Cross band Repeater Question

[rapidcharger]

Spoken like a true flatlander who thinks nobody is effected by their interference.

 

[prcguy]

Are you saying DSTAR can be cross banded through something like a Yaesu FT-8900?

FSK

 

[dcr_inc]

Lauri-Coyote... You were just "buttoned and stringed".. They pulled your strings and you moved exactly like they wanted, then you allowed them to push your buttons and you moved like they commanded.. Enjoy YOUR ham radio the way YOU see fit and keep it within the rules as you see them.. SCREW the rest, ITS A HOBBY !!!

 

[prcguy]

Never mind, my brain was thinking AFSK when FSK was posted.

Are you saying DSTAR can be cross banded through something like a Yaesu FT-8900?

 

[Lauri-CoyoteFrostbite]

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Smiles-

Don't worry, DCR- no one pulls my strings. My last post was flat-out pure sarcasm; but thank you for the encouraging comments.
I hope others never loose sight that this is social media- if there are pearls of wisdom to be found here, there is also a lot of entertainment.

____________________________________________________________

And Wow !... a Flat Lander !...... I have been called many things but never one of those.... Cool !

I (try) to run a family spread in the upper Arkansas/San Luis Valley's of Colorado --- 800+ acres plus over three times that in BLM and USFS leases. Our ranch houses go up over 9000 feet- when I am home, I am a SOTA girl.

I own a second home on a mesa in Los Alamos, NM: it overlooks Santa Fe at 7500 feet----
A Flat Lander, Cowboy?.. Indeed!








Jperuta, if you are still hanging in, see what an innocent question can start ....lol ?

I hope that you will continue to look into your remote system plans. Please keep in mind the ID issues, and more importantly that this may be construed as an auxill'ary link into an existing repeater- and get the owner's permission first. Even if you get all these hurtles crossed- be aware this may not make you very popular on this machine. Personally I would look for an alternative.


There Guys, I could finish on Topic, No ?

Lauri
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[EdAzalia]

Wow Lauri! You can see your house in NM all the way from India! LOL

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[Lauri-CoyoteFrostbite]

hee hee- A Zen moment--- neat view, no ?

Lauri

 

[rapidcharger]

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Smiles-

I suppose you aren't hearing as much in Washington DC that you would out in the high desert that I do in my proximity to an urban area. One possibility for that is that giant peak that is boxing you in shown in the photo.

Excuse my lack of understanding of your verbose posts. I learned English in what most would agree feels like a foreign country and I only know basic words and speak in primitive vocalizations; mostly grunts and other caterwauling.

 

[bill4long]

Are you saying DSTAR can be cross banded through something like a Yaesu FT-8900?

Won't work. The digital voice modes require 9600 hz passband.
FM voice only does about 3000 hz and that's all the crossband mode will pass in FM.

 

[Lauri-CoyoteFrostbite]

That's Okay, Rapid-- lets just shake hands, part, and go off to fight our new separate dragons.

Lauri

 

[bill4long]

Regarding identification:

97.119 Station identification. (a) Each amateur station, except a space station or telecommand station, must transmit its assigned call sign on its transmitting channel at the end of each communication, and at least every 10 minutes during a communication, for the purpose of clearly making the source of the transmissions from the station known to those receiving the transmissions.

When I used to use my crossband radio, I would simply have the party on the other side announce that he was talking via my auxiliary station and say my call sign, something like, "N9XYZ on the W4XXX crossband auxiliary.". That fulfills 97.119(a), which is quite non-specific about how the ID actually gets accomplished, as long as it gets accomplished.

 

[prcguy]

It wont work mainly because the FSK modes would have to be received, demodulated then remodulated and transmited with FSK receivers and transmitters. The BW is secondary in this case. If a digital mode were AFSK like the AOR digital modems, then it can be received, demodulated and modulated again with an FM transmitter and would work with a simple amateur radio cross band repeater.

BTW, FM voice at 4KHz deviation is wider than most digital voice modes like DMR or Yaesu Fusion. The emission designation for 4KHz analog FM voice is 16K0F2D, meaning it needs up to 16KHz of channel BW. One designation for DMR is 7K60FXW, which needs a 7KHz BW channel and Yaesu Fusion is 9K36F7W which needs a 9KHz BW channel, so these digital voice modes are much narrower than FM analog voice.

Won't work. The digital voice modes require 9600 hz passband.
FM voice only does about 3000 hz and that's all the crossband mode will pass in FM.

 

[bill4long]

It wont work mainly because the FSK modes would have to be received, demodulated then remodulated and transmited with FSK receivers and transmitters. The BW is secondary in this case. If a digital mode were AFSK like the AOR digital modems, then it can be received, demodulated and modulated again with an FM transmitter and would work with a simple amateur radio cross band repeater.

The point is, the audio passband on the 8900 in the crossband repeater mode is not sufficient to repeat any of digital voice modes, to wit, DMR, DStar, Fusion, P25, and NXDN.

BTW, FM voice at 4KHz deviation is wider than most digital voice modes like DMR or Yaesu Fusion. The emission designation for 4KHz analog FM voice is 16K0F2D, meaning it needs up to 16KHz of channel BW. One designation for DMR is 7K60FXW, which needs a 7KHz BW channel and Yaesu Fusion is 9K36F7W which needs a 9KHz BW channel, so these digital voice modes are much narrower than FM analog voice.

I didn't mention anything about RF bandwidth requirements. Rather, audio passband. That should have been obvious.

 

[N4GIX]

Excuse my lack of understanding of your verbose posts.

Lauri may be verbose, but thankfully she's not a VVoVV: Verbose Vendor of Vacuous Verbiage like some folks we all know too well.

 

[rapidcharger]

That's Okay, Rapid-- lets just shake hands, part, and go off to fight our new separate dragons.

Lauri

I accept.
The other thing is that I didn't write the rules. I just repeated what they were.

Although I think in the case of using FRS as an intermediary, between two crossband repeaters, really not a good idea.

 

[krokus]

Never mind, my brain was thinking AFSK when FSK was posted.

Which was why I, specifically, asked about AFSK.

 

[Lauri-CoyoteFrostbite]

"When I used to use my crossband radio, I would simply have the party on the other side announce that he was talking via my auxiliary station and say my call sign, something like, "N9XYZ on the W4XXX crossband auxiliary.". That fulfills 97.119(a), which is quite non-specific about how the ID actually gets accomplished, as long as it gets accomplished."
bill4long



That's simple, elegant and keeps things legal,..... Neat

______________________________


There is another ham that shares the other end of my mountain valley's. Except for the transients that happen thru the area, we pretty much have to ourselves the high frequencies. Years ago he put up an open CCS, 2-to-440 remote- and while there was seldom any activity on it, it had an awesome coverage. I once asked him about this very ID issue- to which he said he was concerned. It was easy enuff to manually identify on the downlink (if anyone remember'd to do so,) but the rebroadcasted uplink cause my friend mild consternation.

I never would have lost a moment's sleep over this, but apparently this ID business was bothering him. One evening I had a radio on, and listening to the simplex frequency, I heard the squelch open, then a silent open mic, followed by a squelch tail (ah ! my friend was playing with his machine)-- and then a very seductive female voice saying something like

"This is K#XXX, remote base on _______ Peak"

As one of the few who knew the uplink control frequency, I switched over to 440 and kerchunked the remote

"This is K#XXX remote base on ________Peak"
came back in a sexy voice

"Okay B______, what's with the ID ?" I asked

"Hi Lauri !.... what do think of it ?- its on both frequencies"

"So I hear" I said "but that voice ? does it have to have that, that 'inflection ?"

"Its distinctive... do you like it ?"

"NO ! " I said "people will think I recorded that for you"

_______________________

The remote base's seductive female ID was short lived. One day it was simply gone.
"What happened to your Bimbo ?" I ask'd

"It broke... "

__________________________

That remote base is still operational the last time I listen'd, but there has been no more attention to ID'ing-- for years now.
I think my friend found better things to worry about, though I have never inquired further.


Lauri

 

[kayn1n32008]

Won't work. The digital voice modes require 9600 hz passband.
FM voice only does about 3000 hz and that's all the crossband mode will pass in FM.

CrossBand

 

[Chronic]

If you can hear the 2m repeater outside on your ht , then you can listen to the repeater directly and only have the cross band working in one direction transmitting to the repeater and by doing so you will not have the ID issue .

 

[AI7PM]

DSTAR crossband successfully done on IC-2820 and ID-5100.