Looking for suggestion for better MSP recption

[Stevenme]

I've never been able to get good quality reception of MSP from my home location in Sharon, MA. I'm a licensed Ham, so I have a pretty good understanding of UHF propagation but I'm at a loss as to how to improve the audio quality I hear. I'm located in between simulcast locations in zone 5 of the MSP. Blue Hill to the North and the Wrentham site to the Southwest. Both are about the same signal strength.

I've tried stock on-scanner antennas as well as a discone in the attic, but nothing gives satisfactory results. The main issue affecting the readability of the audio seems to the simulcast nature of the system. Since no one site overpowers the other I get a constant scratching in the audio and signal dropouts that periodically close the squelch. To date the best quality audio I can get is by using the stock antenna and positioning the scanner (780XLT, 396XT) for maximum readability. Of course the problem is this is dependent upon which trunked frequency is being received and it's impossible to find a spot where all are readable. I have slightly better luck with zone 3, but it does not have all the TGIDs I want like H-PTL-3.

I know this is a common issue with this type of system, but it seems like I should be able to get better results from my location. Has anyone else tackled this problem, and if so, how?

 

[Laxplurr06]

I would try an antenna better suited for the band. A discone and a duck don't do very well on 800 especially if you have bad coax running to your antenna. A yagi antenna pointed at one of the sites will give you the best coverage. This might help because you are targeting one site rather then both. Also the more gain will help.

I personally rx zone 5 with full signal strength at my house in Norfolk. I also can hear everything just fine with out an antenna. Another to consider is that something may be interfering.

 

[fog]

I've always had a hard time receiving MSP, and think many people have. I've thought about buying a high-gain 800 MHz whip for my car, but right now I've just resorted to listening to a stream of the live feed (see Live Audio above if you're not familiar) through my cell phone. It's not a great solution and I miss out on all the juicy 'tactical' talkgroups that the live feeds aren't allowed to carry.

The times I have used a portable scanner, I have noticed what I think is considerable desense from cell towers. On the areas of the highway where I actually have a signal good enough to copy, it will disappear when I'm close to a cell tower. Makes me wonder if a good filter would help.

 

[Junior08]

Could it be interference from a nearby Nextel tower?

 

[Stevenme]

I've always had a hard time receiving MSP, and think many people have. I've thought about buying a high-gain 800 MHz whip for my car, but right now I've just resorted to listening to a stream of the live feed (see Live Audio above if you're not familiar) through my cell phone. It's not a great solution and I miss out on all the juicy 'tactical' talkgroups that the live feeds aren't allowed to carry.

The times I have used a portable scanner, I have noticed what I think is considerable desense from cell towers. On the areas of the highway where I actually have a signal good enough to copy, it will disappear when I'm close to a cell tower. Makes me wonder if a good filter would help.

I have better luck mobile, but I have seen the same desensing issue as you when passing by cell towers (800mhz, Nextel) when using an external antenna.

My home location issue has more to do with receiving multiple sites with similar signal strength. No one site is strong enough to cover the other so I get a constant scratching/whooshing that makes the transmission difficult and tedious to listen to.

Right now I've switched over to zone 3, which is easier for me to isolate a single site by moving the 780XLT and it's antenna around a bit. I have considered experimenting with a beam but I'd hate to spend a lot of time and money and not totally solve the problem.

 

[garys]

Could it be interference from a nearby Nextel tower?

You've obviously never been to Sharon. The Board of Selectmen have pretty much declared the town an RF free zone. They have traditionally given all of the cell companies fits when they try to build tower sites in that town.

That aside, I have no problems with MSP reception mobile or at home. At home I use an outside multi band scanner antenna mounted on my roof. I receive Zones 3, 5, and 8 most of the time. I'd recommend an antenna mounted outside if you can have one a discone in the attic is sub optimal.

 

[brscomm]

I would get an 800 MHz Yagi. You can spin it around until one site is stronger and most of the phasing noise will go away.

 

[zerg901]

I think if you check the Arizona forums that the guys out there found that directional antennas made reception much better for them. Peter Sz

 

[w2csx]

To me (and it's just a guess) it's almost like you are receiving 2 systems and the scanner doesn't always pick the stronger control channel. You say you are near zone 5, I would if you already don't program just the following into your scanner.

860.9875 CC-Primary
860.9625 CC-Alt & Voice
860.7375 Voice
860.7125 Voice
859.7125 Voice
858.9875 Voice & P25
857.9875 Voice & P25
857.7125 Voice
856.9625 Voice & CW ID
856.7125 Voice & CW ID

 

[zerg901]

http://forums.radioreference.com/vi...2515-loudoun-countys-new-radio-system-15.html

Scannerists are using directional antennas in Loudon County Virginia also

If you are in a border area between two different zones, then I guess that might be a whole nuther kettle of fish.

Peter Sz

 

[garys]

Givdn his location, it's possible that he's hearing two systems, although not likely that he's hearing two systems with the same channels. The MSP system is multi zone with different frequencies for each zone.

Depending on the type of scanner he's using, he's probably better off using control channel only.

I live anywhere from 2-8 miles from him depending on where in Sharon he lives. I use an ST-2 antenna mounted about 15 feet above my roof. I don't get no interference and good reception on three separate MSP zones, so I'll stick with my suggestion that a better antenna with good placement will help him improve his reception.

To me (and it's just a guess) it's almost like you are receiving 2 systems and the scanner doesn't always pick the stronger control channel. You say you are near zone 5, I would if you already don't program just the following into your scanner.

860.9875 CC-Primary
860.9625 CC-Alt & Voice
860.7375 Voice
860.7125 Voice
859.7125 Voice
858.9875 Voice & P25
857.9875 Voice & P25
857.7125 Voice
856.9625 Voice & CW ID
856.7125 Voice & CW ID

 

[ecps92]

BTW - Thanks to ScanNewEngland for the below Cut-n-Paste :twisted:

The Only other systems on 860.9875 are
02 - Ted Williams Tunnel [underground]
07 - Mt Greylock [Such a Long Long Long Shot]

It is likely he might be between [on the fringe] of two or more of the simulcast towers for Zone 5. Moving a few feet, changing antenna's, adding an outside antenna will/can make significant enhancements or worsen reception

Since Gary lives in the area, his answers are the best source. :wink:

However we are all talking to ourselves and answering [ ] since the OP has not logged back in since shortly after his original posting.

To me (and it's just a guess) it's almost like you are receiving 2 systems and the scanner doesn't always pick the stronger control channel. You say you are near zone 5, I would if you already don't program just the following into your scanner.

860.9875 CC-Primary
860.9625 CC-Alt & Voice
860.7375 Voice
860.7125 Voice
859.7125 Voice
858.9875 Voice & P25
857.9875 Voice & P25
857.7125 Voice
856.9625 Voice & CW ID
856.7125 Voice & CW ID

 

[zerg901]

Stevenme - did you get the problem solved? Peter Sz

 

[radioman2001]

Try a directional antenna in the horizontal position, or 45 deg off verticle, that may negate some of the phase noise.

 

[a_jones]

My in-vehicle reception of MSP was improved exponentially by running down to You-Do-It Electronics in Needham and picking up a Laird 800Mhz whip NMO antenna. The whip is about 2 inches long. Attached that to one of their pre-soldered NMO -> BNC cables, and I can finally hear the Staties talk. I'm down by Dedham, and before the switch I was only able to get them in H1 or H2.

I did, however, have to dedicate an entire scanner to them. My UHF antennas don't work all that well on 800.

The whip was cheap, too. I'd definitely recommend giving it a shot.

 

[N1BHH]

I use a UHF whip sometimes, in fact I have a Laird/Antenex UHF whip here at home on a steel shelf that works quite well at 800. In fact any UHF whip will be a half wave at 800. A 6 inch whip will present some gain at 800. Of course you could have gotten the ABSCAN which I use and have the ability to receive well over the entire VHF/UHF/800/900 spectrum. I'm getting another one in the future. I go to YDI quite a bit.