Did I hear Ham operators or U.S. military?

[racin06]

Last night i tuned in to some interesting transmissions on 4.024 USB. There were several operators checking into some kind of a net. The call signs I picked up were AAR5GO, AAT4VF, AAR5NG and AAR7FX. At first I thought these were just HAM operators; however, the more I listened I thought this may have been the military. Why? Because these guys used radio procedures as are used in the military such as always identifiing the party in which they are transmitting and identifying their call signs (using the international phonetic alphabet) before each transmission. Example: "Alpha, Alpha, Romeo, Five Golf, Oscar...this is Alpha Alpha Tango, Four, Victor, Foxtrot...Over."

I have never heard ham operators (if these guys are just ham operators) use such strict military-like radio procedures.

Anyway, I was just wondering if these guys are the military. I couldn't determine because it seemed as if all the operators were just checking in and performing radio checks.

By the way, I just purchased my first shortwave receiver, the Sangean ATS-909 (modified by Radio Labs, Inc.) and the receiver performs great!

 

[jplyler]

Both. That was a MARS net. MARS is an organization made up of amateur operators who help out in military comms. Most of the comms are phone patches and the like. There is another net freq 13.925 (I think) just under the 20 meter ham band that can be very active w/ phone patches from military aircraft.

jon

 

[KB8UYC]

Also the alpabet phonetics that you heard are the ones that ALL amatuer radio operators use...........not just for those nexts but anytime that you have to spell something phoneticlly!

Eric

 

[nd5y]

Also the alpabet phonetics that you heard are the ones that ALL amatuer radio operators use.
Eric

B.S. There are a several phonetic alphabets used by hams, especially
in non-English speaking areas.


Tom

 

[KB8UYC]

Also the alpabet phonetics that you heard are the ones that ALL amatuer radio operators use.
Eric

B.S. There are a several phonetic alphabets used by hams, especially
in non-English speaking areas.


Tom

I am not trying to start an argument here, but the phonetic alphabet used in amatuer radio is suppose to be the military phonetics.....at least every book that I have seen has it in them. I know that a lot of Ham Operators use different phonetics......I have been a ham now for 10 years, and all I have seen is the military phonetcs..........KB8UYC=Kilo Bravo 8 Uniform Yankee Charlie....I am not saying that others cannot be used, but the original question was did I hear Military or ham and the answer to that was it was a MARS net

and from www.ac6v.com/dxphonetics.htm:

STANDARD NATO PHONETIC ALPHABET

The ARRL and many other national entities recommend the NATO phonetics for Amateur Radio use as most Hams around the world recognize them. This alphabet dates from about 1955 and is approved by the International Civil Aviation Organization, the FAA and the International Telecommunication Union, and many National Amateur Leagues/Societies/Orgs. Note that different bodies prefer different spellings, so one also sees: Alfa Juliet Juliette Oskar Viktor]. As a matter of reference -- see URL:
http://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/NATO_phonetic_alphabet
NATO phonetic alphabet From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.

The NATO phonetic alphabet was developed in the 1950s to be intelligible (and pronounceable) to all NATO allies. It replaced other phonetic alphabets, for example the US military Joint Army/Navy Phonetic Alphabet ("able baker") and several versions of RAF phonetic alphabets. It is sometimes inappropriately referred to as International Phonetic Alphabet, which is actually the official name of an alphabet used in linguistics created in the late nineteenth century.

The NATO phonetic alphabet is now widely used in business and telecommunications in Europe and North America, and has been approved by ICAO for use in international civil aviation. It has been adopted by the ITU, (many radio operators will refer to the NATO phonetics as ITU phonetics). Although it consists of English words, its letter codewords can easily be recognized by speakers of languages other than English.

The NATO phonetic alphabet is generally understood by Amateurs in all countries. Used when giving your callsign or passing information that must be spelled out for clarity. For example, AC6V should sign ALPHA CHARLIE SIX VICTOR
A - Alfa
B - Bravo
C - Charlie
D - Delta
E - Echo
F - Foxtrot
G - Golf
H - Hotel
I - India
J - Juliet
K - Kilo
L - Lima
M - Mike
N - November
O - Oscar
P - Papa
Q - Quebec
R - Romeo
S - Sierra
T - Tango
U - Uniform
V - Victor
W - Whiskey
X - X-Ray
Y - Yankee
Z - Zulu

 

[newbie]

Also the alpabet phonetics that you heard are the ones that ALL amatuer radio operators use.
Eric

B.S. There are a several phonetic alphabets used by hams, especially
in non-English speaking areas.


Tom

I know we used a few diff versions in the years I was in the Marines.

W - Whiskey or Willie...
A few other letters changed over the years as well

 

[Scan-Denver]

As a radioman aboard a guided missile cruiser attached to a NATO taskgroup, only the NATO version was ever used at any time. I can't speak for the other services, but the U.S. Navy only uses the NATO version.

 

[racin06]

Thanks for the information. I continue to learn from this board. Thanks again.

 

[Dubbin]

As a radioman aboard a guided missile cruiser attached to a NATO taskgroup, only the NATO version was ever used at any time. I can't speak for the other services, but the U.S. Navy only uses the NATO version.

They have guided missle cruisers in Denver? :lol:

 

[Scan-Denver]

Yeah, didn't you know ? Where have you been ?? :lol:

 

[brandon]

Also search between 14.350 to 14.600, I have heard MARS nets with navy vessels doing ship-to-home phone patches. Quite interesting.

 

[KC4ZEX]

Ham or Military

What you heard was a Army mars net. The call prefix AAR is army AF would be airforce NNN is navy and marines. Their are several located just above the 75 meter band most are state an regional routine daily nets for training and administrative purposes. You will find a few more just above 40 meters from 7305 to about 7315. Most ph patch traffic is just below and above 20 meters.

 

[KD4UXQ]

Also the alpabet phonetics that you heard are the ones that ALL amatuer radio operators use.
Eric

B.S. There are a several phonetic alphabets used by hams, especially
in non-English speaking areas.


Tom

Military are taught to and should be using the NATO phoenetic alphabet that was posted here. It came from an International Agreement set forth in 1957. The NATO Phonetic Alphabet was developed to be intelligible (and pronounceable) to all NATO allies in the heat of battle. It replaced other phonetic alphabets, for example the US military "able baker" alphabet that was used during WWII.

You will hear them use other things, but that would not be what they are taught to do. Most military units are very strict about it and some are not. Also in the heat of battle you will hear most anything when the adrenalin kicks in.

The Amateur radio community also encourages it's use. You will hear many public service agencies use it, but most in the US use the one that goes Adam, Boy, Charles, Edward, etc.

 

[Waldo325mvfd]

I've got a mil comm for you 3.167.00. I coppied down some call signs "Tango Foxtrot", "Delta", and "hotel."

"Delta this is tango foxtrot over."

"Delta, goahead over."

"Delta notify Hotel we are Echo, Mike, Kelo, Charley. How copy."



"Delta Hotel. Tango foxtrot advises Echo, Mike, Kelo, Foxtrot. over."

"Hotel copy"

than every thing stoped. sounded like "Delta" was a army company and "Hotel" and "Tango Foxtrot" was air suport. also the signal was kind of distant. 8)

 

[Starion]

Thanks for sharing the frequencies. I was wondering what HF frequencies MARS uses. I myself is an amateur radio operator who uses strict military-like procedures even though I haven't been in the military.

 

[Waldo325mvfd]

Hay u sound kinda like me. exept dont have my lisence yet I will by summer. 8)

 

[kb2vxa]

Cutting through all the BS, those callsigns are Army MARS.

"B.S. There are a several phonetic alphabets used by hams, especially
in non-English speaking areas."

Correct, they tend to make them up as they go along and US hams working DX adopt the phonetics being used BY the DX to avoid confusion. The only "standard" part of it is the use of well known place names. US hams when not working DX tend more or less to stick to military standard.

Kilo bravo two victor x-ray alpha or king bravo two victoria x-ray africa makes little difference as long as the style matches that of the listener.

 

[webmissile]

Actually, we don't do a lot of phone patches anymore. Most regions have agreements with Red Cross etc. but primarily we support military traffic.

MARS is quickly adopting ALE and mt63, this will probably be the way we will establish nets and pass traffic going forward but we are always prepared to pass voice traffic in case we are not near digital equipment.

Won't touch the phonetics argument - we adhere to the military phonetics, our nets are extremely structured so everyone on the net knows exactly what is going on.

Check it out - you may find this is something you would like to get involved with.

73
Dave

 

[jhooten]

MARS cannot get in to big a hurry to adopt ALE with out making a large portion of the membership obsolete. Not all members have radios that can be computer controlled or the computer to control it. So unless MARS is going to start issuing ALE radios they are not going to have a lot of net participation.

MT63 while, I'm sure, is a fine mode, is another example of pushing some members out of the program. One can run pactor with a KAM and a Commodor 64. How is MARS going to be able to tell members they have to go out and buy a new gigahertz class pentium computer to retain their membership and expect to retain members? Besides yesterday PSK31 was the mode to beat all modes. Who knows what it will be tomorow.

Can't speak for the other service MARS programs, Army MARS needs some vision at the top and leadership that is willing to adapt to change. If the program continues to rest on it's past laurals and not continue to show value the army will continue to cut resources for the program. Then where will "we" be?

 

[webmissile]

Jhooten,

I think this is the point (your last para.), there is vision from the Navy MARS chief and staff. We experiment with digital modes constantly (FS-1052 etc.), both Navy and Army MARS have a large number of channels available for ALE. The PacTOR 1 network will probably remain for some time.

At this very moment, Codan has offered a deep discount to MARS members on their NGT model. I use the software based ALE package all the time, it reliably links and sends AMD's which is about all that hardware based radios will do but I also have some success with FS-1052 FTP, DTM and DBM messages, it is moving quickly towards 3g ALE AQC.

I understand that MARS members are (what?) unwilling to work on their soundcard digital skills but most members should have PacTOR and AmTOR and thus remain vital links in the network. I hate to say this but members who remain digitally challenged should review their commitment to emergency communications. MT63 has proven itself easy to use and exremely reliable in poor propagation, without going on a rant, there are ARQ versions coming soon and IZ8BLY will run on a low end PC with a standard soundcard - my interface cost about $5 (if you have even the slightest junk box).

But...ALE should be the focus. When we are really needed, ALE will provide interoperability to other agencies.

73
Dave