Programing a Trunked radio for monitoring only

[scanningisfun]

I know it would be cool to have an actual radio---but if you can have a scanner that works just as well, why not use the scanner? I was on the side of the radio until I realized the scanner will work fine. The digital P25 decoding on uniden scanners is fine to me. You can understand it and there is no risk of transmitting at all.

 

[Skypilot007]

I know it would be cool to have an actual radio---but if you can have a scanner that works just as well, why not use the scanner? I was on the side of the radio until I realized the scanner will work fine. The digital P25 decoding on uniden scanners is fine to me. You can understand it and there is no risk of transmitting at all.

It is cool ! I have plenty of scanners too, they have their uses. For me I always used motorola radios as scanners from way back when everything was simple and conventional, they just work better for what I needed. Why let these trunking systems spoil my fun.

 

[batwingtech]

One of the problems with using a P-25 trunked radio as a RX only radio, is that the radio has to affiliate, and you use system resources to do your scanning, and during an event, depending on how many voice channels are available, you may be using resources that may be needed during an emergency for first responders. It's better to listen with a scanner, that doesn't require affiliation to the system.

 

[scanningisfun]

One of the problems with using a P-25 trunked radio as a RX only radio, is that the radio has to affiliate, and you use system resources to do your scanning, and during an event, depending on how many voice channels are available, you may be using resources that may be needed during an emergency for first responders. It's better to listen with a scanner, that doesn't require affiliation to the system.

Did you read the thread? That was already stated a lot.

 

[scanningisfun]

What actually happens when you do get caught? Really big fine?

 

[mm]

How are you going to get caught if you don't transmit and you cannot transmit any RF ?

I was one of the individuals who wrote one of the original articles on batlabs, along with Elroy Jetson, about using an XTS5000 to monitor a 700/800 trunking systems a few years ago.

The radio used for our Phoenix systems tests had it's Output LDMOS power amplifier and its driver amplifier IC removed during the trial tests and the VCO output stage was loaded with a 50 ohm 10 dB attenuator pad made from chip resistors just to keep the VCO stable and the radio still tracked the Phoenix AZ system during the test just fine.

There wasn't even -60 dBm of power coming out of the radio no matter what the state of the radios TX Inhibit was set to, nothing to detect and nothing to affiliate with.

The only problem with a XTS or similar radio used to monitor a trunk system was that your locked with scanning 1 trunk system and 10 talkgroups, my tests years ago were only for a theoretical question as to whether it could be monitored safely and it could.

Unfortunately or maybe more fortunately, there are no P25 systems anywhere near my new QTH and I don't have any radios to play with anymore.


Mike

 

[scanningisfun]

How are you going to get caught if you don't transmit and you cannot transmit any RF ?

I was one of the individuals who wrote one of the original articles on batlabs, along with Elroy Jetson, about using an XTS5000 to monitor a 700/800 trunking systems a few years ago.

The radio used for our Phoenix systems tests had it's Output LDMOS power amplifier and its driver amplifier IC removed during the trial tests and the VCO output stage was loaded with a 50 ohm 10 dB attenuator pad made from chip resistors just to keep the VCO stable and the radio still tracked the Phoenix AZ system during the test just fine.

There wasn't even -60 dBm of power coming out of the radio no matter what the state of the radios TX Inhibit was set to, nothing to detect and nothing to affiliate with.

The only problem with a XTS or similar radio used to monitor a trunk system was that your locked with scanning 1 trunk system and 10 talkgroups, my tests years ago were only for a theoretical question as to whether it could be monitored safely and it could.

Unfortunately or maybe more fortunately, there are no P25 systems anywhere near my new QTH and I don't have any radios to play with anymore.


Mike

According to the smart people near the beginning of the thread, you have to affiliate with P25 trunking systems which means they will see your radio on their system. When they see some random RID you will get into trouble.

 

[mm]

Easter Bunny, Santa Claus, Great Pumpkin whatever they want to think they can but thinking and doing it are entirely different.

The only reason that I removed the RF devices from the test radio was because the LDMOS power transistor was already damaged and my friend asked if the radio would work without the transmitter working and I of course just had to find out so I decided to remove the driver IC and use this radio for our tests but you can also use a method mentioned by Elroy which is less obtrusive to the radio.

My tests were done as I said from a challenge question asked by a friend at an unnamed agency down in Phoenix who asked if it could be done and the Easter Bunny wasn't even around to supervise us.

 

[Seadoo]

MM, Besides being a very very hot topic for me and many system admins, In order for your radio to trunk a p25 system, unlike the legacy trunking motorola systems, The radio must affiliate with a p25 system to trunk, if you remove the transmitter part of the system, then obviously it cant transmit hense no affiliation. Stick to a scanner as mentioned before, because all you will end up with is a bricked radio, And belive me, if they are anything like me which I know a few radio system admins, it will get bricked. Not trying to flame you, but please stick to a scanner.

 

[exkalibur]

In order for your radio to trunk a p25 system, unlike the legacy trunking motorola systems, The radio must affiliate with a p25 system to trunk,

Not trying to flame you, but that is simply NOT true. It is not a requirement of a P25 radio to affiliate with the system in order to receive. There's been a few threads in here explaining it. Elroy Jetson provided the information on how to do this.

 

[Skypilot007]

One of the problems with using a P-25 trunked radio as a RX only radio, is that the radio has to affiliate, and you use system resources to do your scanning, and during an event, depending on how many voice channels are available, you may be using resources that may be needed during an emergency for first responders. It's better to listen with a scanner, that doesn't require affiliation to the system.

The radio doen't have to affiliate to receive transmissions if you know how to program the radio properly. Therefore no system resources are used ever. The radio is invisible to the system.

 

[wa1emt]

its funny how this guy asks the same question i did a while back..he gets flame kissed and i got lit up like the 4th of july....wow...guess it depends on who is on radio po-po duty....

 

[James_Bond_007]

its funny how this guy asks the same question i did a while back..he gets flame kissed and i got lit up like the 4th of july....wow...guess it depends on who is on radio po-po duty....

it also depends on who the member is thats asking the question as to how badly they get flamed or if they get flamed at all.

 

[wa1emt]

oh...well would you like to pm me and let me know what i did to you..which i know was nothing....

 

[James_Bond_007]

I sure long for the good ol days of batlabs back in the mid to late 90's when you had truly knowledgeable people like "elroy" who dispensed pure unbiased tech advice and not unsolicited legal advice and on the rare occasions that he did flame someone he did it with such comical flare that you were ROTFL for hours over it.

 

[kb0uxv]

its funny how this guy asks the same question i did a while back..he gets flame kissed and i got lit up like the 4th of july....wow...guess it depends on who is on radio po-po duty....

Perhaps the difference is do to the tone of the posts.

 

[bezking]

It really just has to do with the fact that I haven't checked on this thread until now. :lol:

Now, to all of you, for the millionth time, please READ THE ENTIRE THREAD to make sure you aren't posting/asking something that's already been discussed. Thanks!

 

[wa1emt]

Just checked the tone.....wow..same tone...polite and nice...but thanks for asking...

 

[SCPD]

Now, to all of you, for the millionth time, please READ THE ENTIRE THREAD to make sure you aren't posting/asking something that's already been discussed. Thanks!

...which is why this thread should be closed. There is nothing meaningful left to add. It's all been said. As I said before, each ttime this thread becomes active, I hope to see new information...instead it's more of the same old crap. Everyone responds in innuendo and speculation, such as "sure, I've done it" but informative posts such as discussion of creating system keys, inhibiting transmit, and the like are are non-existent or buried in troll/flame/safp garbage or against RR Rules.

This thread is a wasteland.

 

[bezking]

Yeah, I've really wanted to hold out on that, but I think the time has come.