Problems listening to railways and questions on how railways use radios

[SA_tx_88116]

I’ve been listening to my local UP owned railway routes for quite a while now (6 months) and I’ve been meaning to ask why I can’t hear trains the towers come in clearly but trains often come in with static or noise or they come in very faintly the frequencies I listen to are in the San Antonio Texas area and cibolo I listen to the following frequencies: 160.515

UP27 Austin

Bracken to Tower 105

160.740

UP42 Austin

Round Rock to Bracken

160.515

UP27 Glidden

Cibolo to Kirby

And also can someone explain to me what railroads use radios for I hear the towers calling out trains at certain mile markers like up188 and then say a bunch of other stuff stuck as track switches ect.

 

[ElevatorsAndRadios]

Railroad radio systems in the US are usually simplex. The trains are talking to remote bases on transmitter sites that typically cover a wide area. You hear the dispatcher because they are transmitting from a site offering wide area coverage, but you do not hear the train because you are not in range of the train. With little exception, railroad communications are not repeated. If you want to increase your reception, you will need an external antenna and a more sensitive radio. Or, you can get closer to the tracks! Inherently, radios are a good way of telling if a train is nearby. If you hear both ends of the conversation clearly, you are near a train!

 

[SA_tx_88116]

Railroad radio systems in the US are usually simplex. The trains are talking to remote bases on transmitter sites that typically cover a wide area. You hear the dispatcher because they are transmitting from a site offering wide area coverage, but you do not hear the train because you are not in range of the train. With little exception, railroad communications are not repeated. If you want to increase your reception, you will need an external antenna and a more sensitive radio. Or, you can get closer to the tracks! Inherently, radios are a good way of telling if a train is nearby. If you hear both ends of the conversation clearly, you are near a train!

Sometimes they play a tone what does this mean?

 

[Ace9133uwu]

Sometimes they play a tone what does this mean?

The tone you hear means a train dialed the dispatcher and is trying to call them. It's basically like a "phone call". They punch in a (usually) 3-digit code on their engine radio. They can also call up mechanical help desks, PTC (Positive Train Control) help desks, and the like depending on what's going on in the field.
What type of scanner or radio and antenna do you have? Moving your equipment closer to a window can typically help. Like ElevatorsAndRadios above said, an external outdoor antenna will greatly help, and these can usually be found fairly cheap on websites like ScannerMaster, The Antenna Farm, Buy Two Way Radios, R&L Electronics, and Zipscanners. Just do some research! I personally use the newly released Wouxun KG-Q10H and a professional Laird EXH160SFU antenna for mobile & field usage and this pairing is exceptionally great. The aforementioned Wouxun was purchased on Buy Two Way Radios, and the Laird antenna was purchased at The Antenna Farm.

 

[Ace9133uwu]

Also, here are some important frequencies to have in your radio. These channels will tell you if a train is close to you. These are the HOTD (Head of Train Device), EOTD (End of Train Device), DPU (Distributed Power Unit) channels 1-4 which are broadly used US-wide.
452.9375 - HOTD (Locomotive)
457.9375 - EOTD (Rear of train)
452.925 - (DPU Channel 1)
452.950 - (DPU Channel 2)
457.925 - (DPU Channel 3)
457.950 - (DPU Channel 4)
Typically, the only thing you'll hear is a short "chirp", or data burst. No voice. The strength, or loudness of this burst usually determines how close or far away a train is from you.

Edit: typo.

 

[SA_tx_88116]

Thanks this stuff really helps

 

[SA_tx_88116]

Also, here are some important frequencies to have in your radio. These channels will tell you if a train is close to you. These are the HOTD (Head of Train Device), EOTD (End of Train Device), DPU (Distributed Power Unit) channels 1-4 which are broadly used US-wide.
452.9375 - HOTD (Locomotive)
457.9375 - EOTD (Rear of train)
452.925 - (DPU Channel 1)
452.950 - (DPU Channel 2)
457.925 - (DPU Channel 3)
457.950 - (DPU Channel 4)
Typically, the only thing you'll hear is a short "chirp", or data burst. No voice. The strength, or loudness of this burst usually determines how close or far away a train is from you.

Edit: typo.

Question what modes or squelch codes do these frequencies use?

 

[ENGINEERCARL1]

Question what modes or squelch codes do these frequencies use?

FM, Likely Narrow FM with those splinter frequencies. Try both.

 

[AK9R]

Also, here are some important frequencies to have in your radio. These channels will tell you if a train is close to you. These are the HOTD (Head of Train Device), EOTD (End of Train Device), DPU (Distributed Power Unit) channels 1-4 which are broadly used US-wide.
452.9375 - HOTD (Locomotive)
457.9375 - EOTD (Rear of train)
452.925 - (DPU Channel 1)
452.950 - (DPU Channel 2)
457.925 - (DPU Channel 3)
457.950 - (DPU Channel 4)
Typically, the only thing you'll hear is a short "chirp", or data burst. No voice. The strength, or loudness of this burst usually determines how close or far away a train is from you.

Edit: typo.

The short data burst will not be decodable by any consumer-grade scanner, but hearing them alerts railfans to a locomotive or train being nearby.

@SA_tx_88116 When you add these channels to your scanner, select Narrow FM with carrier squelch, i.e. no tone or squelch code. For that matter, none of your railroad channels should be programmed with a tone or squelch code.

 

[Ace9133uwu]

FM, Likely Narrow FM with those splinter frequencies. Try both.

Really the only usage of splinter channels by class one’s is yard usage. Same with carrier tones. One good example is CSX’s North Baltimore intermodal facility. They use one splinter channel (AAR 129), as well as a 203.5PL tone yard-wide. That said, typically mainline operations won’t need to use splinter channels if their road/dispatch/auxillary were always on the original AAR bandplan (pre-2013) and were also left unchanged post rebanding.

I program all my equipment NFM (Narrowband FM) because it more or less “stabilizes” the reception. Makes it louder and clearer than standard FM modulation.

Lastly, I agree with AK9R. I suppose I could’ve clarified a little more on the HOT/EOT/DPU channel usage. There are ways to decode the data bursts using software on your computer, but that’s way outside of my wheelhouse considering I’ve never attempted it nor have no desire to.

Edit: typo 🤔

 

[Ace9133uwu]

Another thing you may hear about is the digital mode NXDN. There are some recent posts on this forum indicating that two railways are looking into partial usage. As railfans and/or monitoring enthusiasts we don’t particularly need to worry about NXDN being implemented on class one mainlines. Or class 2 regionals or class 3 shortlines. Generally the only NXDN that we see being used is in-yard operations by yard workers, security, and even railroad police system wide. I live fairly close to Norfolk Southern’s Gest St. yard, Sharonville yard and CSX’s Queensgate yard. I don’t hear any NXDN (or splinter channel) usage.

 

[KevinC]

Adding a FM broadcast might also help you receive the weaker stations as noted in one of your other threads...

Interference issues

I think I’m getting interference while listening to my radio especially on VHF frequencies the thing I could be listening to can be very far away but the radio still says I have good signal. I live right by a 4G cell tower and some other tower not to far away with orange and white panels...

forums.radioreference.com

 

[Ace9133uwu]

Adding a FM broadcast might also help you receive the weaker stations as noted in one of your other threads...

Interference issues

I think I’m getting interference while listening to my radio especially on VHF frequencies the thing I could be listening to can be very far away but the radio still says I have good signal. I live right by a 4G cell tower and some other tower not to far away with orange and white panels...

forums.radioreference.com

What do you mean by “adding an FM broadcast”?

 

[KevinC]

What do you mean by “adding an FM broadcast”?

Ha! FM broadcast filter. Thanks for catching that.

 

[Ace9133uwu]

Ha! FM broadcast filter. Thanks for catching that.

Aha, now that makes sense. In the thread you linked, OP states he uses a Pro-197, which of course is more of a “legacy” unit, would a band filter even be worth the trouble or be effective?

 

[KevinC]

Aha, now that makes sense. In the thread you linked, OP states he uses a Pro-197, which of course is more of a “legacy” unit, would a band filter even be worth the trouble or be effective?

In my opinion the 197 and its equivalents are excellent conventional scanners once you filter out the FM broadcast band.

 

[Ace9133uwu]

In my opinion the 197 and its equivalents are excellent conventional scanners once you filter out the FM broadcast band.

I’ve got the WS1065 and typically keep it on severe weather standby, so I’ve never exactly needed to band filter or band pass, but it might be worth looking into. Ahh, how the turns have tabled. 🤔

 

[SA_tx_88116]

The short data burst will not be decodable by any consumer-grade scanner, but hearing them alerts railfans to a locomotive or train being nearby.

@SA_tx_88116 When you add these channels to your scanner, select Narrow FM with carrier squelch, i.e. no tone or squelch code. For that matter, none of your railroad channels should be programmed with a tone or squelch code.

I like to put it on search because I’ve caught them using PL tones before

The tone you hear means a train dialed the dispatcher and is trying to call them. It's basically like a "phone call". They punch in a (usually) 3-digit code on their engine radio. They can also call up mechanical help desks, PTC (Positive Train Control) help desks, and the like depending on what's going on in the field.
What type of scanner or radio and antenna do you have? Moving your equipment closer to a window can typically help. Like ElevatorsAndRadios above said, an external outdoor antenna will greatly help, and these can usually be found fairly cheap on websites like ScannerMaster, The Antenna Farm, Buy Two Way Radios, R&L Electronics, and Zipscanners. Just do some research! I personally use the newly released Wouxun KG-Q10H and a professional Laird EXH160SFU antenna for mobile & field usage and this pairing is exceptionally great. The aforementioned Wouxun was purchased on Buy Two Way Radios, and the Laird antenna was purchased at The Antenna Farm.

also what is the name of the job for the people in the towers that control trains in an area or city?

 

[SA_tx_88116]

In my opinion the 197 and its equivalents are excellent conventional scanners once you filter out the FM broadcast band.

How exactly do you band filter?

 

[Ace9133uwu]

I like to put it on search because I’ve caught them using PL tones before

also what is the name of the job for the people in the towers that control trains in an area or city?

Sometimes, and I mean sometimes, especially if you’re near a yard or terminal they will use PL tones on yard/terminal channels.
If you’re talking about yard towers, they’re typically the yardmasters. If you mean switch tower interlockings, towers like that haven’t been manned since the 80’s, early 90’s. Now days they’re controlled remotely by the subdivision dispatcher.