Prince William County

[Chris45]

It seems something is possibly happening today - June 1, 2015. Where the PD was running good on Phase 1, and FD seemed to be in and out of Phase 1, now all is silent there. Phase 2 seems to have the PD Admin Channel which seems low power and garbled. Maybe things are just unusually quiet?

 

[yank108]

Chris,silence is not the word today or even now. My Home Patrol 2 is blowing up with activity.

 

[DavidNVA]

Chris,silence is not the word today or even now. My Home Patrol 2 is blowing up with activity.

I had wonderful reception of PWC from my home in Bristow for years but now it's really gone to hell. I thought maybe they made the switch to Phase 2 so I purchased a PRO-668 to go alongside my PSR-500. It still sounds like a horrible garbled mess. I've played with the DSPLevelAdapt settings, tried quite a few antennas ranging from the Radio Shack ducky, Larsen, cell phone mag mount and my attic mounted Scantenna along with various other changes to no avail. I pick up VA STARS loud and clear.

What gives? Did something change? I'm curious what your location is in the county? If the Home Patrol 2 is working, perhaps I'll sell both of these scanners and pick up one of those even though I hate the form factor.

Edit: I just noticed your location is Woodbridge, Now I'm wondering if anyone else is on the west side experiencing these issues?

 

[Chris45]

Hello,
I am no expert, but out of all the systems I listen to, Prince William has been the most difficult for me to adjust. Both of us received well for Phase 1, and there was a reply on this thread from a Home Patrol user in Woodbridge not having any reported issues. I am located by the Occoquan off Davis Ford Road in a low elevation which can weaken my signal.
I use the Whistler 1080 now, having had agonizing problems with the Uniden BCD436HP. No disrespect to Uniden users, but the latest BCD325P2 cannot handle Phase 2. It has been reported that it never included the narrow band filter necessary for Phase 2. The Uniden site on this forum is a reflection of countless problems, so many in fact, that they have arranged their space into areas of different problems.
One information site that may help you can be found at: Easier to Read Pro 668 - PSR800 Digital Scanner and EZ-Scan/iScan Software Manual
The PWC Phase 2 System is new and there are bugs that they will always be correcting as time goes on. In regards to the DSP Level Adapt, I see that the default is 64. I have been back and forth from 64 to the max of 250 trying to find the best setting. For all systems I use Global AGC. You may experiment and see if you can pick up Manassas and Manassas Park. I have great reception with them. Being at a lower than average elevation I am going out in the car with the 1080 and try adjustments again. If I have great results doing this, I will let you know.

 

[Chris45]

Just an update. The last hour I drove around Woodbridge using the Whistler 1080 set on Prince William, Manassas, and Manassas Park. With the DSP Level Adapt set at the default of 64, everything was received just fine. So my issue appears to be the old one, which is home location. This does not surprise me, because I had the same problem with Phase 1 when it was new. Over time Phase 1 greatly improved as they worked all the system bugs out. But by comparison, the PW system is a weakling when compared to Fairfax County, Metro Transit, and STARS. Maybe there are some differences between the PRS800 and WS 1080? All I can say for now is that when I move out of the valley the WS-1080 does it job with the PW system well. The other mentioned systems come in just fine at ALL locations. I talked with Joe at HRO in Woodbridge yesterday, and the have 2 WS 1080 scanners available.

 

[beastieboy101]

Just an update. The last hour I drove around Woodbridge using the Whistler 1080 set on Prince William, Manassas, and Manassas Park. With the DSP Level Adapt set at the default of 64, everything was received just fine. So my issue appears to be the old one, which is home location. This does not surprise me, because I had the same problem with Phase 1 when it was new. Over time Phase 1 greatly improved as they worked all the system bugs out. But by comparison, the PW system is a weakling when compared to Fairfax County, Metro Transit, and STARS. Maybe there are some differences between the PRS800 and WS 1080? All I can say for now is that when I move out of the valley the WS-1080 does it job with the PW system well. The other mentioned systems come in just fine at ALL locations. I talked with Joe at HRO in Woodbridge yesterday, and the have 2 WS 1080 scanners available.

The problem most people are having is Simulcast Distortion caused by the multiple different sites broadcasting on the same freq at the same time. I don't have much of a problem where I am located but I also live in far south east pwc. I believe there is a tower very close to me and it overpowers all the others. If someone else in pwc is located equal distance from many towers; they may need to get a directional antenna to point towards a tower to block the others. You may also try attenuation on the scanner. I haven't had that help at all yet. My Pro-668 works great on the PWC system from home; in a certain spot. I tried it while driving and it had a little trouble decoding on the pwc system at certain points on 95. It may have been improved since they just had a update on 6-4-15 to improve some bugs including the TDMA voice loudness problems. So far I like it on the phase 2 stuff. Just sold my PSR500 so I need to get used to the Pro-668.

 

[Chris45]

Points well taken

I appreciate your information, and hopefully David will be able to find a good reception point for his PRO-668 also. Radio Shack tune receivers and scanners are what I grew up on, and usually have proven themselves well. Actually my Pro-106 is my favorite experience. If has great sensitivity and I could get PWC as far out as Falls Church, VA on Phase 1. But I guess even that radio would suffer from Simulcast Distortion.

But my home location is low enough that I have to drive to a higher location just for the GPS to find a satellite. I do believe that thing will continue to improve as system bugs are worked out.

 

[Chris45]

I traveled a little more today with the WS-1080. It is also a good tool for discovering system dead spots as well. I regards to the DSP Level Adapt, I finally ran it on the 0 setting, and forgoing the dead spots, it performed real good. Go figure?

 

[DavidNVA]

I too appreciate the information and noticed once I move around a bit in the county things are a bit better, perhaps I just live in reception dead zone. One thing I did notice is that my PRO-668 displays DG and not D2, if I'm reading the easier to read manual linked in an above post correctly, this means that PWC is still Phase 1, correct?

 

[Chris45]

I do not honestly know. I used to run my RS Pro-106 for everything until about 2 weeks ago when PWC Fire and Police went dead. When I went to reload from the Radio Ref database, the request was rejected with the implication that PWC was now running on Phase 2. Unfortunately, the Pro-106 will not run Phase 2. I downloaded the RR latest onto the Whistler 1080, and after relentless experimental adjustments now receive what PWC is running on, which the Pro-106 no longer receives. So I strongly suspect Phase 2 operations. One thing is for sure. While at home you will have to locate the "sweet" spot where reception is best. Location is a present issue for most scanners. If it is Phase 2, I believe the system will improve in time, as system bugs and improvements are worked out.

 

[beastieboy101]

I too appreciate the information and noticed once I move around a bit in the county things are a bit better, perhaps I just live in reception dead zone. One thing I did notice is that my PRO-668 displays DG and not D2, if I'm reading the easier to read manual linked in an above post correctly, this means that PWC is still Phase 1, correct?

I am 100% sure that PWCPD has never gone Phase 2. Not even patched to Phase 2. All the PD & Fire traffic continues to be Phase 1. ONLY the PWC School Buses & School Security are using Phase 2. Radio Techs are increasingly testing the system and have used Encryption and Phase 2 at times. Mostly during M-F 9-5.

It may seem like the system is dead at certain points in the day. This may have been due to signal loss or something internal with the scanner missing a brief transmission. As long as the "T" on my Pro-668 is flashing or lit; I know I am getting a good signal to decode.

I agree that location is a big issue with the signal degrading and decoding the CC properly. I frequently notice signal loss if I have the scanner too close to any other electronic device plugged in to the wall. Unplugging a handheld scanner from the wall and using battery power may help some people with low signals or simulcast distortion. When STARS was first coming online I would have to unplug my Pro-96 and use battery power to pick up distant towers. This was all done while walking all around my house trying to find that sweet spot. Easy to do if you know the CC freq and can lock on it with squelch all the way down. With my Pro-96 in the perfect position I could even listen in to DCMPD before encryption all the way from Woodbridge in 2007/2008.

 

[Chris45]

Both Yank108 and I totally lost all traffic on our scanners. When I went to the RR Site to download PWC for my Pro-106, the site refused indicating that PWC was now Phase 2. Maybe RR is packing us with sand or something else? I will go back into the program tomorrow and look for changes using the latest data for PWC. I am getting 5 to 6 Bars on the signal reception, but absolutely no audio on PWC. Fairfax, STARS, and all others on the Pro-106 are running perfectly. Thanks for the info!

 

[fredva]

When I went to the RR Site to download PWC for my Pro-106, the site refused indicating that PWC was now Phase 2. Maybe RR is packing us with sand or something else?

It appears that if any part of a system is Phase II - school buses, utilities, police TAC channels, etc., RadioReference flags it as a Phase II system in the database. Which means software for Phase 1 scanners will not download any data about the system from RR.

I had to deal with this situation a couple of weeks ago in preparation for a trip to Tennessee. The Tennessee TACN system is labeled as Phase 2, so I could not download any talkgroups or sites for my PRO-18. The primary dispatch talkgroups for the THP are Phase 1 and in the clear, while secondary dispatch talkgroups are Phase 2 and encrypted. So I copied and pasted the control channel frequencies for TACN sites along my route of travel, and manually entered talkgroup ids for the areas' THP primary dispatch channels. Once in the state, I picked up a decent amount of traffic, so the process worked.

 

[Chris45]

Experimentation today with my Pro-106 confirmed that PWC is not fully operational on TDMA Phase 2. I was able to restore both Fire and PD reception on the Pro-106 by manually entering the new talk groups that can no longer be downloaded via the RR on-line database. Seems a shame that because school buses and non-emergency services being Phase 2, would cut the rest of us off when it comes to emergency communications. So keep in mind that you can manually copy the current PWC data for Phase 1 from the database, and spend half a day updating your radio! And apparently some of the new talk groups are still being discovered.

 

[beastieboy101]

Had Pro96Com on the PWC P25 system today and noticed lots of weird stuff going on.

Earlier today (about 1500) I heard the PWC Radio Techs talking to the Fairfax Co. Radio Techs on talkgroup 4001. Just a few minutes after that the 65xxx group of talkgroups began being used.

65222 was Fairfax County Fire 4A Dispatch
65242 was Fairfax County Fire 4B Response

Didn't hear the voice traffic from the others in the 65xxx range; was away from pc at the time.

 

[gesucks]

look at the raw log and see if it was an ISSI talkgroup, If so it will show the WACN SYS for Fairfax with that talkgroup. Not sure how Mike has PRO96COM set up to deal with ISSI calls

 

[beastieboy101]

look at the raw log and see if it was an ISSI talkgroup, If so it will show the WACN SYS for Fairfax with that talkgroup. Not sure how Mike has PRO96COM set up to deal with ISSI calls

What is a ISSI talkgroup?

The PWC system has showed the Fairfax system as an adjacent site for a few weeks now. Can tell that because of the CC freq and the NAC listed.

 

[beastieboy101]

Heard the techs doing some testing on OESPS 6 & 7 this afternoon. Sounded like they were testing voice counts and I also heard some two tone fire pager tones. Is it possible to do fire tones over trunked radio? I am thinking it is automated.

 

[ironace]

Pro-96

So I turned on my Pro-96's for the first time in a couple of months and I noticed that I don't seem to be getting any traffic. They worked previously so my questions are..... What changed, what can I do to make them work for PW again? If it helps any I have Win96, programming cables and a sub to RR... and will buy arc96 if I have to.

Thanks in advance for any help.

 

[beastieboy101]

Does anyone know why the Prince William Co system is continuously broadcasting Fairfax Co. Fire 4B on different/changing talkgroup numbers?

I have a wildcard talkgroup setup for the PWC system for new talkgroups being used by PWC. The Fairfax Fire 4B talkgroup is constantly changing talkgroup numbers. Usually in the 64xxx and 65xxx range. I have to repeatedly store the wildcard and then lock it out. But it keeps changing every few minutes; making it extremely annoying to PWC listeners with a wildcard.