helicopter and multiple units near perimeter mall

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alex4659

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Around approximately 4pm this afternoon, my friend witnessed multiple units speed passed by him and seconds later, a helicopter circles not more than a couple hundred feet. This happened over/near perimeter mall and he also stated that the air space was restricted and he noticed planes circling around and away.

Anyone know what this was about or hear any radio comms?
 

CapStar362

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Restricted airspace? yet no TFR has been filed for Atlanta Center? nor any NOTAM's from Atlanta Center....

no media in Atlanta has any incidents occurring in our around Perimeter mall, which is like 5-10 miles due north of KPDK. if anything, local media would have something, for such a high level of activity. i find nothing.

was the bird black and this tail Code: N90DK or N91DK? or is Perimeter in Gwinnett?

this bird here: https://www.flickr.com/photos/rcsadvmedia/5618485722/


you say planes circling around and away? being KPDK is due north of Perimeter mall, but winds today were mostly from the north, they would be approaching KPDK toward 02R and leaving 02R and usually immediate right turn after 1500 AGL. i doubt any area restrictions were in place... else you would see them on the FAA databases, as either TFR's or NOTAM's there are 0-zero for today in the Atlanta area, even the entire Atlanta Center has 0 - ZERO TFR's
 

CapStar362

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Someone was probably out taking pictures in public.

like this guy?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1mx8_1MI4Fk


hmmmm lets see, those glasses

Whoops!

AFI 36-2903: 6.3.2.1. Eyeglasses/Sunglasses/Contact Lenses - Faddish styles and mirrored lenses are prohibited.

got you on public video now violating AF Apparel Code.

General Order 1, Sub 1 and 2

Gen Order 1.

1. I will guard everything within the limits of my post and quit my post only when properly relieved.

(1) The guard is responsible for everything that occurs within the limits of his post while he is on duty. He is also responsible for all equipment and property located within the limits of his post. The exact limits of his post are defined by special orders. The special orders should also include every place a guard must go to perform his duties. (2) A guard investigates immediately every unusual or suspicious occurrence on or near his post provided he does not have to leave his post to do so. If necessary, the guard will contact the commander of the relief for instructions.

Whoops! BIG NO NO! UCMJ time!!

Violation of General Order 1. Part 1: he left the perimeter of Dobbins to investigate a citizen doing something 100% Legal. outside of his limits.

Part 2: left his post to leave the boundaries of the airbase perimeter. for again, a citizen doing something perfectly legal.



what was he going to be shooting?


this: https://www.google.com/maps/@33.920...ata=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sjvMxWf-qshn1gmrNlWZvbQ!2e0


Where did he start shooting and filming...

Here: https://www.google.com/maps/place/D...2!3m1!1s0x88f5113444b33d8d:0xdcacd555ae67043b

walked down the street towards that B-29, but only got 1/4 way when the above video happened.






Perimeter Mall is in DeKalb. Ashford-Dunwoody/I-285 area. Maybe a mockup practice?
Larry

i know where the mall is by Street, just unsure of by county line.

i could see that, but a NOTAM would be in place still. TFR for official emergencies can be put up in as little as 30 minutes. NOTAM's are used for scheduled Drills.
 

rapidcharger

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like this guy?

Yep.
Or this guy DHS detains and batters Cameraman JC Playford - YouTube

or this guy Inspector General @ the Polk County Prison - YouTube
or this guy Photography is suspicious - YouTube
or this guy Illegal To Record Post Office - YouTube
or this guy Silent Treatment: Walking Between Highway and Power Plant - YouTube

Apparently photography is a crime now and they'll probably devote all of their air resources to capturing the person with the camera.
 

CapStar362

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i actually watch a lot of this stuff. the one cop screaming at the couple was hilarious, the Sergeant had to restrain one of his own!
 

alex4659

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i dont know anything except what my friend explained to me and his info wasnt that informative and sounded odd.

i was just trying to figure out what was going on and i was going to get back to him.
 

CapStar362

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ill give you a example alex.....

do you remember a couple months back, a F-15 Crashed in Virgina?


a TFR went up in 23 minutes 20 miles wide. no media.... no one in the air was allowed in the area except LEO, USAF Rescue and CAP. upon discovering the exact location, that TFR was amended to a 5 Mile Zone. Media could approach ( crappy views though ) and still only CAP, USAF and LEO allowed in. when the Site was secured and Kin notified, the TFR was again amended for 1 mile. allowing media to get views of the salvage.


anything involving air traffic and the potential for near collisions and in the areas of any airports ( 5 miles ) Official events or drills MUST be declared to the FAA so they can NOTAM the area to all traffic. Pilots make it THEIR responsibility to read any and ALL NOTAM's issued along their flight plans.
 

ff-medic

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i actually watch a lot of this stuff. the one cop screaming at the couple was hilarious, the Sergeant had to restrain one of his own!

Does Military Law Enforcement and those service people acting in an official security capacity ( Gate Security ) have jurisdiction and or authority....... within a certain distance outside the Military gate & fence perimeter? I believe they do if memory serves me correct.

FF - Medic !!!
 

ff-medic

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like this guy?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1mx8_1MI4Fk


hmmmm lets see, those glasses

Whoops!

AFI 36-2903: 6.3.2.1. Eyeglasses/Sunglasses/Contact Lenses - Faddish styles and mirrored lenses are prohibited.

got you on public video now violating AF Apparel Code.

General Order 1, Sub 1 and 2

Gen Order 1.

1. I will guard everything within the limits of my post and quit my post only when properly relieved.

(1) The guard is responsible for everything that occurs within the limits of his post while he is on duty. He is also responsible for all equipment and property located within the limits of his post. The exact limits of his post are defined by special orders. The special orders should also include every place a guard must go to perform his duties. (2) A guard investigates immediately every unusual or suspicious occurrence on or near his post provided he does not have to leave his post to do so. If necessary, the guard will contact the commander of the relief for instructions.

Whoops! BIG NO NO! UCMJ time!!

Violation of General Order 1. Part 1: he left the perimeter of Dobbins to investigate a citizen doing something 100% Legal. outside of his limits.

Part 2: left his post to leave the boundaries of the airbase perimeter. for again, a citizen doing something perfectly legal.



what was he going to be shooting?


this: https://www.google.com/maps/@33.920...ata=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sjvMxWf-qshn1gmrNlWZvbQ!2e0


Where did he start shooting and filming...

Here: https://www.google.com/maps/place/D...2!3m1!1s0x88f5113444b33d8d:0xdcacd555ae67043b

.

( 1 ) The sunglasses looked to me to appear to be PX / BX aviator sunglasses.

( 2 ) The " cameraman "'seemed to me to be a "'crap starter" . He goes to various Military instillations and photographs from outside the fence, which causes an event with " Base Law Enforcement". His actions, as evident by the video was to start problems and or a verbal altercation with the M.P.s , S.F and Master at Arms. McDill Air Force Base being one ( Special Operations Command ). Kudos to the few cops on their politeness, but do not let the "other guy / Perp "'get psychological control. I deal with similar situations at work when people Play ignorant with me, act like they do not speak English, prolong my tasks and efforts; make me waste time and effort. Some times you have to get verbally aggressive. If you believe it is going to turn into a physical altercation .......Call backup, for not only help ; but as a witness for you to help cover you, and two "'officers " there may prevent a physical altercation. And a physical altercation is something you try hard to a avoid.....while still maintaining psychological control.

Control the mind......the body most generally will follow - Study the Vietnamese treatment of American POWs during the Vietnam war. The "VC " broke the minds of American prisoners, destroying their mind - hope , and will to escape. And they only fed them what the Americans needed to stay alive. And there Was little nourishment and vitamins in the food the GI's had to eat. Weight loss - disease - dysentary.... Ect.

( 3 ) The guy taking the video ( crap starter ) could have been acting suspicious. Turning away or looking down when eye contact was made with him at a distance. The guy taking the video could have been dressed suspiciously.


FF - Medic !!!
 
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CapStar362

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sorry FF, but not the case here... Dobbins, the property ends at that fence line. there is no "extension" like eminent domain ruling here. i was told this during my CAP days.

he even says what he was filming, that white B-29. never did he film the Gate nor the sentries. if the plane is forbidden to photographed without consent from the USAF on a PUBLIC street, then i guess Google and the 1000's of tourists need to be detained and questioned, and media deleted. there is NOTHING within view considered a OPSec Violation from any of the streets surrounding Dobbins. i know this place very well. i have flown into Dobbins as CAP, i drove by there almost every day for YEARS! twice a day.

matter fact, let me show you something. in the comments of that video....


Post by me:

+militaryvetandfather but there is a fundamental problem with the above, he is only a MILITARY Police. anything OUTSIDE the grounds of the base he is stationed to, unless a DIRECT threat is perceived ( pointing a weapon, or attempted to access secured areas from means other than the gates and sentries ) are the ONLY time they can leave the grounds of the base. if it is OUTSIDE the base and poses NO direct threat as perceived by imminent violence and/or attempts of violence... HE CANNOT leave his post. he left his post... that is a violation of General Order #1. he should be punished under UCMJ and re-assigned from MP Duties to something irrelevant to the previous duties, discharged under a dishonorable category for violating the rights of a civilian and UCMJ of General Orders. he is also very obviously in violation of USAF Clothing code.


anything outside the base, MUST be forwarded to the local PD/SO of the bases location.


Reply by Retired MP: known as militaryvetandfather

militaryvetandfather
Yesterday 8:33 AM




+CapStar362
I wasn't going to take it that far however i was in the military police and you are correct.

need i say more?


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

regardless of the TYPE of glasses, the FINISH is forbidden.

AFI 36-2903

States - All Air Force members are required to adhere to standards of neatness, cleanliness, safety, and military image to provide the appearance of a disciplined service member when wearing the uniform. AFI 36-2903 expands this requirement by stating that to present the proper military image, clothing will be neat, clean, pressed, properly fitted, in good condition, zipped, snapped, or buttoned.

under Sub Section -

Eyeglasses and Sunglasses. Eyeglasses and sunglasses must be free of ornamentation on both the frames and the lenses. When indoors or in formation, eyeglasses must be conservative with clear, slightly tinted, or photosensitive lenses. When outdoors, sunglasses must have conservative lenses and frames; faddish styles and mirrored lenses are prohibited. Sunglasses are not permitted in formation. Eyeglasses and sunglasses must not be worn around the neck.






even further, like i posted on the video. go around to the Lockheed Assembly plant sides of Dobbins and their gates....

they have facial recognition cameras next to the regular video cameras. if you even walk by, it looks at you, as long as its not hitting a face shot, it ignores you.... but turn towards it.... 30 seconds tops, it now has your last known DL ID Photo, Address, Email(s), Phone Number(s), last known Passport Photo, age, DOB, sex, height and weight. all displayed on a screen in the gate. one click and they have any and all records of criminal activity you ever committed. that's if you are a GA resident. now lets leave GA.....

if you are not from Georgia, doesn't matter, they are tied in to GCIC, NCIC, and several federal coalition Intel databases coming from FBI, DEA, ATF, NSA, CIA.... ummm who else... ( did not post this ) i think Interpol, NATO and some allied Intel databases too. they will know who you are if you face one of those cameras and within a minute of you doing it.
 
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alex4659

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ill give you a example alex.....

do you remember a couple months back, a F-15 Crashed in Virgina?


a TFR went up in 23 minutes 20 miles wide. no media.... no one in the air was allowed in the area except LEO, USAF Rescue and CAP. upon discovering the exact location, that TFR was amended to a 5 Mile Zone. Media could approach ( crappy views though ) and still only CAP, USAF and LEO allowed in. when the Site was secured and Kin notified, the TFR was again amended for 1 mile. allowing media to get views of the salvage.


anything involving air traffic and the potential for near collisions and in the areas of any airports ( 5 miles ) Official events or drills MUST be declared to the FAA so they can NOTAM the area to all traffic. Pilots make it THEIR responsibility to read any and ALL NOTAM's issued along their flight plans.

no i do not remember that happening.
 

alex4659

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Messages
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sorry FF, but not the case here... Dobbins, the property ends at that fence line. there is no "extension" like eminent domain ruling here. i was told this during my CAP days.

he even says what he was filming, that white B-29. never did he film the Gate nor the sentries. if the plane is forbidden to photographed without consent from the USAF on a PUBLIC street, then i guess Google and the 1000's of tourists need to be detained and questioned, and media deleted. there is NOTHING within view considered a OPSec Violation from any of the streets surrounding Dobbins. i know this place very well. i have flown into Dobbins as CAP, i drove by there almost every day for YEARS! twice a day.

matter fact, let me show you something. in the comments of that video....


Post by me:




Reply by Retired MP: known as militaryvetandfather



need i say more?


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

regardless of the TYPE of glasses, the FINISH is forbidden.

AFI 36-2903

States - All Air Force members are required to adhere to standards of neatness, cleanliness, safety, and military image to provide the appearance of a disciplined service member when wearing the uniform. AFI 36-2903 expands this requirement by stating that to present the proper military image, clothing will be neat, clean, pressed, properly fitted, in good condition, zipped, snapped, or buttoned.

under Sub Section -

Eyeglasses and Sunglasses. Eyeglasses and sunglasses must be free of ornamentation on both the frames and the lenses. When indoors or in formation, eyeglasses must be conservative with clear, slightly tinted, or photosensitive lenses. When outdoors, sunglasses must have conservative lenses and frames; faddish styles and mirrored lenses are prohibited. Sunglasses are not permitted in formation. Eyeglasses and sunglasses must not be worn around the neck.






even further, like i posted on the video. go around to the Lockheed Assembly plant sides of Dobbins and their gates....

they have facial recognition cameras next to the regular video cameras. if you even walk by, it looks at you, as long as its not hitting a face shot, it ignores you.... but turn towards it.... 30 seconds tops, it now has your last known DL ID Photo, Address, Email(s), Phone Number(s), last known Passport Photo, age, DOB, sex, height and weight. all displayed on a screen in the gate. one click and they have any and all records of criminal activity you ever committed. that's if you are a GA resident. now lets leave GA.....

if you are not from Georgia, doesn't matter, they are tied in to GCIC, NCIC, and several federal coalition Intel databases coming from FBI, DEA, ATF, NSA, CIA.... ummm who else... ( did not post this ) i think Interpol, NATO and some allied Intel databases too. they will know who you are if you face one of those cameras and within a minute of you doing it.

I couldn't have explained it better my self!
 

rapidcharger

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This isn't really the right thread or the right room for this so I'll make it quick.
Looking suspicious isn't, the last I checked, illegal.
Loitering, however, is illegal in GA and until one reasonably dispels any alarm or concern over what they are doing, they are fair game for being detained for looking suspicious and be forced to identify.... In GA.

Funny because with all of the self proclaimed small government conservatives in office, there sure is a heck of a lot of big government overreach.
 

CapStar362

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so your saying rapid, taking photos of the B-29 is loitering? hmmmm..... guess i need to go turn myself in to Dobbins. <-- pfft
 

rapidcharger

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so your saying rapid, taking photos of the B-29 is loitering? )))

Yes, in the State of Georgia, if the cop wants to interpret it as such, it can be considered loitering or prowling under certain conditions.

((( hmmmm..... guess i need to go turn myself in to Dobbins. <-- pfft
Why, did you film a video too? Can I see it?
I'm not saying you committed a crime. But the officer can claim you are loitering if they are concerned you are threatening the safety of persons or property in the area and you do not dispel any alarm or immediate concern over what you are doing there. Even if you are out in public and you are doing a constitutionally protected activity. If they claim you are doing something that they believe is suspicious and possibly up to no good, you have to explain it and identify yourself or you risk taking the ride.

You might notice in those Jeff Gray/ Honor Your Oath videos that he always makes it clear that he's a "citizen journalist" and that he's "just out taking pictures in public" and that he's "gathering footage for a story" and that he has "no ill will nor ill intent." Now a number of us had long said it's time for a video where he doesn't explain what he's doing, but he would be risking arrest if he did not make it clear and dispel any alarm or concern the offers had. And he does so each and every time. In the states in which he operates, Florida and Georgia, these are stop and identify terry stop states. Looking suspicious is enough reason. Looking suspicious isn't illegal but it's enough reason to detain, question and ID someone. Refer to O.C.G.A. § 16-11-36
 
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