FCC Invites Comments on Amateur Radio-Related Petition for Rule Making

[AK_SAR]

In Field Camps we often will sit about a blazing woodstove and read a Part, or two aloud on Sundays, for the mental gymnastics, and to ward off boredom; for they contain much informative material as well as religious instruction---- *
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*My apologies, Mark Twain, ..................... Roughing It

You and Mark must hang around with a different crowd at your field camps. In the field camps I'm familiar with, we sat around discussing all sorts of stuff, none of which was from either the Bible or FCC. Mostly stuff that would not pass muster with the mods on this family oriented forum!

 

[Lauri-CoyoteFrostbite]

Hee hee............ !

When the bottle of Jack comes around the third time, the warm stove has been working its magic, you'd be right proud to sit amongs't us and sing the type of Hymns we know ! lol

 

[AK_SAR]

Emergency communications are supposed to be plain language for interoperability as per DHS.

That has nothing to do with ham radio.

The OP is about Ham radio used in emergency communications. First rule of AUXCOM is you don't self deploy, you only deploy when requested by an official emergency management agency. When/if ARES or RACES is asked to deploy by an emergency management agency, then they will be operating under the Incident Command System.

ICS is quite explicit that all communication is plain language. No Q codes, 10 codes, or whatever are permitted.

 

[N4GIX]

Where did you learn that BS from?

The question should be "when," the answer to which is fifty-six years ago.

 

[Lauri-CoyoteFrostbite]

Gentlemen, Gentleman


For what its worth, I was curious about that phonetics thingy too- so I did a quick text to my father *.

I regard him as a my Yoda of all things ham radio- (fortunately he doesn't read my posts in here... otherwise it would be "Yoda, Sir !... ")

"He (N4GIX) is right; the rules originally said plain English, letters and numerals..... if you wanted to clarify that you could then use phonetics"

End of text----

Minutes later he sent me the 1960's-something Part 97, but that is all antediluvian and meaningless to me. At some point the regulations eased up to the Part §97.117 codified today.

I personally don't think how a station ID's matters a pile of beans to the FCC- and I get that distinct, personal feeling from experience - they delight (maybe that's a tad too strong a term)- in the fact anyone ID's (like try being ID compliance with Pulse emission.)

Lauri

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Retired Air Force bird colonel, combat veteran- DFC, AM's, etc.... and a ham since he was 14
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[kb2crk]

The OP is about Ham radio used in emergency communications. First rule of AUXCOM is you don't self deploy, you only deploy when requested by an official emergency management agency. When/if ARES or RACES is asked to deploy by an emergency management agency, then they will be operating under the Incident Command System.

ICS is quite explicit that all communication is plain language. No Q codes, 10 codes, or whatever are permitted.

And you hit the nail on the head. I was not going to reply saying that has nothing to do with ham radio. ICS is very plain in its description and as Hams should not self deploy the rules of the official agency which falls under ICS. I learned about this within 2 weeks of joining my local CERT group.

 

[N4GIX]

"He (N4GIX) is right; the rules originally said plain English, letters and numerals..... if you wanted to clarify that you could then use phonetics"

Thank you Lauri. I am going to ask this as our net's weekly "Net Question" this evening.

 

[ipfd320]

i was taught in years doing the nets reason for phonetics is more of a clarity in sub standard conditions--as for say november in sub standard if you hear ember you would know its an (N) and so on

Come on how many times during field day someone rambles their call at 100 miles per hour and you only get 1 letter say (A) out of it so you come back to that station and ask for that station with alpha in the call try again slower and they had it to you in Phonetics great got it

I Understand the netics version is a bit long but honestly its better than these stations flying thru checkin in with the straight call

if someone says 10-4 im not gonna crusify him for saying that st least i know he has the message as 10-4 is the universal got message code in most places

like i said in a post reply above--im not a fan with the cw id since i dont do cw and i think its unfair for a non cw operator who is a net control being forced by someone that wants to change the rules to push out very qualified net non cw operators

 

[kc4jgc]

On regularly scheduled nets, check in procedures vary by area. Listen to the check in procedure during the net preamble.
For instance, in my area checking into local nets is simply stating call, name and city. Some of us have got into the habit of saying "This is...." (unkey to ensure no doubling) "KC4JGC, Steve, Virginia Beach, no traffic".

As I said other areas will vary. For instance, if I was in the Raleigh area and wanted to check into Central North Carolina Skywarn, I'd have to call NCS first: "WX4RDU" (unkey briefly) Kilo Charlie four Juliet Golf Charlie, Steve, (current location).

Back in my area, during a public service event, such as a race, we use tactical, then ID at the end of the exchange.
Me: "Mile four to net"
NCS: "Mile four"
Me: "First three male runners, one zero, two five, and three six have passed my location, KC4JGC"
NCS: "Copy first three male, one zero, two five and three six at mile four, WS9B net control."

I fail to see how proper identification at the end of an exchange hinders the flow of traffic. Then again, as a former Official Relay Station, Net Control Station and Assistant Net Manager as well as having participated in many public service events since being licensed in 1989, what the hell do I know, other than experience?

Can you imagine the cacophany of multiple automatic CW ID's at the same time? Or someone's automatic ID every few seconds? The net frequency would be unusable! How would that be accomplished? Adding a board in the HT/mobile with a switch to ID when required, increasing the cost of our equipment? A data bust at the beginning of every transmission containing the user's ID would be annoying as hell.

All is needed is net training. I vote to toss this NPRM.

 

[Lauri-CoyoteFrostbite]

"That has nothing to do with ham radio.".................ND5Y (Yesterday at 11:49 AM , #12 )


I'm puzzled.... everything here has had to do with Ham Radio. What am I missing ??

Lauri

 

[mancow]

Who cares? If the guy gives a call once an hour, once a day, or week, it's not like it matters anyway.

 

[mmckenna]

Who cares? If the guy gives a call once an hour, once a day, or week, it's not like it matters anyway.

The ham radio police knows! you know, those guys in the orange safety vests with the amateur radio badges?

But yes, I agree, who the *%#$ cares.

 

[AK9R]

Folks, let's get back to the discussing the petition. Does it have merit? Does it not have merit? What reasons do you have for your position?

 

[Lauri-CoyoteFrostbite]

.
This has been a fun topic, as such emotion charged things can do when they take on a life of their own.
In my own opinion, and as one that has been a pardner in a few Petition for Rule Making *- for all the above reasons- this one was RDOA- 'really dead on arrival. '

That 25 wpm code ID'ing alone shows the Petitioner's ignorance of the law. That is something that demonstrates their lack of thought that went into writing this thing. In a serious arena, you don't go throwing out ham-hand'd ideas and expect them to receive serious consideration.


Thank you W9BU, for bring everyone's feet back to earth

Lauri

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* I was part of one years ago, and the process taught me quite a lesson in the FCC bureaucracy. As an innocent college student, I and some friends decided to petition the the FCC to add an additional class of license- a "low speed Extra class"-- tho we called it something else; the name of which is now lost to time. We thought it made perfect sense-
If you were a General or Advanced Class with an already 13 wpm credit (like we did- petitions can be so self serving ,) by passing just the written portion of the Extra Class exam, you'd gain Extra Class 'phone privileges, sans the code sub bands.
Why, we argue'd, did you need 20 wpm of code speed to talk on phone? We referred to the new two types of Extras as "Extra Lite" and "Extra Heavy"- sort'a like beer... We didn't call it that in our FCC petition, but it probably wouldn't have hurt our Snow-ball's Chance-in-H proposal.

In those days you had to submit multiple copies of your petition- one for each Commissioner, one for the Chair, the Co-Chair..and probably one for each member of the janitorial staff as well. The huge package of papers was sent off to the Government, and in time, it was duly assigned a "RM" number. Then later a "Notice of Rule Making" or whatever, was published..... afterwards it all languished interminably in some file cabinet (picture the closing scene of the warehouse in the movie Raider's of the Lost Ark.)


One day when I had quite forgot it, we received a letter. It was rejected- with no further explanation- they had simply rejected it- end of story.
Years later, and miles wiser, I got suck'd into co-author'ng another hair brained (tho not at the time, or so it seem'd to us)- petition. It flopped at first blush too.
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Today I earn my bread as an over paid government spokes-woman for many things technical. A good portion of my energy is officially spent on the Cocktail DC circuit (did That Censorship bugger chop my word up Again !?... Yes it did !... Awwww, geeez--confused? think 'Rooster tail.')


Believe me, on these 'circuits' I have heard far worse, far more Mickey Mouse ideas to change our way of life than this RM-11826.... and these ideas are coming from supposedly serious, intelligent people.


Be very thankful that everything we think we want we don't get
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