Colorado Springs FD and other agencies questions

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MountainMoose

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I need to ask, since I just don't get it. I have been listening to the grass fire that popped up in the COS area today with evacuations in many neighborhoods. Was a very dire and could have been UGLY situation.
I just don't understand for the life of me the response, radio comms, the mutual aid set up etc. It SEEMS there is so much confusion and I've heard multiple times crews calling a certain command channel 3, 4, 5 times with no response. At times crews were like "I've been trying to raise you on tac7" only to find out it was supposed to be Tac 8 or whatever. why are there multiple tac channels being used as opposed to one or maybe two mutual aid type fireground channels? There was similar questions and issues posed after the Boulder fires, I'm hearing the exact same thing today on this fire. It's no wonder why there are so many issues relating to communications and such.
Also why are they so slow to request mutual aid or get outside agencies on these fires ESPECIALLY on red flag days with 60 MPH gusts? Seems like these guys are losing the battle even before they have a chance. I'm NOT putting down any agencies or anything like that I'm genuinely curious and also concerned as it seems there is so much miscommunication and confusion. Is there no in place Mutual aid response procedures for fires in CO? You would think that given this terrain, topography, environment, climate and the like in CO these agencies would be top notch and some of the best wildland/grass fire agencies in the country. Would love any responses that can answers these as I'm not super versed in CO fire comms etc.
 

Mick

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One factor could be that with the 3-4 separate incidents at the same time, with different response and TAC talkgroups in use, that some firefighters got lost in getting on the correct one. It got fairly chaotic on the radio as I listened in today.
 

kv6o

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multiple times crews calling a certain command channel 3, 4, 5 times with no response.

If you're referring to a unit calling the Incident Commander, that does happen because the IC might be juggling multiple radios, face-to-face discussions, phone calls, etc. If they are on the wrong channel, that happens too - you think your radio is on TAC5 when it's on CMD6, or similar. Communications on an immerging, expanding incident is always chaotic because it's sooo dynamic and fluid, and then there's the adrenaline flowing.. Training and procedures help, but the real thing is always messy.

It's always easier to look back in hindsight, knowing how the event unfolded, and see mistakes.
 

es93546

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I need to ask, since I just don't get it. I have been listening to the grass fire that popped up in the COS area today with evacuations in many neighborhoods. Was a very dire and could have been UGLY situation.
I just don't understand for the life of me the response, radio comms, the mutual aid set up etc. It SEEMS there is so much confusion and I've heard multiple times crews calling a certain command channel 3, 4, 5 times with no response. At times crews were like "I've been trying to raise you on tac7" only to find out it was supposed to be Tac 8 or whatever. why are there multiple tac channels being used as opposed to one or maybe two mutual aid type fireground channels? There was similar questions and issues posed after the Boulder fires, I'm hearing the exact same thing today on this fire. It's no wonder why there are so many issues relating to communications and such.
Also why are they so slow to request mutual aid or get outside agencies on these fires ESPECIALLY on red flag days with 60 MPH gusts? Seems like these guys are losing the battle even before they have a chance. I'm NOT putting down any agencies or anything like that I'm genuinely curious and also concerned as it seems there is so much miscommunication and confusion. Is there no in place Mutual aid response procedures for fires in CO? You would think that given this terrain, topography, environment, climate and the like in CO these agencies would be top notch and some of the best wildland/grass fire agencies in the country. Would love any responses that can answers these as I'm not super versed in CO fire comms etc.

The initial attack for wildland fires during 60 mph winds and near structures is going to be chaotic every time. The stakes are high, with high value resources being threatened and the situation extremely dynamic with personnel that don't want to lose or have structures damaged. This is especially true of local personnel who may own a home or a business that is threatened or know someone who is. Once a fire becomes large and personnel and apparatus is brought in from distant locations this part of the "excitement equation" is much reduced. You have the added factor that the public can be really amped up and causing traffic jams. Highly dynamic situations are also quite dangerous which contributes to emotions. It is also possible that some of the firefighters haven't worked in such circumstances depending on how long it has been since the area or department has experienced a fire like this. I was not there to hear what you heard, but my wildland firefighting experience is that initial attack in high winds in the wildland-urban interface is going to be, to some degree, chaotic.

Keep in mind that the world's easiest task is to be a hero in someone else's war. That is, don't be too critical if you haven't been at the incident and charged with making order out of chaos.
 
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