up anywhere on the network and are usually used when toning out multiple departments. Schertz, Universal City, Live Oak, Cibolo, and Selma are all part of the Randolph Metrocom area and usually have patches in the 653xx range. as Rattler...

forums.radioreference.com

It's not about discrimination or bad press, it is about controlling information and limiting what does get out.

That sucks

 

[SA_tx_88116]

You may find that you are far enough outside the focused signal pattern that simulcast will not be an issue. Several of the simulcast systems here in DFW are far enough away from me that I can monitor them with any scanner capable of receiving their frequencies & system type.


Here in my area, that was a significant factor in Arlington going fully encrypted for PD. There was a 'citizens monitoring group' that was showing up at scenes where police were dispatched, and filming the actions of the officers on scene.

Note that these 'video monitors' were not from any of the local radio or TV stations, nor were they affiliated with a newspaper or any other press agency.

do people not have anything better to do like just stay at home and listen don’t watch cause then you’ll ruin for everybody

 

[chrismol1]

do people not have anything better to do like just stay at home and listen don’t watch cause then you’ll ruin for everybody

Quite often people that do this type of thing hope for a confrontation and arrest in order to win quick 'go away money' with a 1st amendment lawsuit. While filming in a public area, 'shove' a camera in the cops face yell stupid stuff and provoke until the cop falls for it and loses control

 

[NC5267]

All the Talkgroups listed in the database are from sources with direct access to programming templates and users just scanning the system. All the dispatch talkgroups are listed but are either fully encrypted, partially, or in the clear. The whole system is a Phase II system. A few district PDs are in the clear, and some are fully encrypted. It is really a mix. Same with suburban cities. Castle Hills etc...I have been watching the build-out of the system since the beginning. Some agencies going encrypted were surprising, like Alamo Colleges and SWISD PD. Others are not because they follow whatever SAPD does, and SAPD hid behind the ESK for years. So not surprising they fully encrypt their fleet of channels. My media friends mentioned the city dragged its feet programming their radios with the new system and keys. SAPD is using numerous keys also. Like military comms. Not much we can do.

 

[SA_tx_88116]

All the Talkgroups listed in the database are from sources with direct access to programming templates and users just scanning the system. All the dispatch talkgroups are listed but are either fully encrypted, partially, or in the clear. The whole system is a Phase II system. A few district PDs are in the clear, and some are fully encrypted. It is really a mix. Same with suburban cities. Castle Hills etc...I have been watching the build-out of the system since the beginning. Some agencies going encrypted were surprising, like Alamo Colleges and SWISD PD. Others are not because they follow whatever SAPD does, and SAPD hid behind the ESK for years. So not surprising they fully encrypt their fleet of channels. My media friends mentioned the city dragged its feet programming their radios with the new system and keys. SAPD is using numerous keys also. Like military comms. Not much we can do.

I have a cousin that works for the SAPD maybe I’ll ask him what he thinks about the situation but in the end it truly sucks that now I have to get an SDS 100 and then still only be able to listen to fire and EMS.

 

[hiegtx]

I have a cousin that works for the SAPD maybe I’ll ask him what he thinks about the situation but in the end it truly sucks that now I have to get an SDS 100 and then still only be able to listen to fire and EMS.

As I noted earlier (post 7), from your location in Guadalupe County, there is a fair chance that you can monitor the system using a 436HP. You may be far enough away that simulcast problems will not be an issue. Of course, if you have your scanner (436HP) with you, and drive into Bexar County, no it's not likely to work very well. But from a distance, you might be able to use the 436 instead of upgrading to an SDS series model scanner.

If you want to give the 436HP a shot, buy from a retailer that does not whack you with a large restock fee if you need to return it. ScannerMaster is usually fairly straight forward, but you would pay freight both ways (shipping to you, then shipping for a return). ScannerMaster is currently at $$505.00. Bearcat Warehouse currently shows $443, but I'm not familiar with their return policy; their webpage indicates that return shipping is not paid (unless returning a defective scanner for exchange in the first 30 days after purchase), and if you purchased with a promotional 'free shipping', that 'free shipping' would be charged back to you (except, again, for a defective unit within 30 days of purchase sent back for exchange).

Amazon is currently at $445.00 (ironically, that's from Police Scanner Outlet, which is the name Bearcat Warehouse uses for their Amazon Marketplace items. Amazon shipping to you is free (at the price of this scanner), and if you are an Amazon Prime member, return shipping is also free.. You would pay the Texas sales tax if purchased from Amazon; I don't know if that would be collected if ordered from ScannerMaster or Bearcat Warehouse.

Regardless of which scanner you end up buying, no matter from which specific dealer, do not pay for the dealer to program it for you. That costs you $60 or more, and escalates with each additional county selected. There are far too many threads here on RadioReference, Wiki pages, and YouTube videos to walk you through programming with additional charges. There's also a number of members here that can create a starter file for you to use, as long as you install Sentinel (or other software, such as ProScan). Sentinel needs to be installed, regardless of any other programming software you acquire, since you need Sentinel to maintain the database for the scanner, and also to install any firmware updates that may finally be released. (I'm not holding my breath on that, though the Uniden rep, Joe Bearcat, has implied that at least some updates are in the works within the next year, though he did not provide any specific models to get the update.)

Edited to correct the county

 

[KevinC]

As I noted earlier (post 7), from your location in Gillespie County, there is a fair chance that you can monitor the system using a 436HP. You may be far enough away that simulcast problems will not be an issue. Of course, if you have your scanner (436HP) with you, and drive into Bexar County, no it's not likely to work very well. But from a distance (you're in the 'second county away' from Bexar County), you might be able to use the 436 instead of upgrading to an SDS series model scanner.

If you want to give the 436HP a shot, buy from a retailer that does not whack you with a large restock fee if you need to return it. ScannerMaster is usually fairly straight forward, but you would pay freight both ways (shipping to you, then shipping for a return). ScannerMaster is currently at $$505.00. Bearcat Warehouse currently shows $443, but I'm not familiar with their return policy; their webpage indicates that return shipping is not paid (unless returning a defective scanner for exchange in the first 30 days after purchase), and if you purchased with a promotional 'free shipping', that 'free shipping' would be charged back to you (except, again, for a defective unit within 30 days of purchase sent back for exchange).

Amazon is currently at $445.00 (ironically, that's from Police Scanner Outlet, which is the name Bearcat Warehouse uses for their Amazon Marketplace items. Amazon shipping to you is free (at the price of this scanner), and if you are an Amazon Prime member, return shipping is also free.. You would pay the Texas sales tax if purchased from Amazon; I don't know if that would be collected if ordered from ScannerMaster or Bearcat Warehouse.

Regardless of which scanner you end up buying, no matter from which specific dealer, do not pay for the dealer to program it for you. That costs you $60 or more, and escalates with each additional county selected. There are far too many threads here on RadioReference, Wiki pages, and YouTube videos to walk you through programming with additional charges. There's also a number of members here that can create a starter file for you to use, as long as you install Sentinel (or other software, such as ProScan). Sentinel needs to be installed, regardless of any other programming software you acquire, since you need Sentinel to maintain the database for the scanner, and also to install any firmware updates that may finally be released. (I'm not holding my breath on that, though the Uniden rep, Joe Bearcat, has implied that at least some updates are in the works within the next year, though he did not provide any specific models to get the update.)

Did you mean Guadalupe County?

 

[hiegtx]

Did you mean Guadalupe County?

Yep, you're right. I think I may have been thinking about a different thread, somewhat along the same lines, that was in Gillespie.

Thx for the catch. I edited to correct the reference county, While the distance from Guadalupe to the system is less, there might still be a shot that the 436HP might work, except, of course, for reception actually in Bexar/

 

[rattlerbb01]

Yep, you're right. I think I may have been thinking about a different thread, somewhat along the same lines, that was in Gillespie.

Thx for the catch. I edited to correct the reference county, While the distance from Guadalupe to the system is less, there might still be a shot that the 436HP might work, except, of course, for reception actually in Bexar/

Generally being 10-15 miles from the nearest tower on a simulcast is necessary on this system for the 436HP. From Fair Oaks Ranch to Lytle I receive very few transmissions on the 436 while the SDS100 is busy.

 

[SA_tx_88116]

I think I will just wait till Christmas for an SDs 100 also on scanner master what does the choose setup option do?

 

[mancow]

I think I will just wait till Christmas for an SDs 100 also on scanner master what does the choose setup option do?

Rip you off for cash.

 

[SA_tx_88116]

Rip you off for cash.

So it basically programs your county which is useless on a uniden scanner

 

[hiegtx]

So it basically programs your county which is useless on a uniden scanner

Their "setup"($39.95) updates the database to the current one. When shipped, unless it's updated, the database in the scanner is several years out of date. The Sentinel database, at the time of installation, is also likely to be well out of date. But you can install Sentinel on your PC (there is no charge for it). Then update the database in Sentinel, and also write the update to the scanner. Their "setup" would also include any firmware updates that are available for your scanner. But, again, you can update the database in both the scanner & Sentinel, and Sentinel can install any firmware updates for you (if there were any at that time).

Their setup also includes programming for one county. But, again, once you install & update Sentinel, you can do that yourself very quickly & easily. If you wanted two counties programmed, that's $59.95, three counties is $79.95. Other sellers (but not Amazon) also try to upsell programming and installation of upgrades; that's a waste of your money, no matter where you purchase.

Also, do not purchase any upgrades (DMR, NXDN, or ProVoice) from ScannerMaster or any other dealer. SM charges $75 for each upgrade. Direct from Uniden, the NXDN upgrade is $50, and DMR is $60. (ProVoice is also $50 from Uniden, but why waste your money on this? Once San Antonio and Bexar County fully transition to the new system, ProVoice would be useless to you.)

Amazon, which is much cheaper anyway, does not 'offer' setup or upgrades, and their base cost is much less as well.

You can download Sentinel and install it before ordering a scanner. That way, you can do a test drive before whatever scanner you pick is delivered.