Morris County Project 25 Phase II configuration

[flippyflopper]

Getting the hang on efficiently programming and organizing. I've got an SDR running SDRTrunk B2 linked with RR and a SDS100 linked with Sentinel. My main questions are with respect to the Morris county P25 II. It seems from what i can tell in this thread "Morris County approves $26 million radio system upgrade" they are working on getting a 700MHz system up and running. Looks like its still in the works based on that thread and the note on the database page:

Latest News Update Posted on 2021-12-30 17:07:15
The 700 MHz cell is on the air in a limited capacity for testing only at this time.

1-Does everything get broadcast over both simultaneously?
2-Should I be programming both in the systems now?

Seems if they are identical right now that I would probably program one or the other to lower the amount of channels being scanned if they are redundant.

3-If that's the case I assume i would choose the UHF one since its the primary one that isn't still a work in progress?


The next thing i was a little confused by was all the various channels. I get the primary and alternates but ...
4-Do all the others need to be programmed as well?

RFSS	Site	Name	Freqs
1 (1)	005 (5)	UHF Simulcast	477.475	477.800	477.825	477.875	477.925	478.000c	478.075	478.150
			478.450a	478.475a	478.625	478.675
1 (1)	006 (6)	700 Simulcast	769.28125c	769.29375a	770.36875a	770.78125a	770.79375	771.28125	772.00625	772.38125
			772.39375	774.91875

I do it because its auto loading but i was just wondering their purpose. I've got to read up on how it all works, but I thought the control channel basically took care of it all. I'm wagering its my lack of understanding of the system mechanics. I just figured if i can lower the number of channels to scan it will increase efficiency.

My last questions are on how the talk groups are organized. the TGs seem to have multiple towns on the same talkgroup.
5-Are there really multiple towns on the same talk groups?
6-What are the numbers next to the towns listed?
7-Is there a way to subdivide the towns by those numbers when programming so it shows exactly what town is transmitting?

Police 1 - Chester Police (47), Mendham Borough (18), Mendham Township (19), Washington Township (38)
Police 2 - Dover (49), Mine Hill (20), Rockaway Borough (34), Wharton (39)
Police 3 - Mount Arlington (26), Netcong (28), Roxbury (36)
Police 4 - Chatham Borough (44), Chatham Township (45), Harding (13), Long Hill (30)
Police 5 - Morristown (24), Morris Township (22)
Police 6 - Randolph (32, Morris Plains (23)
Police 7 - Prosecutor (100-399), Sheriff (500-699), Sheriff Patrol/Fmr. Park Police (99), USDI (81)
Police 8 - Boonton Township (42), Mountain Lakes (25), Town of Boonton (41)

Thanks!

 

[APX8000]

UHF only at this time. 700 is affiliations and denials.

Yes, multiple towns on same talkgroup. Their municipal ID is how they identify over radio (Police only/Fire and EMS use plain language "Morristown Engine-1" as example).

The UID is the county "14" followed by the 2 digit town and then a 3 digit series depending on police, fire, ems, mobile or portable. For example 1422601 would be a Morris Twp Fire mobile. This is for NEW subscribers.

 

[flippyflopper]

@APX8000 Thanks for the reply! You'll have to excuse me as I'm brushing up on all of this so i have a few clarifications to ask.

UHF only at this time. 700 is affiliations and denials.

Not clear on what affiliations and denials are.

OK so they aren't mirror broadcasting over both.

So should I "Avoid" or remove the 700MHz channels until they are up and running? What i gather is we dont know when that will be yet. That would cut the channels scanned for the county in half for quicker pickup i would imagine.

The UID is the county "14" followed by the 2 digit town and then a 3 digit series depending on police, fire, ems, mobile or portable. For example 1422601 would be a Morris Twp Fire mobile. This is for NEW subscribers.

Is this just verbal or is there a way i can program or tag this in my scanner so it shows preciesely what town etc is transmitting rather than just the shared talk group?

I'll have to listen more closely but i don't remember hearing identifications on the police side during transmissions.

 

[lynchy135]

@APX8000 correct me where I am wrong here.

Not clear on what affiliations and denials are.

Affiliations are when radios try to connect to the system (700mhz in this case). Basically, requesting access to the system. The system will either let them in or not. The denial is when the system does not grant a radio access to it. I would venture to guess that only the radio tech's radios are allowed on 700mhz at this point.

So should I "Avoid" or remove the 700MHz channels until they are up and running? What i gather is we dont know when that will be yet. That would cut the channels scanned for the county in half for quicker pickup i would imagine.

There won't be real users on the 700mhz cell for a while, so at this point it is somewhat pointless to monitor it unless you want to listen to the radio techs.

Is this just verbal or is there a way i can program or tag this in my scanner so it shows preciesely what town etc is transmitting rather than just the shared talk group?

I don't have an SDS100, but I believe you can set Unit IDs, but its a per id basis, I don't believe (again, I don't own an SDS100) you can set a range of IDs as tag (ie 1422000-1422999 as Morristown)

 

[flippyflopper]

There won't be real users on the 700mhz cell for a while, so at this point it is somewhat pointless to monitor it unless you want to listen to the radio techs.

Doesn't sound super interesting. I'll just set it to permanent avoid but leave it all on the favorites list for when it clicks over.

I don't have an SDS100, but I believe you can set Unit IDs, but its a per id basis, I don't believe (again, I don't own an SDS100) you can set a range of IDs as tag (ie 1422000-1422999 as Morristown)

I'll have to dig into that and SDRTrunk to see. I just imported from Radio Reference for SDRTrunk and from Sentinel for the SDS without modifying anything. If anyone has the goods on programming that, feel free to chime in.

 

[GTR8000]

@APX8000 correct me where I am wrong here.
Affiliations are when radios try to connect to the system (700mhz in this case). Basically, requesting access to the system. The system will either let them in or not. The denial is when the system does not grant a radio access to it.

Common misconception, fueled by the (mis)use of the term with the so-called "non-affiliate scan" method. In fact, the process of the subscriber requesting access to the system is registration (logging onto the network). Affiliation is the process of the subscriber, once registration is complete, requesting a talkgroup at a particular site. The two processes happen within milliseconds of each other. Oh and yes, even single-site/cell systems require both registration and affiliation, to ensure that both the subscriber and talkgroup are valid.

In the case of the Morris system, the subscribers are often successfully registering on the 700 cell, but the talkgroup affiliations are being rejected because those talkgroups are not valid on that cell.

 

[APX8000]

I thought I said "700 is registrations, affiliations and denials..." 😬

 

[BIODTL1997]

Would anyone be so kind to share the banplan of the Morris System? I cant pull it in via unitrunker but I know I can get it on my moto radios, just haven't reprogrammed since the switch from Phase I.

Thanks!

 

[lynchy135]

Would anyone be so kind to share the banplan of the Morris System? I cant pull it in via unitrunker but I know I can get it on my moto radios, just haven't reprogrammed since the switch from Phase I.

Thanks!

Let me know if you need the channels page too.

 

[BIODTL1997]

That'll do it. Thanks man!

EDIT: Actually, I'll take the CH tab as well, if you dont mind...

 

[lynchy135]

 

[GTR8000]

just haven't reprogrammed since the switch from Phase I.

The UHF cell is still FDMA. Nothing will be TDMA until the 700 cell goes online, which won't be for a while.You're not missing anything.