SDS100/SDS200: County dispatch using a site in a different county.

[Facsimile]

I'll try to explain this the best that I can - please let me know if I can clarify anything:

I am attempting to organize my scanner so it doesn't scan every site in the entire state for a single county. The system in question is the Indiana Project Hoosier SAFE-T. I am attempting to program the DeKalb County Fire Dispatch (TG 10115) into my SDS100. For sites, I chose to only use Auburn (Site 045 (2D)) since it is the only site located in DeKalb County that I am aware of. I didn't hear anything. I switched on a previous favorite list and found that the site that gets used is Fort Wayne (Site 046 (2E)) which is in a neighboring county.

My plans of organizing and speeding up scanning have just hit a wall. I thought I understood sites but now I am questioning myself. When dispatch is transmitting on the Fort Wayne site, I switched to the Auburn site and did not hear anything. Is there a better method for choosing sites besides Location Control? Even if I set Location Crontrol to 1 mile, I am picking up sites an extremely far distance away.

 

[drdispatch]

If there are no user radios affiliated with the Auburn site that are tuned to that talkgroup, you will not hear the traffic. P25 systems only broadcast a particular talkgroup on sites to which a radio has affiliated (electronically "checked in").
Are you scanning the database, or did you create a Favorites List?

 

[Facsimile]

If there are no user radios affiliated with the Auburn site that are tuned to that talkgroup, you will not hear the traffic. P25 systems only broadcast a particular talkgroup on sites to which a radio has affiliated (electronically "checked in").
Are you scanning the database, or did you create a Favorites List?

I created a favorites list. I made one "default" with no modifications, and one with only what I thought made sense as in my initial post. The default receives on the external county site and my modified list receives nothing.

Is there a way to find the affiliation of the talkgroup? Or better yet, find what is affiliated with a site? Or am I just making it harder on myself?

 

[RaleighGuy]

Is there a way to find the affiliation of the talkgroup? Or better yet, find what is affiliated with a site? Or am I just making it harder on myself?

There is no easy why, short of becoming a radio tech with the agency, it takes listening and logging to determine what traffic is carried where on a normal basis. That said, as units travel the sites they are affiliated with change as well, if they have permissions to the new site, these permissions are set by the radio division of the agencies.

 

[drdispatch]

Best thing I can tell you: Go to the db page for the system. Find the sites in DeKalb and adjacent counties. Click on the site name. On each site page will be a map showing the site's *approximate* coverage area. Program those sites that cover your county that you can reasonably "hear". If you can receive every site which covers your county, you should hear all county traffic.

 

[Facsimile]

as units travel the sites they are affiliated with change as well, if they have permissions to the new site, these permissions are set by the radio division of the agencies.

Is this done automatically? I keep playing with this case and I have noticed multiple counties around the Fort Wayne area use the Fort Wayne site instead of their own.

 

[RaleighGuy]

Is this done automatically? I keep playing with this case and I have noticed multiple counties around the Fort Wayne area use the Fort Wayne site instead of their own.

Short answer, yes. Keep in mind in a multi-county/statewide system the site isn't the county's it is part of a bigger picture and units affiliate with whatever site provides the best signal based on the location of the unit, it is not based on geographic location of the agency/department. As signal strength drops beyond a certain level it is handed off to whatever site has the better signal level.

 

[werinshades]

I've been out that way a few times, no Location Control used, just self-programmed. Depending on what part of DeKalb County I was in, DeKalb Site 1-045 received everything. Steuben Simulcast 1-006 was useful on the north end (received all DeKalb County talkgroups, plus many others), and Kendallville Site 1-020 also received all the DeKalb County talkgoups and scanned all sites.

I haven't been out there in a year or so, but might take this question to the Indiana Forum as there might have been a site change, or some other issue we're not aware of unless we're local.

 

[ofd8001]

My suggestion, at least for "starters" is to program ALL sites to your Favorites List, set Location Control to On and set the Global Range for your scanner to 0.0 miles.

This will facilitate the scanner to turn on just those sites close enough to be received by your scanner. (Pretty much allowing the scanner to function as designed.)

The Indiana system is very robust and allows units from one area to roam into another, yet remain in contact with their home dispatch center. That's what Raleigh Guy is describing. So if a Jeffersonville unit is in Fort Wayne, the system will "link" the Fort Wayne area tower to the Jeffersonville site and they both will be carrying the conversation.

After you have monitored the system in this fashion for a while, you can determine which sites are carrying the transmissions of interest to you and which ones you can disregard/ignore.

Generally speaking, I will be sure to have the talkgroups I'm interested in hearing programmed, along with the sites that I am close enough to "hear". I don't get too hung up on which site a given talkgroup uses. There could be many reasons why a talkgroup uses a site that may be in an adjacent county.

 

[ten13]

If you're attempting to keep "all your eggs in one basket," i.e. all your local departments coming off of one local site, that may not be possible.

In NJ, on the statewide system, some departments in Bergen County and Essex County are operating off the Passaic County site (as well as other sites). It all depends on terrain, location of the site vs. the department in question, affiliation, etc., not political boundaries of the counties.

You might as well add that out-of-county site to your modified Favorite list if it works so well.

 

[n1chu]

While choosing the closest site may seem logical, sometimes geographical constraints will dictate using another site. At least you found the site that carries your TG’s… and without simulcasting!

 

[werinshades]

Generally speaking, I will be sure to have the talkgroups I'm interested in hearing programmed, along with the sites that I am close enough to "hear". I don't get too hung up on which site a given talkgroup uses. There could be many reasons why a talkgroup uses a site that may be in an adjacent county.

This is my method as well, same conclusion, just get there differently. I have all the Troops on my Illinois Starcom system, 2 sites from my location, and frequently here traffic stops in southern Illinois from Chicago Metro. Certain Troops affiliate consistently, while others aren't as frequent. It also helps me to log radio ID's from across the state.

I would check the Auburn site 1-045 in this case, as it always was my go-to while in DeKalb County. Carried all police, fire departments, in addition to Steuben, Lagrange counties police and fire. I don't know how location control plays a role in this, but maybe turn it off and see if anything changes. I would reach out to the locals to find out if something changed too.

 

[Facsimile]

Thank you everyone for your replies. I have been continuing the investigation this morning. Does the Analyze feature provide any benefit in this scenario? Just stumbled across it and read a little bit. I noticed while analyzing the system status site for Auburn 1-045, the indicators for S Q and A are 1/10, 0/10, and 0/10 respectively. Only about 10 miles away from the transmitter. Just thought I'd throw that in there. I will take everyone's advice and see what happens. Thanks again!

 

[werinshades]

Thank you everyone for your replies. I have been continuing the investigation this morning. Does the Analyze feature provide any benefit in this scenario? Just stumbled across it and read a little bit. I noticed while analyzing the system status site for Auburn 1-045, the indicators for S Q and A are 1/10, 0/10, and 0/10 respectively. Only about 10 miles away from the transmitter. Just thought I'd throw that in there. I will take everyone's advice and see what happens. Thanks again!

This would point to the direction that you're range of the site isn't very good, and decoding of the trunking channel would be limited. Did you happen to turn off the location control and see if that made a difference? The other "possibility" is that the Auburn site might be having issues, but the locals might better answer that. Since you appear to be in the southern part of DeKalb County, have to tried entering the Kendaville Site 1-020? I discovered in my limited time there that the site carried all of DeKalb County's traffic as well and by using Location Control, might be out of the range that you set?

 

[RMason]

the system status site for Auburn 1-045, the indicators for S Q and A are 1/10, 0/10, and 0/10 respectively. Only about 10 miles away from the transmitter.

That indicates you are not getting good signal from the Auburn site. You may want to take the sds100 for a drive and see if it wakes up closer to the site. Also, double check the programming to make sure the control channel frequencies are entered correctly.

 

[drdispatch]

Is this done automatically? I keep playing with this case and I have noticed multiple counties around the Fort Wayne area use the Fort Wayne site instead of their own.

Not that different from the way your cellphone changes sites as you travel.

 

[west-pac]

What's the update on this? I just saw this thread, and it's not too far off from my neck of the woods. I've received the Auburn site from my house, 60 miles south of there, on several occasions. I would tend to believe this situation with the SDS100 is a programming error.

 

[Facsimile]

What's the update on this? I just saw this thread, and it's not too far off from my neck of the woods. I've received the Auburn site from my house, 60 miles south of there, on several occasions. I would tend to believe this situation with the SDS100 is a programming error.

I just use the Fort Wayne site for Dekalb county. It works perfectly. For what ever reason, I was and am still not able to get any signal from the Auburn site. Which is fine since I can hear everything anyway. It's probably just my location. All the surrounding counties come through the Fort Wayne site.

 

[werinshades]

I just use the Fort Wayne site for Dekalb county. It works perfectly. For what ever reason, I was and am still not able to get any signal from the Auburn site. Which is fine since I can hear everything anyway. It's probably just my location. All the surrounding counties come through the Fort Wayne site.

Love them simulcast sites! DeKalb Fire being received on this site?

 

[west-pac]

Love them simulcast sites! DeKalb Fire being received on this site?

Neither Auburn nor Fort Wayne are simulcast.