Something to think about

[Rt169Radio]

Both Ham radio and GMRS are fun radio options, they both have their place and benefits.

 

[Project25_MASTR]

There are quite a few reasons to have both. Technically you can't conduct business over amateur radio (ordering a pizza and selling equipment to another ham are some exceptions) or use it to conduct business. Business can be conducted over GMRS provided all stations have the proper licensing.

Now this is great if your say…a family owned and operated business in an area where cell phone use is just impractical and it is not financially suitable to purchase a Part 90 license (Farming, ranching, and other small businesses). Also is great for hunting amongst said family members.

Another good option is say…your starting up a small company that does ubiquity setup/installation as well as some minor tower work. Even though all members are hams, can't do business over ham bands. Now if 2 out of 3 of the employees have GMRS licenses (and repeaters) already, it's not a big deal if the company pays for the unlicensed member's license.

I personally got my license for the first reason, the second reason is another little side business I'm getting into.

 

[Project25_MASTR]

Great option for small, family owned/operated businesses since business may not be conducted over ham bands but it may over GMRS providing all stations are properly licensed. (Farms, ranches, etc.)

Also good for a small business where 2 out of the 3 employees already have GMRS licenses and repeaters. Not a big deal for the business to pay for the 3rd's license.

It's really not that expensive. As a ham, I'm finding I'd rather have Part 90 radios for use on ham bands (simpler, idiot proof if you will) versus my Part 97 stuff. A few months back, a bunch of good, Part 90 radios became door stops for anyone but hams/GMRS depending on the radios. Some of these radios can be picked up for little to no money…assuming of course you have the DOS based software many of them run to program with.

 

[dksac2]

At least when scanning the Ham freqs I have in my radios, I don't hear kids singing and making fart noises into the radio like I hear on GMRS every day. Ham is the way to go. Don't get rid of your GMRS, but when it won't work for you, you will wish you had Ham radio.
If you are not a mature person, do stick with the GMRS. Lots of GMRS operators are mature, but the kids and big kids who should know better make it seem more like CB everyday.

John

 

[jeepsandradios]

I have to agree, yet also disagree. My case in point. I am a ham as is my wife. We are not active on the radio but use it ocasionally. Both of us are in SAR and use commercial PS frequencies alot, so other than simplex we dont use the ham stuff. Before our SAR team was fortunate enough to get grants for good equipment i started a GMRS network in our county so team members could get the GMRS and be done with it. We currently have 4 GMRS repeaters in 2 counties. These are rarely used for SAR stuff and mostly chit chat between a few of us that still have our UHF mobiles. My parents recently got there GMRS licence as we do alot of camping and the FRS just wasn't cutting it. I actually have a small UHF GMRS repeater in my 5th wheel and normally we can cover an entire campground, if not the whole town we are in !

Back to SAR I encourage every one of my folks to get the HAM ticket and we have 7 or 8 that have passed the Tech and even a couple who went thru all of them. We use HAM as a backup to public safety comms and again rarely use it for SAR work.

I guess it really depends on what you are doing and where you plan to go. I got my GMRS as a stepping stone to bigger and better !

 

[dksac2]

I have to agree, yet also disagree. My case in point. I am a ham as is my wife. We are not active on the radio but use it ocasionally. Both of us are in SAR and use commercial PS frequencies alot, so other than simplex we dont use the ham stuff. Before our SAR team was fortunate enough to get grants for good equipment i started a GMRS network in our county so team members could get the GMRS and be done with it. We currently have 4 GMRS repeaters in 2 counties. These are rarely used for SAR stuff and mostly chit chat between a few of us that still have our UHF mobiles. My parents recently got there GMRS licence as we do alot of camping and the FRS just wasn't cutting it. I actually have a small UHF GMRS repeater in my 5th wheel and normally we can cover an entire campground, if not the whole town we are in !

Back to SAR I encourage every one of my folks to get the HAM ticket and we have 7 or 8 that have passed the Tech and even a couple who went thru all of them. We use HAM as a backup to public safety comms and again rarely use it for SAR work.

I guess it really depends on what you are doing and where you plan to go. I got my GMRS as a stepping stone to bigger and better !

I agree with your use of the GMRS and do think that having a Ham and GMRS license is a smart thing to do. Also joining SAR ect is the best way to help in the case of an emergency.
My primary use for GMRS is to monitor a group who uses it for emergency's. The LDS church in the area is pushing their members to get their licenses and higher power equipment to use if necessary. We also have two very good GMRS repeaters on a 7000' mountain that gives fantastic area coverage.
That being said, I stick mostly with Ham radio. Far more repeaters and coverage.
I'm in Ares and help others with any legal form of radio.

My Best, John

 

[Project25_MASTR]

I agree with your use of the GMRS and do think that having a Ham and GMRS license is a smart thing to do. Also joining SAR ect is the best way to help in the case of an emergency.
My primary use for GMRS is to monitor a group who uses it for emergency's. The LDS church in the area is pushing their members to get their licenses and higher power equipment to use if necessary. We also have two very good GMRS repeaters on a 7000' mountain that gives fantastic area coverage.
That being said, I stick mostly with Ham radio. Far more repeaters and coverage.
I'm in Ares and help others with any legal form of radio.

My Best, John

Lubbock is a similar deal. We have both ham repeaters (which your unlikely to hear anything unless you catch a weekly net, or find one of the two linked repeaters) and GMRS repeaters. The GMRS repeaters get far more use. Reason being, those of us who put them up have both our ham and GMRS licenses and are the only ones really wandering around during the day so we use them, a lot. We also see it as a way to get others interested in radio comms in general since $85 covers your family and there is no test. Most "downgrade" if you will, from ham to GMRS so they can get their family on radios since 98% of the time the rest of the family doesn't want to take a test.

Since there are people that don't want to take a test but don't mind paying the extra $70 for the license, the Sheriff's Office Emergency Management Coordinator came to us and asked if we could try putting some GMRS repeaters up. So far we have 4.5 running in the county. 1 on .675 (standard PL) running 50W out of the cans on the tallest building for 120 miles, 3 closed repeaters running 15W or less around the city, and then my (which is the half) portable repeater that isn't running but is ready to go.

 

[Logan005]

Good thing I'm not a dad, just like they have to go to school and do chores, taking out the trash and such I would require my kids to study for and take the test, until they passed. and that's that.

 

[dksac2]

Are you trying to say that too many kids are lazy today and that parents don't hold their feet to the fire anymore ???

Your right on. The Technician test is easy and for less than the price of a GMRS license, you can have your ham ticket and radio.

GMRS is the easy way out, nothing to do but spend money and talk. On second thought, maybe I'd rather not have someone who was forced to get a license on Ham radio, maybe they will be better off on GMRS.

I think people should have both, as both will be very useful in an emergency. I'd rather see people who very much want to learn about radio on the Ham frequencies, I've copied too much foul language and kids, both young and old on GMRS. When it gets to be too much, I just turn the GMRS off and listen to the Ham Band. Besides, no one on the GMRS band has ever offered to help with radio knowledge or projects while many have given me help on the Ham band. Also, 99.9% of people on ham radio have a license, I'd bet less than 30% of GMRS users do.
CB started off much as GMRS is today, lets see where it goes.

I fear that in any real emergency, the GMRS band will be un usable do to the majority who use it don't know how an emergency net works and a great deal of them will be on at one time. With one or two GMRS repeaters and no discipline, it could be a real mess.
If the emergency coordinator in your area is asking people to put up GMRS repeaters, I sure hope he is running weekly nets to try and educate the public on proper use, something a Ham must learn to get his or her license.

73's John

 

[Logan005]

Are you trying to say that too many kids are lazy today and that parents don't hold their feet to the fire anymore ???

Your right on. The Technician test is easy and for less than the price of a GMRS license, you can have your ham ticket and radio.

GMRS is the easy way out, nothing to do but spend money and talk. On second thought, maybe I'd rather not have someone who was forced to get a license on Ham radio, maybe they will be better off on GMRS.

I think people should have both, as both will be very useful in an emergency. I'd rather see people who very much want to learn about radio on the Ham frequencies, I've copied too much foul language and kids, both young and old on GMRS. When it gets to be too much, I just turn the GMRS off and listen to the Ham Band. Besides, no one on the GMRS band has ever offered to help with radio knowledge or projects while many have given me help on the Ham band. Also, 99.9% of people on ham radio have a license, I'd bet less than 30% of GMRS users do.
CB started off much as GMRS is today, lets see where it goes.

I fear that in any real emergency, the GMRS band will be un usable do to the majority who use it don't know how an emergency net works and a great deal of them will be on at one time. With one or two GMRS repeaters and no discipline, it could be a real mess.
If the emergency coordinator in your area is asking people to put up GMRS repeaters, I sure hope he is running weekly nets to try and educate the public on proper use, something a Ham must learn to get his or her license.

73's John

I agree with you 90% John. However I believe a child required to obtain his/her HAM cert. would either season into an exceptional adult radio operator or chose not to participate at all. Therefore it would be unlikely you would have to communicate with an adult that was forced as a child, unless he/she adopted the hobby, and if you did, I doubt you would know it unless they told you. Oh and I forgot, I have found a few GMRS operators to be helpful, and at a very high percentage compared to the lack of licensed users in my area. But I agree, If you need real help, call out for a HAM.

 

[N4KVE]

Are you trying to say that too many kids are lazy today and that parents don't hold their feet to the fire anymore ???

1000%. The only exercise kids get today is their thumbs on whatever electronic device they carry. When I was a kid, we played hockey every day after school until supper was on the table. Also kids are now driving to school, but we all walked to school. Look how fat kids are today, vs years ago. Today, kids don't even know how to write in script. They can only print. And the parents allow this. If that Rachel Jeantel gal is the future of our country, well I'm glad I won't be around to see it.

 

[Logan005]

1000%. The only exercise kids get today is their thumbs on whatever electronic device they carry. When I was a kid, we played hockey every day after school until supper was on the table. Also kids are now driving to school, but we all walked to school. Look how fat kids are today, vs years ago. Today, kids don't even know how to write in script. They can only print. And the parents allow this. If that Rachel Jeantel gal is the future of our country, well I'm glad I won't be around to see it.

Well I did get to drive to school as a kid, and I was lucky it wasn't a farm tractor. But I had to milk a cow every other morning before school and worked till dark tending animals, setting fence post, cutting firewood, weeding the garden and canning fruits and vegetables. we had little time for sports or homework. I agree 1000% we got some serious problem with a lack of work ethic among our young. These kids can not compete with Asian kids. and we will lose.

Now back to GMRS:
the FCC should set 6 channels in the 220mhz band for the GMRS service, this would open up cross band repeat. and all new GMRS radio sales require you prove license or buy the license on the spot. just like a gift card with a UPC bar code on it. you log into ULS and get your call letters. All new FRS radios sold to "just anyone" will be FRS only, no GMRS freq's. Keep the fee the way it is. and include a provision that includes Gay and lesbian life partners under GMRS family rule. current rule requires them to purchase separate license's Keep repeaters the way they are and allow digital and phone patch. and set a standard for Emergency communications. The FCC should encourage participation rather than allow GMRS to become just another Citizens Band.

 

[dksac2]

Well I did get to drive to school as a kid, and I was lucky it wasn't a farm tractor. But I had to milk a cow every other morning before school and worked till dark tending animals, setting fence post, cutting firewood, weeding the garden and canning fruits and vegetables. we had little time for sports or homework. I agree 1000% we got some serious problem with a lack of work ethic among our young. These kids can not compete with Asian kids. and we will lose.

Now back to GMRS:
the FCC should set 6 channels in the 220mhz band for the GMRS service, this would open up cross band repeat. and all new GMRS radio sales require you prove license or buy the license on the spot. just like a gift card with a UPC bar code on it. you log into ULS and get your call letters. All new FRS radios sold to "just anyone" will be FRS only, no GMRS freq's. Keep the fee the way it is. and include a provision that includes Gay and lesbian life partners under GMRS family rule. current rule requires them to purchase separate license's Keep repeaters the way they are and allow digital and phone patch. and set a standard for Emergency communications. The FCC should encourage participation rather than allow GMRS to become just another Citizens Band.

That just might work. The very first thing that should be done is to do away with the FRS/GMRS radios and only sell one or the other as a separate radio. Letting both FRS and GMRS in one radio was a major mistake right from the get go.

I bought one of my daughters a VHF/UHF radio for her Birthday. She was pretty excited and wants to get her license soon. I thought it was a good incentive.
Not a bad way to get a kid into radio. I even got my 8 year old grandaughter a set of FRS only radios that look like kitty kat's. She loves them and enjoys playing "Radio" with me and her dad.
My son just got a Shortwave receiver and is enjoying listening to many broadcasts. He lives a ways away, I'm working on him to get his Technician license soon, maybe I'll just buy him a radio also. Unlike a lot of kids, he works from sun up to sunset in his own business and makes more money than I ever thought of.

If you start the boys in radio young, maybe Shortwave etc. and let them develop an interest and share your love of radio with them, good chance they may just get a ham ticket. The girls, I like to push the idea of safety. Lets face it, cell phones usually don't work when you really need them to and there is a very good chance that a ham repeater will be close enough if needed, it's a great reason for the girls to get licensed. None of the girls in my family are prissy, so that's a good thing. Pretty as can be and cowgirls !

If the kids don't want to get into radio, best not to force them, but we can also let them see the fun and advantages. If they start with GMRS, I guess that's OK, but I would encourage them to go for their ham licenses also.

In the mean time, I guess we just sit back and see what happens with GMRS. It will either work somewhat or become the new CB, only time will tell. It's up to us to try and educate GMRS users the right way of doing things, just helping them put up a good antenna is a good way to get to know them and have some positive influence. It has worked for me and I have got several to take the next step and get their technician license. If they are responsible, I'll suggest it, if they are an idiot, I just keep my mouth shut.

73's John

 

[dksac2]

1000%. The only exercise kids get today is their thumbs on whatever electronic device they carry. When I was a kid, we played hockey every day after school until supper was on the table. Also kids are now driving to school, but we all walked to school. Look how fat kids are today, vs years ago. Today, kids don't even know how to write in script. They can only print. And the parents allow this. If that Rachel Jeantel gal is the future of our country, well I'm glad I won't be around to see it.

I couldn't agree more.
I guess I'm tired of hearing people complain about having to take a test. Kids today can use computers far better than most adults and play complicated video games like ringin a bell, I have no doubt that they could easily get a license.
It comes down to being lazy. Why should I have to take a test when I can just pay $85.00 and be legal on GMRS or not even bother to get a license at all.
The answer is that Amateur radio if far better than GMRS and anything worth having is worth doing right and the test is an easy one. True, you might have to spend up to 8 hours to study so you can pass the test, but for many, that is just too much to ask I guess.
I guess I'm just beating a dead horse. Thing is, there is only so much bandwidth available and there are many who want their piece of it. When people don't follow rules and just give the FCC the finger, sooner or later, they will take away the bandwidth and give it to some company with commercials like "I've fallen and I can't get up"
Lack of available bandwidth is why there is narrow banding going on. It won't be too long until even the narrow banding is not enough, then you will see things like GMRS go away and their space in the bandwidth given to some big company with money, and money is what talks today.
This is why Hams are so protective of it's bandwidth and follow the rules. We want to keep what we have and the only way to do that is to be responsible and use the service to help others as well as ragchew.
CB has found a new area and it's called GMRS. My appoligies to those who use GMRS the right way.
I'd like to invite those who do to come over to Ham radio. We need more good people. The "Good Buddy" crowd can stay on GMRS until the government takes it away or restricts it to being next to useless (which they are working on now) and then go after those who miss use what is left. Those $4000.00 to $7000.00 fines add up to some good money for the FCC.
I'd like to invite those who really want to do it right to get their amateur license. You will be amazed at just how much more you can do with it than just talk with your neighbor. You sure cannot make an antenna for under $50.00 and use a $50.00 handheld radio and talk to the space station on GMRS, and that's just one small thing, we have a lot of fun on the bands. It's worth doing and the price is right.

73's John KF7VXA

 

[robertmac]

And I find there is lack of discipline in just about everything from operating a motor vehicle, eating in a restaurant, even walking down a sidewalk has become a dangerous occupation with people in their own little undisciplined world.

 

[dksac2]

And I find there is lack of discipline in just about everything from operating a motor vehicle, eating in a restaurant, even walking down a sidewalk has become a dangerous occupation with people in their own little undisciplined world.

True, but at least where I live, there is a huge big difference in maturity and operating skill between the GMRS and Ham. Ham wins, no question. You will always have idiots where ever you go, but far less on Ham and you are also missing the point that Ham just works so much better, it's easy to stay legal and there is so much more you can do with Ham and everything made for Ham.
Then look at the proposed changes to GMRS from the FCC, they will most likely happen in a few years. Have fun with 2 watts on a 20 foot antenna.

GMRS has been around for quite a while. Nothing much happened for years with it with it until the narrow banding let lose a bunch of 25 and 45 watt radios dirt cheep. Then people took notice of what they could do with the extra power. The FCC is not happy. Why, because there are almost no legal high power stations, very few have bothered to get a license and when they look into the future, all they see is another CB mess. The FCC regs on GMRS are also anything but clear, another reason they want to get rid of any power in GMRS. The business radios are part 90 radios, GMRS requires part 95 radios. I know of no legal part 95 radios except the 4 watt handheld from Powerworx. The FCC does tend to look the other way at the part 90 radios for now, but could fine a person if they chose to for using one on GMRS. If the rules change, you will see enforcement because higher power radios will interfere with whoever the FCC gives the bandwidth to, and they will be giving it to another service after the rules have changed..
The FCC wants bandwidth and most of all money. GMRS does not have any big lobby group to fight the proposed changes, just one radio magazine. I'm pretty sure you will see the changes come through. Then you can look at the hundreds of dollars spent on repeaters and more expensive home bases and watch it be worth nothing. GMRS is not amateur radio, so you do not have the backing of the radio groups with real power and high paid lobbists.
GMRS does have some very good people on the bands, but far more idiots than Ham radio has. Ham is pretty much self regulating, GMRS is not.
I'm also tired of the excuse of the FCC Ham test. It's about as easy as can be. All questions and answers are found on the net and in study books exactly as they are on the tests. You only need to get 28 of 35 questions to pass, and if you don't, they will give you a different test to take. I studied one afternoon and aced the test, it's an easy one, mostly rules to remember. I know that 98% of you guys and gals are smart enough to pass it first time. It costs $15.00, one time, then is good for 10 years and it will never cost another cent. No test to renew your license.
Lastly, your missing out one a lot of fun. So much more can be done with ham.

73's John KF7VXA

 

[Darth_vader]

Well, about the only real advantage HAM presently has over GMRS is the price tag. $15 for a decade's worth of basically talking to yourself on the radio is a far better deal than $85 for the same thing.

 

[dksac2]

Well, about the only real advantage HAM presently has over GMRS is the price tag. $15 for a decade's worth of basically talking to yourself on the radio is a far better deal than $85 for the same thing.

Well then, maybe you had just best stick with GMRS, if no one wants to talk to you on that band, there must be a reason and since you've already spent $85.00 for your GMRS license, no use and taking a test, spending $14.00 and going to a new service where nobody will talk to you either.
Maybe it's where you live, meatspace ????

John KF7VXA

 

[WB4CS]

Darth, it's probably just that no one wants to talk to you.

Here in my neck of the country the amateur bands are very active, especially 2 meters. I'm not sure what it's like in your area, but surely there's some activity somewhere. If you are on HF and still no one will talk to you - you're doing something wrong.

GMRS as it stands now does have a place and purpose. GMRS isn't a radio service that you go to meet new people to talk to on the radio, that's what amateur radio is for. GMRS is for contacting people you already know, such as keeping in touch with family members.

I am also curious to know how the FCC will manage GMRS in the future. History seems to repeat itself, GMRS seems to be going the way of CB circa 1970s. However, I see an opportunity here to replace the 27MHz CB service and bring it into the 21st century. I know it would suck for GMRS repeater owners, but I personally wouldn't mind if GMRS became license free.

 

[Darth_vader]

No, it's because there's little to no activity on those bands, period.

The comments from "hamhocks" about "GMRS turning into CB" are really based in religious fantasy, since they all fail to take into account that just because it's subject to ab/use in one part of the country doesn't mean it's that way everywhere. Here you can key up on 20/675, repeater AND/OR PL or not until the cows come home and you'd be doing good to get a reply. If anything I'd be concerned more about FRS turning into that sort of service, but it really can't, at least not on as large a scale. (The power limits and the crappy radios supplied--and yes, unlike a Baofeng [bo-FUNG], a lot of them truly ARE crappy--are basically preventing that from happening.) Oh yeah, and unlike GMRS, FRS around here usually has a LOT of activity. The fact that I live near a major city park probably is a factor therein.

Now, scan up and down the HAM bands next time you're driving through my area. Sometimes you'll get a reply, most of the time you won't. Usually if you do get a reply it's likely to be some nasty, hateful old W7AIA crank who'd, well, you already know about that, since I've been over that with you people lots of times before, so I'm not going to reiterate it here.

Bottom line, about the only real advantage HAM presently has over GMRS is the price tag. $15 for a decade's worth of basically talking to nobody on the radio is a far better deal than $85 for half a decade of the same thing.

But, ignorance being bliss, you generally don't agree with anything else I write and with the general attitude being that everything you say is the gospel truth you'll undoubtedly disagree with this, even if you don't ignore it completely, so I'll stop wasting my time. Life's too short to spend trying to make the blind see.