Gainesville site 2.3 I’m not sure if the lcn 14 lsn 20/30 452.3625 is correct for that freq. I was using dsdplus.
CLAY ELECTRIC COOPERATIVE, INC. DMR Trunking
- Thread starter bravo14
- Start date
lwvmobile
DSD-FME
I think when they moved from Tiny to Small system model, they must have changed the LPCN channel numbering. Before, I was getting certain values, now I am getting values more akin to this On Site 1-1.1 in Lake City:
Code:
21:16:03 Sync: +DMR [slot1] slot2 | Color Code=00 | CSBK
C_ALOHA_SYS_PARMS - Small - Net ID: 1 Site ID: 1.1 Cat: AB
21:15:26 Sync: +DMR [slot1] slot2 | Color Code=00 | CSBK
Broadcast Voice Channel Grant (BTV_GRANT) - Logical
LPCN: 0002; TS: 1; LPCN+TS: 0005; Target: 00087921 - Source: 00082357
21:15:32 Sync: +DMR [slot1] slot2 | Color Code=00 | CSBK
Talkgroup Voice Channel Grant (TV_GRANT) - Logical
LPCN: 0002; TS: 2; LPCN+TS: 0006; Target: 00087921 - Source: 00081921
21:16:01 Sync: +DMR [slot1] slot2 | Color Code=00 | CSBK
Broadcast Voice Channel Grant (BTV_GRANT) - Logical
LPCN: 0001; TS: 2; LPCN+TS: 0004; Target: 00087921 - Source: 00082357Depending on if you prefer the Logical Physical Channel Numbering(Uniden?, DSD-FME), or the LSN style LPCN+TS value (DSDPlus FL), you have either channels 1 and 2, or LSNs 3,4,5,6, with 3 in this instance being the CSBK control time slot channel. Using the prior instance of channel 1 and 2, channel 1 is 451.1375 Mhz and channel 2 is 452.0125 Mhz, or in the LSN-esque version for DSD+ FL, that would be 3 = 451.1375 Time slot 1; 4 = 451.1375 Time Slot 2; 5 = 452.0125 Time Slot 1; 6 = 452.0125 Time Slot 2; (at least, I believe this would be correct for DSD+ FL)
I'll try to monitor the system some more, but usually reception all but dries up entirely during the daytime, and they certainly aren't busy at night.
lwvmobile
DSD-FME
Also, just for what its worth, the Lake City site seems to have Tait radios, or at least, radios on that system have some tait specific mfid values coming off of it, p_protects as opposed to voice link control (very tait-like behavior), as well as Tait specific AMBE+2 Silent Frames.
Code:
23:23:29 Sync: +DMR [slot1] slot2 | Color Code=00 | CSBK
Broadcast Voice Channel Grant (BTV_GRANT) - Logical
LPCN: 0002; TS: 2; LPCN+TS: 0006; Target: 00087921 - Source: 00082357
Frequency: 452.012500 MHz
DMR PDU Payload [B2][00][00][28][01][57][71][01][41][B5][CD][10]
23:23:29 Sync: +DMR slot1 [slot2] | Color Code=00 | CSBK
Protect (P_PROTECT) - Private Enable Target MS PTT (EN_PTT_ONE_MS)
Target [00082357] - Source [00087921]
DMR PDU Payload [AF][00][00][06][01][41][B5][01][57][71][0D][54]
23:23:29 Sync: +DMR slot1 [slot2] | Color Code=00 | CSBK
Protect (P_PROTECT) - Group Disable Target PTT (DIS_PTT)
Target [16777215] - Source [16776906] -- ALLMSIDZ
DMR PDU Payload [AF][00][00][01][FF][FF][FF][FF][FE][CA][AB][AB]
23:23:29 Sync: +DMR [slot1] slot2 | Color Code=00 | IDLE
23:23:29 Sync: +DMR slot1 [SLOT2] | Color Code=00 | VC1*
AMBE F812E99F84C080 err = [0] [0]
AMBE F831105E4C3880 err = [0] [0]
AMBE F861103E443980 err = [0] [0]
SLC_P_SYS_PARMS - Small - Net ID: 1 Site ID: 1.1 - Comp CC: 0
SLCO Completed Block [34][00][1A][4D][C0]
23:23:29 Sync: +DMR [slot1] slot2 | Color Code=00 | IDLE
23:23:29 Sync: +DMR slot1 [SLOT2] | Color Code=00 | VC2
AMBE F812E99F84C080 err = [0] [0]
AMBE F812E99F84C080 err = [0] [0]
AMBE F812E99F84C080 err = [0] [0]
...
23:23:30 Sync: +DMR slot1 [SLOT2] | Color Code=00 | VC6
SLOT 2 Tait FLCO=0x08 FID=0x58
DMR PDU Payload [08][58][4C][43][2D][32][30][34][39]
...
23:23:30 Sync: +DMR slot1 [SLOT2] | Color Code=00 | VC6
SLOT 2 Tait FLCO=0x04 FID=0x58
DMR PDU Payload [04][58][33][C6][AC][A5][22][7C][F0]Interesting.... Did they change the LSN/LCN? not sure if vc with a # is the lcn
lwvmobile
DSD-FME
In official DMR ETSI terminology for Tier 3, what we commonly call the LCN is called the Logical Physical Channel Number, and what we usually refer to as the LSN or logical slot number is called the logical channel number (LCN), so that's a layer of confusion, but in essence, what I am getting is what I said in the previous (first) message I made this evening. I am getting an LPCN of channel 1 and channel 2, which corresponds to LPCN+TS channels (1) - 3 and 4, (2) - 5 and 6 when using the DSDPlus FL convention of combining the 12-bit lpcn with the 1-bit LCN to create a unique 13-bit LSN value for DMR T3.
See the below LPCN, TS, and LPCN+TS values in the snippet below:
See the below LPCN, TS, and LPCN+TS values in the snippet below:
Code:
23:23:29 Sync: +DMR [slot1] slot2 | Color Code=00 | CSBK
Broadcast Voice Channel Grant (BTV_GRANT) - Logical
LPCN: 0002; TS: 2; LPCN+TS: 0006; Target: 00087921 - Source: 00082357
Frequency: 452.012500 MHz
DMR PDU Payload [B2][00][00][28][01][57][71][01][41][B5][CD][10]lwvmobile
DSD-FME
Those are not channel numbers, those correspond to VC1, VC2, VC3, VC4, VC5, and VC6 of a DMR voice super frame. Officially, they are listed as VC-A through VC-F, but in coding, its easier to increment numerically, than to go A,B,C,D,E,F, or more accurately, I'm too lazy to make the code display it that way.
Okay. A few months back there was a band opening and I was getting a few sites for the system and seemed the lcn/lsn didn't show up the info. Not sure if they changed it or not. I'll try to look into it next month.
lwvmobile
DSD-FME
Now that I look at it some more, I don't think the channel numbering changed any, I may have mixed up Clay with the new Duke Energy system when it comes to channel numbering. I found a very old DSDplus FL log in one of our old conversations that have the channels listed in the LSN (LPCN+TS) style format that have the same 3,4,5,6 channels that I was calculating for with DSD-FME's LCPN+TS values.
Code:
2021/10/21 11:01:44 Current network: T1
2021/10/21 11:01:44 Current site: T1-1.1
2021/10/21 11:48:24 Bcast Group call; TG=87922 RID=82476 Slot=2 3s
2021/10/21 11:48:45 Group call; TG=87922 RID=81921 Ch=5
2021/10/21 11:49:03 Group call; TG=87922 RID=81921 Ch=4
2021/10/21 12:18:47 Group call; TG=87922 RID=81921 Ch=6
2021/10/21 12:19:09 Group call; TG=87922 RID=81921 Ch=5
2021/10/21 12:19:25 Group call; TG=87922 RID=81921 Ch=4Lines up pretty well with what I got tonight.
Code:
23:23:19 Sync: +DMR [slot1] slot2 | Color Code=00 | CSBK
Broadcast Voice Channel Grant (BTV_GRANT) - Logical
LPCN: 0001; TS: 2; LPCN+TS: 0004; Target: 00087921 - Source: 00082357
Frequency: 451.137500 MHz
DMR PDU Payload [B2][00][00][18][01][57][71][01][41][B5][94][9D]
23:23:24 Sync: +DMR [slot1] slot2 | Color Code=00 | CSBK
Talkgroup Voice Channel Grant (TV_GRANT) - Logical
LPCN: 0002; TS: 1; LPCN+TS: 0005; Target: 00087921 - Source: 00081921
Frequency: 452.012500 MHz
DMR PDU Payload [B1][00][00][20][01][57][71][01][40][01][3B][1C]
23:23:29 Sync: +DMR [slot1] slot2 | Color Code=00 | CSBK
Broadcast Voice Channel Grant (BTV_GRANT) - Logical
LPCN: 0002; TS: 2; LPCN+TS: 0006; Target: 00087921 - Source: 00082357
Frequency: 452.012500 MHz
DMR PDU Payload [B2][00][00][28][01][57][71][01][41][B5][CD][10]
23:23:36 Sync: +DMR [slot1] slot2 | Color Code=00 | CSBK
Talkgroup Voice Channel Grant (TV_GRANT) - Logical
LPCN: 0001; TS: 2; LPCN+TS: 0004; Target: 00087921 - Source: 00081921
Frequency: 451.137500 MHz
DMR PDU Payload [B1][00][00][18][01][57][71][01][40][01][F1][3C]
23:24:11 Sync: +DMR [slot1] slot2 | Color Code=00 | CSBK
Broadcast Voice Channel Grant (BTV_GRANT) - Logical
LPCN: 0002; TS: 1; LPCN+TS: 0005; Target: 00087921 - Source: 00082355
Frequency: 452.012500 MHzLooks like the ch has changed. I see ch= 4-6. Not sure 451.1375 lsn 4097/4098 lcn 2048 still good.
lwvmobile
DSD-FME
Well, if they did change channel numbers, it was most certainly prior to 2021/10/21 going by that FL log.
As far as the site model changing, that certainly did change from Tiny to Small, probably to accommodate more sites. Tiny Network model can only accommodate up to 8 unique site id values (3-bits) while keeping the same network id. Small Network model can accommodate 32 unique site ids (5-bits) with the same network id.
and that's before the completely ridiculous and unnecessary DMRLA B.S. site id subdivisions.
Next month I'll drive by Gainesville and Brooker see what I can get. I was surprised I didn't pick a site up the past week when I was near by there.
lwvmobile
DSD-FME
No. How did you initially acquire these LSN and LCN values you have in your spreadsheets?
Awhile back you had site 1 lcn or lsn. I used a program that only does tier 3 lookup. I can't remember where I found the program.
lwvmobile
DSD-FME
Okay, so here's what I think happened when you ran that calculator. The LPCNs should be 1 and 2. I'm going to show you where I think using the calculator went wrong by looking at these values in binary with leading zeroes:
So, either somehow the LCNs and LSNs were mixed up when you were figuring this stuff out, or channel 1 and channel 2 overflowed to 4097 and 4098, or a combination of multiple things like that.
Code:
(0001) = 0000 0000 0001 -- 12 bit value
(4097) = 1 0000 0000 0001 -- 13 bit value (either overflowed its constraint or data entered incorrectly)
(0002) = 0000 0000 0010 -- 12 bit value
(4098) = 1 0000 0000 0010 -- 13 bit value (either overflowed its constraint or data entered incorrectly)So, either somehow the LCNs and LSNs were mixed up when you were figuring this stuff out, or channel 1 and channel 2 overflowed to 4097 and 4098, or a combination of multiple things like that.
I know the scanners can't do lsn if so it only would follow one side of the time slot vs lcn will follow both slots. DSDPlus doesn't like tier3 systems just shows question mark even with the freq in. I'll rerun the dsdplus again next month and put 0's in the freq setup and start fresh. I'll leave the lcn in the scanner see what will pick up on that end.
I’m picking up 454.3625 control channel and 454.5375 they both are color 0. I don’t see this on fcc or rrdb. I’m by 16 by the shands bridge getting signal. Dsd plus shows
S1.3 unknown location
NL 1.1 1.2 1.4 2.4
454.3625 lsn 11/12
454.5375 lsn 13/14
I have put lcn 5 and 6 and scanner not picking it up so don’t know what’s going on there.
S1.3 unknown location
NL 1.1 1.2 1.4 2.4
454.3625 lsn 11/12
454.5375 lsn 13/14
I have put lcn 5 and 6 and scanner not picking it up so don’t know what’s going on there.
I went to the step changed from auto to 6.25 and see the control channel as 454.36875
Here is update of the list. Not sure if 1.3 is Green Cove Springs or part of another county.... I did pick up 1.3 at St Johns / Clay county line.
This should be the correct one. I forgot I made a dsdplus site file. I don't know where 454.6000 is located. I think 1.3 might be green cove springs.
I was in Gville area and I did get 2 sites for lsn. I did get gainesville and reddick. I did update my spreadsheet and hoping to fill in the missing sites.